Jump to content

BFT #21, disc one - Discussion


Big Al

Recommended Posts

First, my thanks to brownie for getting this BFT to me!

Without further ado, here are my comments:

Nice disk, Al!

Thank you! :wub:

1. A big band pastiche: witty, I guess. Moves very seamlessly into track 2--good programming!

Thank you again!

3. Gorgeous! No idea who it is, although the players sound familiar. Sumptuous tones and voicing. Here we have all the virtues of classicism: harmony, equilibrium and moderation. Beautiful!

Amen to THAT, brother!

4. Older-fashioned big band. Sounds like a hip swing-era band.

I always thought so! B-)

6. Fast-paced big band number. That sure sounds like Lester!

I'm pretty sure the tenor-player heard that throughout most of his career! ;)

9. Nice, but the rhythm section is a bit stiff. The vibes sound Burton-influenced and the piano is Silverish.

I think this is the fourth or fifth time someone has inadvertently identified the piano-player! :g

11. No idea. The drums sound like Max.

Y'know, you guys keep saying this is Max Roach playing the drums, and I may have to buy that Mosaic set. I'm just warning y'all! :g

13. I know James Brown played/plays a little organ in his stage act--could it actually be him playing? I don't think the organist is all that great, frankly, so maybe that's why! I like the guitar player, though.

Ahhhh, my trick is working! (Insert evil laugh here!!!!)

17. Aaaaah, you saved the best for last. Don't know what it is, but it sounds like Jackie McLean on alto. Lee Morgan on trumpet? Beautiful soloing, classy drummer. My favorite of the whole disk!

Blue Note did a nice thing, reissuing this album last year. One of my favorite releases (new or otherwise) from 2004!

Great guesses all around, Tom!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 170
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Track 1: It had to be Bugs & Daffy. No clue on who is performing here, but of course this track illustrates one of the most important charcteristics of music: fun!

BINGO!!!!! couw gets the theme of this disc on his first guess!!!!

Track 2: doorbells galore and more theatrical big band. does the guy on alto have a name?

His solo is one of the.... er, "main" reasons this track is on here! ;)

Track 3: I have the distinct feeling I have heard this one before. Nicely laid back on the trombone there, no guesses on that front I'm afraid, but I would put down Donald Byrd for trumpet

You are correct there! I love it when he plays/played like that!

Track 6: I gez diz iz da vice-prez with a Basie bunch. This swings like mad and lifts the spirits. The steady beat can have the same effect as caffeine, but it is more healthy.

You got THAT right!

Track 7: quite a sweet trumpet, but I wonder who the tenor is. That's one nice drive that player got goin' there. The pianist plays Basiecally sparse, but I doubt it is the Count. Very nice track one more!

Hey, that was MY gag!!! :g

Track 10: it may be because I have been listening to too much Max Roach Quintet off late, but this sure sounds like Clifford Jordan to me. Then the trumpet sure has that wavey soothing quality mr. KD puts in there. This is a VERY pretty track, I'm curious.

See my last post responding to Tom's very similar guess! CUTTITOUT, WOULDJA? :lol:

Track 11: It's that character from Harry Potter, the one with the magical eye. The self titled album in that replica series. I still wonder why nobody told the baritone that it's off and needs to readjust some. ah well, this is big fun once more and the arrangements are fantastic.

:huh:

Track 13: that's James Brown on the intro. Then there is a well hidden edit and what follows is something completely different, well not where funkiness is concerned really. It's Reuben Wilson playing Blue Mode to be precise. Big FUNKAY Fun this is :tup

I wonder whatever became of  John Manning

I don't know, but he sure digs into it, on this one. Nice catch of the edit!

Track 17: ah! as I couldn't place this right away, I have concluded it must be from that recently re-released BN date with mackie sharpening his knife on the alto and the pirate looking at us from underneath the eyepatch. checked some online sample and: yup. need to get me that one pronto.

"Mackie sharpening his knife on the alto." I love it!

