erhodes

I've searched this forum but can't find any early discussion of the audio on the Art Blakey 1960 Mosaic. I have the lp's and they've always seemed virtually mono. There was some discussion of this on rec.music.bluenote when the set first came out and, IIRC, it was inconclusive. Someone contacted Mosaic and they responded that the set was made from the Blue Note stereo masters. I have none of the original Blue Notes but my experience is that the BN/RVG stereo is fairly pronounced. It is certainly that way on my copy of "Free for All". Can anyone comment? I would even be interested in comments on the cd's. Does anyone have a copy of this set with pronounced stereo separation, particularly the lp version?

This is not a Savoy session, though the disoographies all seem to list it that way. It was recorded at Jerry Newman's studio and I believe Izenson produced it. Mike is right that the date is unclear though the logic of January '64 is a bit stronger that of January '63. I've seen the tape box and it does say '63. I've also heard the master and there is no prominent hiss. As to why there is no imminent commercial release... #1, I believe Izenson's estate has the right to this and other sessions that he supervised at Newman's. I've not heard anything about this in years but when I did hear something the matter was...unresolved. #2, There's not enough music on this tape to fill an lp, let alone a cd. #3, As Mike pointed out, the music is fragmentary, though there are 4-5 relatively complete takes. These are short, though...generally 3 minutes each or thereabouts. The session appears to be an early stab at the "suite" format that Cherry used for "Togetherness", "Complete Communion", and "Symphony for Improvisers". At least one of the tracks appears on "Togetherness". The pieces may have been designed to be edited together but the material I have heard is insufficient, not only in quantity but in some of the details, e.g., transitions and such.

This is the one.

In this regard, the following old posts from the coltrane-l listserv might be of interest. Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:25:53 +0000 There do exist complete video films of Naima and Blue Waltz from Antibes 65. A video tape containing this material has been sold in France around 1992 and a CDV was available in Japan a few years ago. The quality of the film is very good. Some excerpts of ALS (complete Acknowledgement and the first 6 min of Resolution) and the nearly complete version of Impressions with the introductory bass solo (the piano solo is edited) also exist. But this has never been commercialy available. Alain Venditti. ...and... Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:15:22 +0100 The two concerts in Antibes 1965, were recorded for TV by the French TV Director Jean-Christophe Averty. Were they broadcasted I don't know. All this material, if it still exists, must be archived at INA (National Intitute of Audiovisual) who keeps everything taped in audio or video for state TV and radio. I was told that the tapes pf Antibes' 65 concerts have diseappered. But offical video tapes of Averty's concert recordings were published under the name JAZZ AVERTY, each cassette being named by a letter of the name. On one of them there is a short footage of Coltrane playing in Antibes. Others musicians on this video are Sidney Bechet, Claude Bolling, Don Byas. I have this video but it is in SECAM format, the french TV System format. I don't have this tape right now, so I can't give the actual informations, but Antibes video recordings really exists. Guy Reynard

Most of "Cote Blues" was recorded on July 26, the day before the material that Columbia released, but the last two tracks - "If I Were A Bell" and "So What" - are actually from July 28. Also, "Cote Blues" has only four of the eight titles (including "The Theme") recorded on July 26. OTOH, the two tracks from July 28 are the only ones that survive from that date so the cd is "complete" with regard to that concert. The original Columbia lp seems to have been released in an artificial stereo, which accounts for at least some of the sound quality issues. The "Seven Steps" box claims that the concert was recorded in mono. The complete July 26 concert is definitely on the trading circuit, though I don't have it. Ed Rhodes

The Newport date does indeed fall between the Atlantic sides and the VV. I suppose my point was that Newport has only three tracks whereas the Sutherland material takes up more than two cd's worth. A lot ore straight ahead tenor work on the Sutherland dates where you can hear Trane making the transition from what you hear on Atlantic to "Chasin' the Trane"...though maybe there's more to it than that. Dolphy did not appear with Trane at Newport, though Davis did. And it is possible that Dolphy didn't complete the VG gig because his European travel interrupted it. Ed Rhodes

Can be corrected if you have the money. Some folks here would find it hard to listen to then. I'm not aware of any pitch problems and I've checked on some but not all of the tracks against commerically issued references. There are other audio problems, though, including edits, dropouts, and widely varying frequency balance between the different sessions. There's also a 5-6 minute fragement that turns out to be the same 2-3 minute fragment repeated a second time. OTOH, the Sutherland material is the only substantial body of quartet performances between the Atlantic dates of Fall 1960 and the Village Vanguard material. It reveals some interesting things about the evolution of Coltrane's style and repertoire. Ed Rhodes

