Aug 15th RVGs

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Is the Aug. 15 batch actually in stores? I haven't seen them at Tower or Borders this weekend.

Well, I got 2 in Cardiff on Tuesday. I would have got the Griffin, but they sold out of it on Monday.

MG

[bertrand]

The Borders' in Rockville, MD had 'em.

Picked up Quebec and Byrd for $6.99 each with that great $5 off coupon. Who needs yourmusic in that case

Tower cannot be getting them, right, or are the majors shipping to them again?

Bertrand.

Edited August 21, 2006 by bertrand

[jeffrey r]

Tower cannot be getting them, right, or are the majors shipping to them again?

Bertrand.

I have not seen them at my local Tower.

Edited August 21, 2006 by jeffrey r

[Kyo]

The Congregation has WAY too much treble. The stereo spread is nice, but the cymbals are just plain ridiculous.

Noooo! Not another one!

Just got my copy, listening to it via headphones. Doesn't sound too bad, really.

[king ubu]

Got "Another Workout" (first time I heard it - fantastic!), "Congregation" (my Conn LP sounds better, I think...), and "Trompeta Toccata" (had a vinyl rip, nice to have the real thing).

A pretty nice batch, if you ask me.

Though I wonder why they didn't bring back the other Quebec I never heard (the Conn of "It Might as Well Be Spring" is not that long gone, or at least it did pop up now and then, and it sounds fine, I think). Never had a chance to hear "Heavy Soul", so I'm waiting for that.

[Cliff Englewood]

You don't have to wait to hear "Heavy Soul", it's already an RVG.

RVG Edition

Well worth getting, imho of course.

[T.D.]

"Easy Living" seems to be the IQ currently in most need of re-release. Very nice album, despite being rather a strange mix of two sessions.

Edited August 25, 2006 by T.D.

[king ubu]

You don't have to wait to hear "Heavy Soul", it's already an RVG.

RVG Edition

Well worth getting, imho of course.

Well, I saw it in a store today, a few hours after I posted here... of course it's not a CD but a copycrap... I was so far from buying any Blue Notes for those two or three years they'd been selling us turds that I wasn't even aware this had been reissued.

I wonder will they start selling older reissues in non-protected versions too again, or will I have to get these from the US?

[Claude]

I wonder will they start selling older reissues in non-protected versions too again, or will I have to get these from the US?

As EMI has abandonned Copy Control in June, I guess the previously released copyprotected CDs will be repressed as regular CDs when they have sold all of the old copyprotected discs in stock. That could take some time though.

[David Ayers]

I wonder will they start selling older reissues in non-protected versions too again, or will I have to get these from the US?

As EMI has abandonned Copy Control in June, I guess the previously released copyprotected CDs will be repressed as regular CDs when they have sold all of the old copyprotected discs in stock. That could take some time though.

I doubt it. It is expensive to create new masters. They didn't re-press the pre-CC items and I doubt whether they will withdraw it from existing ones - just not worth it, and CD sales are comparatively low after initial release. In the UK they push these things out in perpetual sales at £5 a time so I don't see the fine point about CC being an issue. Might be wrong.

[Kyo]

I doubt it. It is expensive to create new masters.

They could easily use the US masters. Not that I think they will - but it's an option.

[king ubu]

Well, I say if I see CC discs cheap, I get them, but cheap in switzerland usually means roughly full US prize, so it's rather unlikely I'll buy more of those. And I'm afraid they will just re-press the CC discs, too...

[David Ayers]

I doubt it. It is expensive to create new masters.

They could easily use the US masters. Not that I think they will - but it's an option.

They'd have to redo all the inserts as well, and even the disk printing. But they love us! So maybe they will!!

[king ubu]

I doubt it. It is expensive to create new masters.

They could easily use the US masters. Not that I think they will - but it's an option.

They'd have to redo all the inserts as well, and even the disk printing. But they love us! So maybe they will!!

If they do that they could also start using real paper as the US editions have, not these flimsy covers that often have some marks and folds in them from the very beginning, even if shrink-wrapped! The difference is rather enormous - I have the US version "Dance of Death", and comparing it to the CC-"Passing Ship" cover, the US one is twice as heavy. Much better quality.

