The Treniers - THE HOSS ALLEN SESSIONS

[JSngry]

http://www.tuffcity.com/html/BluesJazz.asp...eAlbumList=2323

"Good eveing ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Cabaret Theatre of Tony's Fish Market Restaurant. Right now, presenting for the second appearance of the evening, those eight swingin' alcoholics, here we are, THE TRENIERS!"

It gets better, if that's possible. You gotta hear it to believe it. It's often cheesey, yeah, and it's definitely the sound of a group living in a cultural and musical time warp, even then. But damn it, these motherfuckers are working their outmoded asses off, and damn it, these motherfuckers got CHOPS! Buddy Trenier is a great Eckstine-type singer, and everything on here just flat-out swings. HARD. You get your standards, your jump tunes, your "novelty" numbers, your occasional originals, your slightly blue material, and your occasional Tomming. It all kicks ass, sometimes in spite of itself. It's vegas, it's Chitlin' Circuit, it's Jazz, it's R&B, it's Superficial Vegas Schlock, it's A Secret Link to Hipness Past, it's mindless hokum, it's deeply provocative and raises questions that have no easy answers, it's all of that and more or less.

One of the most purely entertaining programs I've heard in quite a while, as well as some of the most disturbing. It's impossible to defend some of this stuff, but it's equally impossible to dis it. Bottom line lesson for me - hard work overcomes obsolesence, planned or otherwise. No matter how hard they try to kill you, they can't do it if you outwork them. Here's proof. God bless 'em.

HIGHLY recommended for fans of Louis Jordan, Louis Prima, Sammy Davis Jr., John Coltrane, Lou Donaldson, Malcolm X, and everything in between and beyond.

Edited November 23, 2005 by JSngry

[Harold_Z]

This sounds like something I could definitely dig.

Hey Jim, do they say if that "Tony's Fish Market" is in New Rochelle, NY ?

Edited November 23, 2005 by Harold_Z

[JSngry]

This sounds like something I could definitely dig.

Hey Jim, do they say if that "Tony's Fish Market" is in New Rochelle, NY ?

Definitely something you'll dig.

I think it's in Miami.

Same thing, if you get my drift...

Edited November 23, 2005 by JSngry

[Chuck Nessa]

They were in at least one of the Alan Freed rock films. That's where I first heard of them back when.

Just checked and they were in Don't Knock the Rock and The Girl Can't Help It.

Edited November 23, 2005 by Chuck Nessa

[Joe]

How does this release stand up to that compilation of Okeh material that's available on Legacy / Collectables?

Been looking for a good entry point in their discography...

[John L]

I recall a good History of Rock and Roll film a while back that had some great (although very short) footage of the Treniers absolutely tearing it up on stage. I'll try to remember the name.

[JSngry]

How does this release stand up to that compilation of Okeh material that's available on Legacy / Collectables?

Been looking for a good entry point in their discography...

Not too familiar with that stuff, but I'd say that it's the same thing translated to a lounge act format, without any loss of intensity, which is the cool/disturbing part. It's either the apex of show business or way beyond show business into some parallel universe of denial as survival tool. Either way, it's fucking me up, that's what it's doing.

The Cabaret Theatre of Tony's Fish Market Restaurant? WTF kind of gig is that, and why are these guys working it so damn hard, especially in 1963-1964? Who was the market and what was the aim? If it was just to keep working by "putting on a good show", they're supremely overachieving. Cat's singing Cole Porter in a fucking fish house like it's the Copa in 1955 and he's on the verge of becoming King Of Show Biz. Then they do "Jambalaya" like it's the Apollo in 1952 and they're determined to stop the show and/or cause a riot. Then they do...

All of this at the Cabaret Theatre of Tony's Fish Market Restaurant. In 1963-1964. Amazing, I tell you, just fucking amazing. If you care enough to read this thread, you'll want to get this album. Trust me.

[Harold_Z]

The Cabaret Theatre of Tony's Fish Market Restaurant? WTF kind of gig is that, and why are these guys working it so damn hard, especially in 1963-1964? Who was the market and what was the aim?