I've been lurking on this thread from the beginning...didn't have the energy to jump in...but I have a few thoughts. Would like to ask Hot Ptah first, though, if you were into Sun Ra enough to have wrote a college paper on him and if you have read Szwed, do you you still feel that this aspect of his behavior and that of members of the Arkestra need more clarification and explanation? Please take this question at face value. I can respond to you but I'd like to know if you think that Szwed, for instance, did not sufficiently explain Sun Ra in this regard. Ed Rhodes

Garrety's presence has nothing to do with replacing Dolphy. Dolphy didn't become a regular member of Trane's band until several months after the Southerland date. Garrett was a Chicago based musician in the early 60's. He said he was the one who gave Coltrane the idea of using two bass players. But, AFAIK, he was not playing bass clarinet with Trane at this time, so there is no issue of him replacing Dolphy in the front line or vice versa. Trane didn't replace Dolphy in early '62 when Dolphy left the band. A lot of people, including Eric, sat in after that but the only other relatively permanent addition to the front line was Pharoah Sanders, who joined in late '65, more than a year after Dolphy's death. Ed Rhodes

Coltrane's chronology is being updated for the next edition of the Fujioka discography. The March dates are from Chris DeVito's research, which was published on the Coltrnae-l listserv several years ago and which supercede the dates in Porter's bio. Chris has developed a lot of new information for Coltrane's US itenerary. I would have to check the Summer-Fall dates re: what happened before the VV, something I won't be able to do for a couple of weeks. There are some issues with Dolphy's dates because of his departure for Europe. That seems to have happened in the middle of one of his club dates with Trane but I don't remember the details. I assume you mean the Monterey Jazz Festival in CA. When I get home later in August I'll try to sort out some of the dates. March 1-4 for the Sutherland seems pretty tight, though. Ed Rhodes

The recordings exist only as tapes and cdr's circulated among traders. AFAIK, none of them have been issued commerically. Also, the October date is wrong. The correct dates are March 1-4, 1961. Ed Rhodes

Can't comment on the sound quality - haven't heard this issue - but you may be able to identify the session from the list below. This was compiled from Marty Milgrim and Mike Fitzgerald. The commercial issues listed - Moon, Landscape, JazzUp, Magnetic, etc. - are old and out of date but maybe the track listings will be helpful. None of the old issues, lp or cd, had what I would call good sound but some, notably the JazzUp, were worse than others. 62-0807, NYC, East River Theater Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Bob Cranshaw (b) Billy Higgins (d) a) Star Spangled Banner b) Oleo c) St. Thomas d) Solitude Landscape LS2-915– Sonny Rollins / Live Mid 60’s, a-c 63-0115, Copenhagen, Falkonercentret Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) a) Oleo b) The Bridge c) You Don’t Know What Love Is d) Night and Day e) Without A Song f) 52nd Street Theme g) Green Dolphin Street Moon MCD 053-2, Rollins Meets Cherry, vol. 1, a-e Moon MCD 054-2, Rollins Meets Cherry, vol. 2, f, g JazzUp JU-313, Sonny Rollins Quartet In Europe 1963, vol. I, a-d JazzUp JU-314, Sonny Rollins Quartet In Europe 1963, vol. II, e-g 63-0117, Stockholm Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) a) Oleo b) Without A Song c) 52nd Street Theme d) Valse Hot Landscape LS2-915– Sonny Rollins / Live Mid 60’s, b-d 63-0119, Paris, Salle Pleyel, 1st concert Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) The Bridge Oleo You Don’t Know What Love Is 52nd Street Theme St. Thomas Valse Hot Who Cares Home Sweet Home (aka There’s No Place Like Home) Private tape 63-0119, Paris, Salle Pleyel, 2nd concert Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) a) Solitude b) Green Dolphin Street c) Without A Song d) Sonnymoon For Two e) Everything Happens To Me f) 52nd Street Theme Magnetic MRCD 101 (Lux) – Sonny Rollins Quartet / Live In Paris 1963, a-f JazzUp JU 313 (I) – Sonny Rollins Quartet In Europe 1963, vol. I, b, c JazzUp JU 314 (I) – Sonny Rollins Quartet In Europe 1963, vol. II, a Unique Jazz UJ 22 (I) – Sonny Rollins Quartet “Live” In Europe, a-d 63-0129, Rome Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) 52nd Street Theme Doxy Il Sonny* TV broadcast, private tape * Without Cherry. Add the Quartetto Di Lucca (incl. unknown p, vib, g?). 63-0129, Stuttgart Don Cherry (cor) Sonny Rollins (ts) Henry Grimes (b) Billy Higgins (d) a) 52nd Street Theme b) Green Dolphin Street c) Sonnymoon For Two / Theme d) Oleo Jazz Connoisseur JC 106 (I) – Sonny Rollins Quartet / Stuttgart 1963 Concert, a-c