Edited by Big Al
Link to comment
Share on other sites

re: #14 - Thought that might be a Stitt tenor battle. Googling leads me to shrug that it could be a date with Patterson and McPherson? But only a half educated web snooping guess that has no merit for pulling it out of the hat!

Doesn't sound like any of these to me ... :huh:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This character almost looks like our ex-chancellor Kohl might have, had he been closer to the tsunami ...

Yes, but at his current size he would have just floated until someone had fished him out of the water. Lots of people could have just used him as a life raft. Could have been his claim to fame.

Cheers!

P.S.: I remember someone writing on one of the major news sites if they didn't have better and more important stuff to do when the news broke that he had been air-lifted out of the hotel.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry to be so late. My workputer is very freaky about CDRs, and this one REALLY freaked it out, which meant listening at home, which with the hollidays and stuff meant hardly at all. Anyway, better late than never, even if it means posting and getting my first full, uninterrupted listen at the same time, which is what's going to happen right now.

The usual thanks and disclaimers apply.

TRACK ONE - Thought it was a really wack Spike Jones cut until the dulcet ducktones entered... Gotta love the absurdist elements of the writing. Wonder what it was like to play that stuff at the time? Wonder what kind of a conductor Stallings was, how he gave instructions as to interpretation? The mind reels, it does...

TRACK TWO - The whole cheerleader + vibes thing suggest Terry Gibbs' big band to me, which further suggests Joe Maini as the altoist. The chart started of really nice, if a bit forced, but it lost focus as it went through the different sections/themes. That's a real peeve of mine - big band charts that get too clever for thier own good, and this was one of them afaic. Bet it was fun to hear live, though.

TRACK THREE - Everybody sounds familiar, but like I said I'm pretty unfocused right now, so I can't pin down the specifics. But that's a freakin' GORGEOUS piece of writing, especially in the bari part. Wish the drummer had have put some thought into the A-section instead of the kind of lame ching-ching-ching (a Latin-ish beat would have been cool, but not if that's not what was asked for). No matter, the writing os beautiful enough that it's ok, and once the solos get going, it's all good. Recording quality suggests early/mid-50s, so it's probably a bunch of name brands that I should guess immediately. No such luck this time. But I dug it muchly. Think I'll buy it eventually. Definitely will, in fact.

TRACK FOUR - Didn't dig this one too much, however. Whatever truth there was to the cliche that the boppers got into wahtever they got into as a rebellion against the stifling confines of Swing Bands is borne out here. Too much writing, not enough action. Tenor player sounds familiar, but the track just doesn't give enough OOMPH to make a guess an engaing proposition. Recording quality suggests a Columbia date that's had some sort of digital-age noise reduction or whatever ran on it. Losing that might have put some edge back in the music, but I kinda doubt it. Oh well.

TRACK FIVE - I do believe that that's the cleanest version of this I've ever heard. That band sounded SO good when they were tight like this (and SO good when they weren't!). God, I love Duke. Everything the previous track wasn't, this one is. Don't immediately recognize this version, but if I don't have it, I want it. A game I always play with this arrangement - WHAT chord WILL the band hit at what is here 5:03-5:04? You never know! Jeez this is the shit, right here. Beautiful, absolutely beautiful. Take me home, Jesus.

TRACK SIX - Lady Q w/Basie is my guess. Not Prez, not enough subtext. But it's a good cut. Hard to argue with anything here. Everybody's got their groove on fine and true, and that's the object of the game.

TRACK SEVEN - Concord? Sweets w/Scott Hamilton? I hear traces of Frank Wess, but not enough to convince me. I think it's Hamilton or some other some such. Nice and competent tenor, but not enough first-person quality to it for me, unless it's a really tired Frank Wess, and I don't think it is. Sweets, otoh, is totally first-person, and makes the cut for me.

TRACK EIGHT - Guaraldi seems to be in vogue on the BFTs these days, so I'll go there on this one. Nice groove, tune's a little sappy, but not enough to be a problem. Wish it were longer, although it is complete in and of itself.

TRACK NINE - Ah, music for jogging! I dig it for any number of reasons, not the least of which is the tune itself. The jogger kept stretching his tunes as he went on, and this one is no exception. The changes are SO fresh and non-cliched. VERY nice!