I gotta tell ya ...this "Tony's Fish Market" thing really has me wondering. I did a long gig - over a year at a "Tony's Fish Market" in New Rochelle around 1978-79. It was with a semi-name local Bronx group (really a comedy act) called "The Teardrops". They had some records on Laurie and had a BIG following. The clientele that came to Tony's often included "celebrities". I remember seeing Ruby Dee and Ossie Davis, Lou Monte, Mario Merola (Bronx DA), a LOT of big shot mob guys, etc etc ...you get the picture. The place had really good food and was fairly large, had a second floor that looked like it also could have been a showroom, but was unused when I was there.

It really fits the scenario .

[Harold_Z]

...and BTW. It was called "Tony's Fish Market" because you would enter into a a small fish market (2 or 3 display cases) with a few small tables in the back. There was an entrance on the right into the showroom.

Cat's singing Cole Porter in a fucking fish house like it's the Copa in 1955...

The Teardrops were at the Copa Lounge for years in the 60s.

[SEK]

The Treniers regularly appeared at my grandparents' Catskill hotel (Brown's) in the '60s. Unfortunately, I could not really appreciate their music back then.

I think that I first heard the term, "poontang", from them.

[Kalo]

This looks interesting as hell. I'd love to see that film, any film, of them.

Do they play "Poontang" on this record?

Paging BruceH!

[BruceH]

This looks interesting as hell. I'd love to see that film, any film, of them.

Do they play "Poontang" on this record?

Paging BruceH!

Me want.

I have three Treniers compilations and yet this one is still calling to me.

As to why they were working the room so hard, I think that's just the way they normally worked. From what I gather, these guys were just flat-out insane (in a good way), enjoyed being insane, and communicated that insanity to their audience.

[Harold_Z]

Ok - I ordered and recieved it yeterday. Listened and dug it today. Nice call Jim. It's thorougly enjoyable and entertaining from start to finish...and that's what "The Treniers" were. Total entertainers and very musically sound. It goes back to a time when music was not so rigidly categorized, so you have the R&B, Pop, Jazz and Hokum all coalescing and melding into a very nice package.

Note: I DUG the bass playing on this cd. Precision bass with flatwound strings and this guy put every note in the right place. Ths is one of those records that for me just again show that it doesn't matter if it's a fender or upright - if it swings it swings !

[JSngry]

Glad you dug it. I sprung it, unannounced, on a buddy. an old road-dog who's done time w/Robby Bland & Johnny Taylor, on a road trip to Houston the other day. The first few tunes, he was kinda noncommittal, but pretty soon he was like, "Who ARE thes motherf***ers?". By the time it was over, he was totally diging it.

We both were taken by how hard-working the whole act was, how you were left with the impression that things like "having a bad night", "not feeling it tonight", etc. were just not an option in this universe. The music was your job, and you took your job seriously, and you dug doing it, because what's likely the alternative? A lesson for us all, especially these days, when the temptation to fade away in the face of general audience indifference is perhaps stronger than its ever been. These cats refused to be ignored!

Also taken note of was how tight the whole show was. The backing band is just a quartet, but most all the tunes are arranged like a '50s Basie chart, and they swing just as hard. No generic "rhythm section plays time and sax player noodles in the background". This shit was tight. And lord have mercy does it swing! Proof yet again, as if any was needed, that the old adage about ain't what you do, etc. is one of those eternal truths that we ignore at our own peril.

[BruceH]

It goes back to a time when music was not so rigidly categorized, so you have the R&B, Pop, Jazz and Hokum all coalescing and melding into a very nice package.

You hit the nail on the head.

I've long thought that the Treniers practiced a sort of musical supersymmetry in which those strands hadn't yet been frozen out into seperate categories.

[Kalo]

Sounds like I've got to get this.

[Jim Alfredson]

I'm thinking the same thing, Kalo.

[Joe G]

I'm thinking the same thing, Kalo.

Either you or me, Jim. Sounds like good gig drive-time music.

[Kalo]

I should be receiving this sometime this week and will definitely report back.