This was just covered under "New Releases" or something. Haven't heard the sound though the source tape is not good. The performances are good to spectacular, the latter being a 35 minute version of "Impressions" which is quite different from the European versions recorded later the same year. The discographical information that has been shared by people knowledgeable about the release turns out to be in error. Roy Haynes is not the drummer; it's Elvin Jones. The session is not from June or July. It's August 1963. And the piece listed as "Afro Blue" is, in fact, "The Promse". Ed Rhodes

It's good but not great, IMHO. On the plus side there's a track where Lloyd takes a long inside-outside solo -- some of the best 60s playing I've heard from him. Guy I think it's better than the Impulse sides but that's admittedly because of the track Guy describes, which is titled "One Sheridan Square". I'm not a big fan of Lloyd but I think this, and his first lp as a leader , "Discovery", contain his best playing. The Reprise album is a more straight ahead album than "Passin' Thru", et al, though I say that not to convey that it is conservative but that it is more about the playing, the improvising. Jack, do you know the recording date of the Reprise? Ed Rhodes

If this is the one with Pharoah Sanders, it's not a Savoy session and it was probably recorded in January 1964. If it has Clifford Jordan and Sonny Simmons, it's a dub from a very rare, privately produced lp, also not Savoy. Ed Rhodes Is that the Zounds LP? I didn't think Pharoah was on it -- or at least Lasha never mentioned anything about him when talking about the session (late '63 in Fred Lyman's loft)... unless this is yet ANOTHER thing I have to spend my time tracking down... My usual lack of clarity, for which I apologize. I was referring to two distinct sessions, neither of which was produced by Savoy. The Cherry-Sanders date is from January 6, 1964 and features a rhythm section of Joe Sciani, David Izenson, and J.C. Moses. The other date, which is indeed the Zounds lp, is dated from May 1963 and features Sonny Simmons, Prince Lasha, and Clifford Jordan on reeds. Everything else of which I am aware and which could be dated to '63 or '64 are known sideman dates with the likes of Rollins, Ayler, or the New York Contemporary 5, though the following link, http://members.chello.se/kassman/doncherry.htm also lists an octet date with Ornette and Steve Lacy (?) from 1962. My point was that, unless there is something about which I am unaware, there is no Savoy date. My secondary point is that the Cherry-Sanders session has been dated to 1963 and this is probably an error, though that is what is scribbled on the tape box. The chronology of Cherry's activity with Rollins in '62-'63 makes 1/1/63 very unlikely. Also, FWIW, the session was recorded at Jerry Newman's studio. The above link says it was for Savoy but this is an error, too. Ed Rhodes

The following link may be of interest. http://www.organissimo.org/forum/lofiversi...php/t16180.html Ed Rhodes

If this is the one with Pharoah Sanders, it's not a Savoy session and it was probably recorded in January 1964. If it has Clifford Jordan and Sonny Simmons, it's a dub from a very rare, privately produced lp, also not Savoy. Ed Rhodes

A quartet version of "Ogunde" was recorded on March 7, 1967 and originally released on the album "Expression". It predates the version on the Olatunji concert album by about a month and a half. Ed Rhodes

Do a search for programs called "DVD Audio Ripper" and "DVD Audio Extractor". Several shareware sites have downloads for these. It'l cost you about $30. I tried a 30 day trial version of one of them and it worked fine. They actually seem to be the same program or at least use the same code. The interface is essentially the same. I was unable to find any freeware that will do this. Ed Rhodes