TRACK TEN - Through the years, this has become one of my favorite tunes. Never had the band to play it myself (other agendas, doncha know...), but someday I'm goingto put together a jazz cover band that specialises in underplayed great tunes, and this one WILL be in the book, guaranteed. The whole album's a good'un, but this is the tune I've kept coming back to. It CRIES out for lyrics. Surely somebody's done that? Another beautiful one.

TRACK ELEVEN - I'm wanting to say Moody. Kind of a cliched head, but they do good things with it. Moody rules in my book. Not alone, not by any means, but he does rule. Band's nice and tight (iffy inotnation in spots doesn't bother me, because it doesn't bother them, no "struggle" going on at all), and the scoring is cool. I might even have this. Yeah, I dig it.

TRACK TWELVE - Might be one of those Riddle MPS sides, I dunno. No matter. "Easy Listening" music of a very high calliber. Plenty attention to detail in the scoring, and lots of little nuances that tell me that the writer was really approaching it as music and not just a paycheck. Really sweet lead trumpet playing, too. This cut is just plain good. I'll take it, thanks.

TRACK THIRTEEN - "Whatsomever" is one of my favorite conversational words, especially in the middle of a "serious" conversation that you'd rather not be having. Love looking to see what, if any, reaction it gets. Ok, the tune - it gots that Van Gelder sound and everybody plays organically (no pun intended), and the guitar sounds like...HEY! I know what this is! Oh HELL yeah! The Love Bug & The Spark Plug! Whatever happened to John Manning? He sounds like he was headed in the right direction, which is what a lot of guys like him were doing in these types of groups, only they didn't get recorded. Rough, unpolished, "unsophisticated", but full of the Right Stuff, just needing an outlet to tighten it up. I hope that John Manning is still playing.

TRACK FOURTEEN - Sounds like the Sparkplug again, he's pretty identifiable. DEFINITELY hear Red Holloway as tenor #2, can NOT mistake that tone. Lemme relisten...ok, Plas Johnson & Red Holloway on Milestone. These guys ARE this style. Hell yeah.

TRACK FIFTEEN - SHAMELESSLY urban. Which is to its credit. SHAMELESSLY unsubtle. Which is also to its credit. SHAMELESSY hip changes. Which is DEFINITELY to its credit. I KNOW who that tenor player is, but damn if I can call his name right now. Which is definitely NOT to my credit...Tell you what, there's nights (and they HAVE to be nights) when, in the right club in the right neighborhood at the right hour amongst the right crowd, this is THE hippest kind of shit imaginable. Those are great times, great vibes, and this is a great slice of that thing, jazz snobbery be damned. That tenor player can PLAY his instrument, he knows how to work the thing to do what he wants it to. The horns have a Van Gelder-ish sound to them, so I'm guessing that this is some Kudu side I don't know. Seriuos listening? Hell no. Serious grooving? Hell yes. Indeed! SHAMELESSLY screaming organ, and SHAMELESSLY danceable. Which is to the credit of the human race.

TRACK SIXTEEN - You play this groove right, you're freakin' GREAT. You play it anything, I mean ANYTHING, less than right you're a schmuck. No other options and zero rome for error. This IS right. I think I have this one, but damned if I know what it is. Lessee...Grant... oh shit, yeah I know what this is. God bless Harold Vick and the rest of these guys too. Lord knows they've blessed us. Spiffy Diffy indeed!

TRACK SEVENTEEN - Took me no time to identify most of the players, but took me a little longer to figure out where they came toghether and why I didn't immediately recognize the tune. But it finally did, and that fdoes it - I'm buying this one ASAP. Geez, I could listen to Billy play like this for the rest of my life (and I probably will). so simple, yet so deep, so natural, so reflexive, so totally in the flow of life, so damn MUSICAL. God bless Billy Higgins. Interesting to hear Lee & JAckie play on this "happy" of a tune from a time when such sunniness was not necessarily the first ingredient on their respective recipies. Wilson gets a GOOD flow going. I've never heard this album, but that will soon be remedied...

