Tom Storer

I like that album a lot, too. Do you know Burton's 70's albums on ECM? He had a great run with Swallow and Moses, and depending on the albums, Mick Goodrick and/or Pat Metheny, and Eberhard Weber.

Not to mention some great duo records and tours with Sheila Jordan.

So basically, they're saying that Kevin Shea et al. reneged on their agreement to pony up 50 bucks, were loud, insulting, chaotic and threatening, and the "executive director" was just trying to protect himself when the unfortunate injury occurred. Not having been there, and not knowing any of the people involved, I don't know how likely this is. But I take it with large grains of salt.

WARNING: PEDANT ALERT Shouldn't that be "wish I'd said that"? This is a relatively recent trend, I think: replacing "had" with an unnecessary "would have." A typical use is "If I would have known that, I would have done such-and-such." It should be "If I had known that...". Carry on.

Larry, thanks for re-opening the thread. What I think you're not seeing is this: you wanted the thread to remain open long enough to ask your own questions of David, but once you closed it you denied anyone else the right to find the post provocative and ask questions or make remarks. A thread does not belong only to those who have already participated in it, still less to a subset who are tired of the thread; others may be lurking, others may come along afterwards, and they might have legitimate contributions they will want to make. I agree with Dan that the only good reason to close down a thread is when it has escalated into a flame war. Not a frank and bracing exchange of strongly stated criticisms, either, but a real flame war, a pointless exchange of hostility and insult. If it's just become a little silly or boring or repetitious, it will die a natural death--and might be revived weeks, months, years later with more interesting posts.

Yeah, but they bring them into the house already dead, or else in order to finish killing them. The point is that if they find mice in the house, they will kill them; and mice, smelling cat, will avoid entering. But maybe you were being tongue-in-cheek?

What thread was closed, anyway?

I don't have the same number of CDs as some of you, but enough to make storage problematic. I've decided to favor purchasing in MP3 format when possible in order to keep the problem from burgeoning in the future, and I'm toying with the idea of just ripping my CDs to FLAC, scanning the booklets and virtualizing the whole shebang. Of course that would be a long-term project, but external hard drives are reasonably priced nowadays and there are ways to hook up music file servers with one's stereo system...

I saw Pedicin in concert once, in Pat Martino's quartet. I had never heard of him and couldn't understand why (still can't)--he was outstanding. He was passionate and inventive, playing imaginative lines without relying on clichés. But I have yet to hear any music by him as leader. I'll have to pick this one up.

I've been reading this thread and seeing some rehashing of long-standing opinionation (neologism back-constructed from "opinionated") along with interesting sharing of experiences, knowledge and speculation. To become indignant because highly successful professionals come in for some bashing seems exaggerated. Marsalis and Clapton are well aware they have their detractors and I doubt very much they lose any sleep over it. Fans are fans. They don't just LIKE. They also DISLIKE and they have their own ideas about what is good and what isn't. And look what happens--there is debate and discussion. "Clapton is a copycat / That's too simple" ; "Wynton said such-and-such once / Interesting, was he thinking for himself or not?" All this helps interested readers learn more and entertain new notions--it makes us better fans, which can only serve the interests of musicians in the long run. It's funny that reactions like Joel's here (they're putting themselves on the line, how can anyone who doesn't do the same criticize them?) never arise around sports. Sports fans don't hesitate to be strongly critical of various players, managers and so on, but has anyone ever said, "You're just jealous! Go make a touchdown and then come back and tell us about it!" ? Another point for Joel: why is it OK for one musician to diss another musician? Because they're not "jealous" like fans? Debatable... in a sense they're in competition for attention, approval and cold hard cash, so their reactions might be even more suspect. Because they know what they're talking about and fans don't? Hard to see, then, why musicians would disagree among themselves if it's technical knowledge that is the arbiter of truth...

Tyshawn Sorey is one of those who angrily denounced the incident on Facebook. From the comments, it appears that many musicians are in agreement that they will not work at the place concerned. The word "boycott" was mentioned.

Why is that tired? What endeavor in art or life can get anywhere or be worth a damn without the basics? I read Burno's rant as meaning that anyone who doesn't play jazz the way he likes to hear it played is a fraud. That's what's tired. I personally love swing above all things. It has an almost mystical power, as far as I'm concerned, and it will always have a very special place in my heart, mind and body. But I really get fed up hearing jazz policemen like Mr. Burno sitting in judgment of a whole world of players who have different approaches. It isn't tired to emphasize the importance of the basics, but it's tired to be intolerant of artists trying new things. Are there jazz musicians who suck? Of course. But who is he--who is anyone, no matter how talented or accomplished--to make sweeping condemnations?

No, the board's rules as described were that members had to regularly upload "new" material, in the sense of material that had not yet been uploaded to the board. Those who produced their own were given greater access to this vile stuff. This, alas, is right, as is Leeway's post #212.