[jazzbo]

I keep thinking of Slim Gaillard when I hear Treniers in general and this one in particular!

Which is a really good thought!

[Kalo]

I'm listening to this right now, for the third time. It definitely corroborates the notion that the Treniers were best as a live act (which was their own understanding as to why they never had hit records).

I can hear why Sangrey flipped his lid for this. It's the ne plus ultra of lounge music. These guys could really "put it over."

Not least, they were masters of swing and jump blues, and pioneers of r&b and rock'n'roll. Having known their studio recordings, it's a revelation to hear their act, especially their "hip" renditions of standards. Hearing this, it's not hard to believe reports that the Rat Pack came to The Treniers's gigs after hours.

Earlier in this thread Clem mentioned Nick Tosches's book Unsung heroes of Rock 'n' Roll, from which tome I've culled some of the following information.

The Trenier twins (Cliff and Claude) matriculated at Alabama State, Erskine Hawkins's alma mater, in 1939. They claimed to have been thrown out in 1941. They were there at the same time as one Sonny Stitt. That's where they met musical companions for life, Gene Gilbeaux (piano) and Don Hill (alto sax). In later years they recruited brother Buddy and nephew Chip into the group.

One of the twins, Claude, was hired as a singer by Jimmie Lunceford in 1944 and recorded his first vocal with Lunceford's band in December of that year. Supposedly Lunceford called him "the Sepia Sinatra."

(In January 1946, Claude Trenier provided vocals for three of four numbers, most notably "Weird Nightmare," recorded under the leadership of Charles "Baron" Mingus for his second session on Excelsior records. These are currently available on Uptown Records UPCD 27.48)

The Treniers signed to Okeh shortly thereafter, recording their best-known sides, including "Go, Go, Go," and the immortal "Poontang."

After their short-lived sojourn at Tony's Fish Market, they became longtime denizens of various Vegas lounges. As far as I know, the last living remnants of The Treniers are still inhabiting Vegas.

Edited December 24, 2005 by Kalo

[Kalo]

I keep thinking of Slim Gaillard when I hear Treniers in general and this one in particular!

Which is a really good thought!

I feel you, Jazzbo!

[Kalo]

I just listened to the last track on this CD and I'd have to say that these guys were also heavily influenced by burlesque and minstrelsy. Suffice it to say that Redd Foxx would be proud...

I'd elect the last living Trenier, whoever he may be, as an American living treasure!

[Kalo]

Can't resist....

Listening to this again...

[JSngry]

Glad to see that this one is being appreciated!

I would just like to amplify a little on Kalo's comment -

I can hear why Sangrey flipped his lid for this. It's the ne plus ultra of lounge music. These guys could really "put it over."

Well, yeah. But for younger folk who have never really seen/heard "lounge music" as anything other than an irony-laden presentation of faux-cool (aka "martini culture"), that might not tell the whole story. The Treniers were from a time when good old-fashioned professionalism was the order of the day. Yeah, you could goof and be slick and all that, but it was all rooted in skill, in chops, in knowing everything that you needed to know, and then some. The "show" wasn't just a wink, it was a job. And you damn well took your job seriously. These guys were all that. Anybody who could take a hoary old tune like "Margie" and nail it, just flat out nail it with that perfect tempo and perfect Lunceford-esque execution that turns it into a genuine groovefest, has got to be more than a group of "lounge lizards". These muthafukkas were pros, and pros of the highest order!

Terms like "show business" & "entertainment" get a bum rap in today's too hip to be cool world, and that's wrong, I think. What could possibly be wrong with presenting an evening of music and patter that exemplifies and delivers quality, skill, and good times? Sure, there's envelopes to be pushed, boundaries to be broken, and dragons to be slain. Of course there are, and those things need to be pursued with rigor, vigor, and a refusal to compromise. But even Crusaders need to kick back and get loose, dig? "Entertainment" is a good thing, a damn good thing, if what you're being entertained with and by is something that has at its roots the same integrity as that which you are trying to further. And The Treniers had nothing if not the integrity of skill and professionalism in the pursuit of excellence. God bless'em.