Good stuff, Al. Wish I'd had better opportunities to listen closer ond frequenter, but hey, several purchse will ensue, so it's all good. Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5. Ellingtonianish... yes... I know this theme... just not by name  :rolleyes:  Ah... now the band kicks in... "rockin' in rhythm"?  5 stars!

NOBODY'S identified this yet? Heck, I thought this would've been the easiest track on the disc! Am I the only one who bought this last year (2004)?

You're absolutely right, should be easy to guess, as we probably all bought this and the other two reissues, and filed them away as we thought we knew them ....

track 3 from this CD! :rolleyes::tup I find the combination of these two tunes is work of genius, like all of this man's work.

Oh shit...

I've had the album since ca. 1977 AND bought the CD last year and STILL didn't recognize this particualr version.

That's just wrong...

(BTW, the medley became S.O.P. for the duration)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've delayed long enough! Sorry, Al, for the slow response (did you get my PM re: the bonus disc?) but these pre- and post-holiday weeks have been killer.

This was a pretty terrific disc overall. All the tunes were at least nice, some great, but I think it was a bit too "safe" for my tastes so only a few tracks really stood out to me as something I need to hear more of. On the other hand, I didn't dislike any of them. ;) These were very tough for me to identify, though I'm sure I'll be kicking myself when all is said and done. So without further ado, and not having read any part of this thread (or AMG)...

1 Carl Stalling! Nice start to remind us that jazz can be fun…

2 I should know the name of this tune, but… Nice version! But no clue as to players. Sounds fairly modern though.

3 This sounds familiar too. Very lush arrangement, almost like the theme from some 1940’s flick… Too slick for Ellington, but the influence is there…

4 Some vintage stuff! Nice, but no clue.

5 Rockin’ n Rhythm. Ellington. Nice arrangement – I like the sparser opening, then the full band comes in.

6 More Ellington, though I forget the name of this one.

7 No clue.

8 Nice Latin flavor to this one…

9 Another familiar tune. I think I have this one. Is this from one of the Hutcherson-Hancock albums?

10 Love the sax!

11 Golson’s “Blues March?” Don’t know this version with the flute. I’m sure I could look it up… ;)

12 Nice, but also a bit too film music-y.

13 Was that JB speaking in the intro? Organ’s okay, but I love that guitar!

14 Sounds like Richie Cole and some dude at the skating rink! :D How can one not like this even if you can’t take it too “seriously?”

15 No clue…

16 Tune sounds a bit familiar, or maybe just the opening vamp. Good, not great…

17 This sounds very familiar – I was listening to another version of this just a few weeks ago. I’m thinking it’s Booker Ervin’s “Scootchy” or whatever it’s called; that or I’m getting my tunes mixed up (which is likely!). A great tune and one of my favorites on this disc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well I knew I recognized tr 17 - I've had it as a JRVG for several years now, but haven't listened to it in ages. Don't know how I got the Booker tune mixed up with it. Oddly enough, I remember not really carring about this album all that much, but this tune is really terrific. Gonna have to pull it out and give it a spin.

Hey Al, you're not the only one who picked up that Ellington album either. It's a recent favorite of mine, though I've only spun it a few times. There are just so many damn versions of that tune that I didn't want to hazard a guess. ;)

Hmm. I have 16 on CD - it was actually my very first album by the leader (bought as an old BN cassette in the 80s) but didn't recognize it here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Track 13: ...I wonder whatever became of John Manning

They say that great minds think alike.

So how the hell did WE both end up asking this question? :g:g:g

Now as for #3, finding out what it is through reading here, ok, I've got that album, just haven't listened to it all that much. That will be remedied. But my comments about the drummer deing kind of dull on the head makes sense now. A few years ago, a good friend from the the board sent me a copy of a Japanese CD that contains a bunch of alternate takes from this session, replete w/studio chatter, and it clearly reveals that Blakey was NOT ready for the date. Retake after retake, mainly due to his not picking up the kicks and stuff like that. So it makes sense that he'd just do a ching-ching-ching. Very safe, hard to screw THAT up. It's funny really.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now as for #3, finding out what it is through reading here, ok, I've got that album, just haven't listened to it all that much. That will be remedied.