The following post appeared this morning on the Ellington listserv. Dear LYM'ers During a JATP-visit in Denmark Coleman Hawkins, Teddy Wilson and Ben Webster agreed with the TV-producer Sten Bramsen to play "Honeysuckle Rose". When they came to the program Bramsen "spontaneously" suggested the title, but surprisingly Hawkins grunted, "Don't know it", Webster added, "Could you whistle the tune?" and Wilson said, "I'm not familiar with the changes." How Bramsen managed the practical joke we are not told, but it is one of the anecdotes in Frank Büchmann-Møller's new biography on Ben Webster, which is strongly concentrated on the chronology of Webster's life, the gallery of characters surrounding Webster and Webster’s recordings, and strictly chronologically structured. As the publisher writes, Frank includes numerous translated excerpts from European newspapers and journals and studies of every known Webster recording. The book has no discography but the preface announces that the Ben Webster Foundation will publish a sessionography compiled by Heinz Baumeister. It will be a great support during the reading of the text. The many notes connected to the text reveal a thing or two about the sources to the text, but the reader himself will have to compile it into a bibliography, because the book has none, which is regrettable. There are no transcriptions and thus no analysis of such in the text, instead Frank draws on his extensive experience as a reviewer, which results in many impressions on the part of the writer. A biography does not only portray its main character but also its author, and we now have a great opportunity to compare our own impressions of Webster's playing with Frank Büchmann-Møller's. One of the main chapters is concerned with Webster's engagement with Ellington's orchestra. It is called "Golden Years With Ellington", but there were also a couple of things that were not golden. "In A Mellotone" is composed by Ben Webster, we can read on page 70. This is new in the Ellingtonian literature because it always credits Ellington for this. [That includes both articles on Ellington as a composer, by Erik Wiedemann. Webster was probably pretty disappointed on this and suggested his musical property right with the contrafact "Did You Call Her Today", which has so many musical features similar to "In A Mellow tone" that is it one of the more easy ones to detect.] This happened even though Webster earlier the same year had experienced Ellington's expropriation of "Cotton Tail" on which the band leader put his name after having changed the original title from "Shuckin' and Stiffin'" to "Cotton Tail". The author speculates that Webster was so disappointed by this that he stopped writing for the orchestra completely, but lacks a source to prove it. The complaints about the power relations of the jazz world in the jazz literature are many, but there are fewer discussions about the replication of this relation within the swing orchestras. In this case the author quotes Milt Hinton, who knew Webster very well, for the remark: "Well, the thing that I think bothered most of the guys that worked with the Duke was that, like all the band leaders of his generation, he took credit for everything the band did [...]." Jørgen Mathiasen, Berlin

I'm glad to hear it. Aside from the work on Sonny himself, the light you can shed in the early 60's CA (mostly Bay area?) scene where Sonny, Dewey Redman, and Pharoah all seemed to converge will be an important addition to the literature. I look forward to it.

The second horn playing the head of Ghost of the Past clearly sounds like some sort of clarinet to me (it's somewhat softer than the alto saxophone and doesn't solo - I always thought it "symbolized" the Ghost of the past echoing Simmons alto and wasn't credited to emphasize that it was not just Lasha playing but the whole past of "Bird, Chu Berry, Clifford Brown, Richie Powell, Charlie Christian - all the outstanding musicians who passed before we even were present." I love those liner notes) Whether it's a normal clarinet, a bass clarinet or the alto clarinet Lasha plays on the cover of Firebirds - I can't hear, so why not bass clarinet... Indeed. I hadn't listened to that piece in awhile. It's definitely some sort of clarinet but I have no other details and know of no discographical resource.

It's nice to see a legitimate release but the "unissued" material actually seems to be a rehash of Boris Rose dates that have been endlessly bootlegged. IMO, the issued quality has not been bad. I would be pleasantly surprised if the new Fantasy release had significantly improved sound. The link lists 5 tracks labeled "enhanced". The November 18, 1955 Steve Allen date - "Max Is Makin' Wax" and "It Never Entered My Mind" - and the December 8, 1956 Blue Note (Philadelphia) date - "Tune Up", "Walkin'" and "Four" (all of 1 second for "Four") - were both issued on Yadeon 502, one of Rose's only cd issues. The sound is a little better than the private tapes that were circulating at the time. AFAIK, the video of the Steve Allen performance was destroyed years ago (this is in Porter's chronology). The "Four", "Bye Bye Blackbird", "Walkin", and "Two Bass Hit" date is a broadcast from the Cafe Bohemia on May 17, 1958. It is not the original Davis/Coltrane quintet. Bill Evans is the pianist. Rose issued this on Chakra TH100 and, again, the sound is reasonable. This date is also on the Jazz Band lp's and cd's. I'd love to find out that Prestige has better source material for these sessions, as turned out to be the case with the Coltrane Half Note material, but I'll wait and see. The "enhanced" tracks look like they were taken from these same dates, i.e., "Max Is Makin' Wax", one of the "Walkin'" tracks, and "Four".