David, you posted the Facebook message in post #177. Bill requested a friend post on his Facebook account that he had fallen back into a child pornography addiction and subsequently been arrested for trafficking it. Don't you read that as Bill admitting guilt? Surely if it were not, he would have asked his friend not to post that, but an indignant refutation. No?

I like your attitude! But whereas Burno was definitely repeating the tired trope of "real jazz is swing and blues, etc.", it's hard to know, at least only from the quoted Facebook post, whether Rosenwinkel was sneering at non-mainstreamers or at mainstreamers who aren't good enough for his high standards.

Most musicians who courageously stand up to say "most jazz sucks" are careful not to offend any of their peers by naming the ones they think suck. This way all their peers can potentially agree by mentally placing themselves in the "don't suck" minority, even if they themselves were actually among those secretly targeted by the vague "it sucks" denunciation. I suspect the real aim of these "most jazz sucks" declarations is usually to indicate that "me and my friends are among the very best, unlike our rivals, who all suck." This can be either a bitter rant, like Burno's, which sounds like "I don't get no respect! I'm better than those other guys but nobody has given me a medal! It's not fair!", or a smug tweet like Rosenwinkel's, which sounds like "I am just the greatest and everyone knows it, so I can shit on everyone else from a great height." That said, I like both Burno and Rosenwinkel as musicians. Neither of them suck, except perhaps as commentators on the state of jazz.

I don't agree with either of those interpretations: neither 1) "It's because I didn't get my meds that I did a terrible thing," or 2) "In prison, because I have no meds, I want to molest children." The message said, on the one hand, that Bill is addicted to child porn, trafficked in it, and was arrested; and on the other, he suffers from post-traumatic stress syndrome caused by his Vietnam experience, can't get his meds for it in prison, and is suffering from that. Admitting to his crime is in itself commendable, although the crime is horrible. As for post-traumatic stress syndrome, it certainly exists and there is no reason I can think of to have limited compassion for it.

Pete, was that the Rahsaan Roland Kirk benefit gala that also had Sarah Vaughan & Dizzy, Count Basie, Marsh/Konitz, etc. etc.?

This is fantastic. I attended three out of four of those concerts! Didn't see Elvin Jones. After the Braxton concert a friend of mine and I snuck backstage (we were 18) and got talking with Dave Holland. I mentioned some "Early Circle" that had been released from about five years previous and Holland said, "Oh, that's old. You should listen to what's happening NOW." Then someone called him and he said, "Could you guys watch my bass?" and disappeared for a few minutes, leaving us holding his bass. I was awestruck. Seeing Nick Brignola on the street after the Ted Curson concert I went up and complimented him and asked how he spelled his name. He said, "Thanks. B-R-I-G-N-O-L-A," turned unceremoniously and walked off. (I also talked with him in later years and found him to be very warm and forthcoming.)

I would guess he meant "pink" to mean merely politely left-leaning, as Jim suggested, in other words not by real, militant conviction. If they had been "red," maybe Gennari would have had more respect for their positions.

According to copies of the indictments available on the Web, none of the people arrested have, so far, been charged with anything more than distributing illegal and, need it be said, morally reprehensible porn videos. Bill has not been charged with personally harming any child, only with helping distribute the results via this bulletin board. Which is bad enough, of course, if the charges are accurate.

The crimes as described in the press and indictments are indeed shocking. But these people are in the hands (or the sights) of the legal system now. It's up to the courts to determine guilt or innocence. Was Bill really involved and if so to what extent? It's possible that we'll never know, if media attention trails off.

I saw a New York Times cooking video on how to make perfect fried chicken, so I gave it a try for lunch. It worked! Basically you marinate chicken parts overnight in buttermilk plus whatever flavoring you like (I used red onion, garlic, chili powder and paprika), then take it out of the fridge long enough in advance for it to reach room temperature; dredge it in highly seasoned flour, then pan-fry it: five minutes covered, uncover and cook the other side six minutes, flip again and cook for five more minutes. Best fried chicken I've ever eaten, if I do say so myself. A couple of nights ago I tried another NYT video suggestion, spicy shrimp salad with mint: delicious. I'm now a big fan of New York Times cooking videos.

I was having trouble with downloads but it turned out I was using an older version of their downloader. I got the most recent version and now it's working fine. I don't know what problem you have with the search engine... I find it very useful. You can search by artist, label, album title, song title... The results include both exact matches and fuzzy matches. It's a perfectly good search engine IMHO.

That they should! I'm content to savor the memory. For three or four years, that theater, in a town adjacent to Paris, had an annual concert series with absolutely killer programming. I saw a whole bunch of stuff there, including the Mingus Big Band, led by Jimmy Knepper and featuring a saxophone section of John Handy, David Murray, Clifford Jordan and Nick Brignola. Also a Monk tentet thing with the members of Sphere, Steve Lacy, and others. Then there was a change of town government and the theater didn't get the same grant money anymore. The concerts lasted a couple more years with comparatively uninteresting programming, then disappeared. Sic transit gloria mundi.