Ah, isn't it a beautiful thing when you're sitting there with piles of relatively recently-acquired recordings (the post-holiday GLUT) that you haven't even played yet, and some schmuck ;) sends you a BFT disc to listen to, and there's this very lovely tune that makes you go "I need to get that", and then you realize that you've had it in some form for a period of time beyond which an accurate measurement can be made, and then you HAVE to pull it out and play it four times while that pile of discs continues to gather dust and make you feel all anxious?

I guess that was a run-on sentence...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now as for #3, finding out what it is through reading here, ok, I've got that album, just haven't listened to it all that much. That will be remedied. But my comments about the drummer deing kind of dull on the head makes sense now. A few years ago, a good friend from the the board sent me a copy of a Japanese CD that contains a bunch of alternate takes from this session, replete w/studio chatter, and it clearly reveals that Blakey was NOT ready for the date. Retake after retake, mainly due to his not picking up the kicks and stuff like that. So it makes sense that he'd just do a ching-ching-ching. Very safe, hard to screw THAT up. It's funny really.

That's Blakey? The disc I have sez it's Philly Joe! If it's Blakey, then I've inadvertently included my all-time favorite drummer, when I was actually going out of my way not to! I figured everyone would know Blakey!

This also means I gotta re-write my answer for this tune! :wacko::g

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm tired and about to hit the hay, but wanted to thank JSngry & RDK for their comments, and promise a play-by-play commentary sometime in the next few days.

And congrats to Sangrey for being the first to nail track 14! Figures a helluva tenor sax player would be able to identify BOTH tenor-men on that date!

I guess this means everything on this disc has been identified. Surprised it took this long! :g

I'm almost done typing up the answers for the Christmas BFT, and once those are done, both sets of answers will be posted simultaneously.

Thanks again, all.

P.S. Where the heck is catesta, anyway?!?!?! :w:P:g

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now as for #3, finding out what it is through reading here, ok, I've got that album, just haven't listened to it all that much. That will be remedied. But my comments about the drummer deing kind of dull on the head makes sense now. A few years ago, a good friend from the the board sent me a copy of a Japanese CD that contains a bunch of alternate takes from this session, replete w/studio chatter, and it clearly reveals that Blakey was NOT ready for the date. Retake after retake, mainly due to his not picking up the kicks and stuff like that. So it makes sense that he'd just do a ching-ching-ching. Very safe, hard to screw THAT up. It's funny really.

Blakey? According to the liner of my CD it was Philly Joe Jones who played that track (Ed Thigpen did the others). :huh:

p.s. Only after posting I noticed Big Al already corrected this. Jim, you seem to refer to that reissue under Coltrane's name with the Blakey stuff on Bethlehem included.

Edited by mikeweil
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, ok then. Yeah, I got this on a 2-CD Bethlehem thing w/liner notes I've never read. So that's Philly, eh? Great larger ensemble drummer from the few times I've heard him do it. Still wish that he would have done something different on the opening. But them's the breaks. Great cut anyway!

So that's what #4 is, eh? Early 40s, right? When Eddie Sauter & Mel Powell were writing all those great charts for the band? Thought that it might be a Sy Oliver thing, what with those "Yes Indeed" type handclaps and stuff, but research shows it to be by Richard Maltby, he of the 1950s Ray Anthony-esque dance band sides. Seems it was a hit in it's day! Still don't dig it, but the history is illuminating as to why not. This was no doubt a commercial "antidote" to all the "art" charts... :g

GOTTA get those Jack Wilson & McDuff sides. And #12 has me very curious....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry to be so late. My workputer is very freaky about CDRs, and this one REALLY freaked it out,

Man, I’m sorry to hear about that! :(

TRACK ONE - Wonder what kind of a conductor Stallings was, how he gave instructions as to interpretation? The mind reels, it does...

According to the liner notes of The Carl Stalling Project, he actually wrote this stuff out!!! Now THAT takes no small amount of genius!

TRACK TWO - Bet it was fun to hear live, though.

You know it! How I wish I could go back in time to have seen THESE guys!!!

TRACK FOUR - Recording quality suggests a Columbia date that's had some sort of digital-age noise reduction or whatever ran on it.

That’s correct. This is from a 1989 CD that, were it to be upgraded, I still might keep the old version. Too many good memories attached, y’know? Your research provided the correct arranger, who I’ll elaborate on more in my answers!

TRACK FIVE - Jeez this is the shit, right here. Beautiful, absolutely beautiful. Take me home, Jesus.

Couldn’t’ve said it better! :excited:

TRACK EIGHT - Guaraldi seems to be in vogue on the BFTs these days, so I'll go there on this one. Nice groove, tune's a little sappy, but not enough to be a problem. Wish it were longer, although it is complete in and of itself.

Hehehe! FINALLY got someone with this track! :P

TRACK NINE - Ah, music for jogging!

Y’know, now I get what couw meant when he said “the man who’s had 26 go before him.” I gotta learn to start thinking like you guys!

TRACK TEN - Through the years,

Like I said...... :g

TRACK TWELVE - Might be one of those Riddle MPS sides, I dunno. No matter. "Easy Listening" music of a very high calliber. Plenty attention to detail in the scoring, and lots of little nuances that tell me that the writer was really approaching it as music and not just a paycheck. Really sweet lead trumpet playing, too. This cut is just plain good. I'll take it, thanks.

Nowhere in the album does it say who the trumpet player is. Maybe Jim R knows? Anyway, I think you’d like the album this is from. It reminds me of what you said about Clooney in your BFT.

TRACK THIRTEEN - Oh HELL yeah! The Love Bug & The Spark Plug! Whatever happened to John Manning? He sounds like he was headed in the right direction, which is what a lot of guys like him were doing in these types of groups, only they didn't get recorded. Rough, unpolished, "unsophisticated", but full of the Right Stuff, just needing an outlet to tighten it up. I hope that John Manning is still playing.

Me too, and Sparkplug rules!

TRACK FOURTEEN - Sounds like the Sparkplug again, he's pretty identifiable. DEFINITELY hear Red Holloway as tenor #2, can NOT mistake that tone. Lemme relisten...ok, Plas Johnson & Red Holloway on Milestone. These guys ARE this style. Hell yeah.

Remember when I went apeshit over a track that KNTU played from this album? Yeah, same album. Lemme just say that I am in awe that you nailed BOTH tenor men on this track. And again, Sparkplug rules!!!

TRACK FIFTEEN - SHAMELESSLY urban. Which is to its credit. SHAMELESSLY unsubtle. Which is also to its credit. SHAMELESSY hip changes. Which is DEFINITELY to its credit.

The whole album is like this. Oh so GREEEEEEAZY! Right down to the record cover!

TRACK SIXTEEN - You play this groove right, you're freakin' GREAT. You play it anything, I mean ANYTHING, less than right you're a schmuck. No other options and zero rome for error. This IS right. I think I have this one, but damned if I know what it is. Lessee...Grant... oh shit, yeah I know what this is. God bless Harold Vick and the rest of these guys too. Lord knows they've blessed us. Spiffy Diffy indeed!

Amen and Hallelujah!!!

TRACK SEVENTEEN - God bless Billy Higgins. Interesting to hear Lee & JAckie play on this "happy" of a tune from a time when such sunniness was not necessarily the first ingredient on their respective recipies. Wilson gets a GOOD flow going. I've never heard this album, but that will soon be remedied...

I wonder how many sales of this disc will result from this BFT? Quite a few, I hope!!! Billy Higgins is da shizzit all over this album, and this track is just the tip, the cream of the crop if you will. It’s all good, though!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My workputer is very freaky about CDRs, and this one REALLY freaked it out,

Tell me about it! You shoulda tried listening to Al's 91-track bonus disc. I've never heard a CD play scream out in pain like that before... ^_^

You should hear the names my computer yells at me when I tell it, "Come on, just one more S.A.S. BFT!" :g

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...