[David Ayers]

Can we - EVER - fully account for evil in a world made by a benign creator - ?

[robert h.]

With these types of titles, there will in almost all cases never be a repressing. Simply nowhere even slightly close to any demand.

CC is not applied at the mastering stage. But in any event, if a title were to be repressed, it would certainly be CC again, no reason to even spend a dime changing anything given the market.

Sure, CC was never a great idea, but aside from the issue of ripping copies, the sonic effect is miniscule at best. Certainly it is no reason to avoid missing great music.

[Claude]

CC is not applied at the mastering stage. But in any event, if a title were to be repressed, it would certainly be CC again, no reason to even spend a dime changing anything given the market.

But if there were reasons to abandon CC for new releases, the same reasons would also be valid to re-press the old titles as non-CC discs, once the old stock is sold.

My guess is that they abandonned CC because of the disastrous image of copyprotected discs after the Sony rootkit scandal. Whereas previously only purists ranted about CC, now all the music buyers are aware of it. Another reason could be the iPod boom. Many people refuse to buy CDs which cannot be copied to their iPod.

[David Ayers]

CC is not applied at the mastering stage.

Evidently the master used to 'press' the CDs has the CC applied - it is not a process applied to the actual CD. Not least, it includes an extra non-musical track, which is plainly part of the master.

Sure, CC was never a great idea, but aside from the issue of ripping copies, the sonic effect is miniscule at best. Certainly it is no reason to avoid missing great music.

Many of us already own this music in other formats. The sonic effect when you put the disc in the car, in an old PC, or in an ageing CD player, is that it won't play at all - which is a deficit, I'd say. How many of these disks do you own?

[robert h.]

CC is not applied at the mastering stage.

Evidently the master used to 'press' the CDs has the CC applied - it is not a process applied to the actual CD. Not least, it includes an extra non-musical track, which is plainly part of the master.

Sure, CC was never a great idea, but aside from the issue of ripping copies, the sonic effect is miniscule at best. Certainly it is no reason to avoid missing great music.

Many of us already own this music in other formats. The sonic effect when you put the disc in the car, in an old PC, or in an ageing CD player, is that it won't play at all - which is a deficit, I'd say. How many of these disks do you own?

If you are referring to the glass master used to press the actual discs, yes, the glass 'master' has the CC applied, of course it does - did you think they etched it into the disc after manufacture?!? - but not the digital master from the tapes, which is what most would consider to be the 'master'. CC is added to the digital master as an intermediary step between digital master and the glass master disc. Evidently.

As far as how many CC discs I have - LOTS, and it doesn't bother me in the least, but then again, on an audio system like mine, it's pretty hard for something to be really bad, and I don't obsess over minor sonic differences. In my last 3 cars I never had a CC disc that wouldn't play fine (although all, including my new Volvo, reject most dual layer SACD's, talk about another stupid format of the labels), I don't listen on a PC and my 5 year old Dell plays CC discs fine anyways, and I wasn't aware that age caused CD players to have problems with certain discs, but like I said, CC was never a great idea.

Edited August 27, 2006 by robert h.

[David Ayers]

If you are referring to the glass master used to press the actual discs

It seems I was. Those are the ones which would have to be changed and it won't happen.

on an audio system like mine, it's pretty hard for something to be really bad

That's where my problem is. They play on a quality system, but sometimes fail on others, and may not be 100% future compatible. I'd like to think consumer resistance helped stop it but maybe not.

[king ubu]

Look, I say it again: the main reason why CC bothers me is that *I am willing to buy their product* - yet, instead of punishing those who download or copy, instead of buying, they punish me by selling me a defect (that's what the CC is, tiny errors on the disc) product. Something gone wrong here. This punch in the face of the buying customer is what puts me off. Everything else is debatable - I have some 5-10 CC discs, too (mainly Conns that I got in sales for 5-8 or 9 euros).

[robert h.]

If you are referring to the glass master used to press the actual discs

It seems I was. Those are the ones which would have to be changed and it won't happen.

on an audio system like mine, it's pretty hard for something to be really bad

That's where my problem is. They play on a quality system, but sometimes fail on others, and may not be 100% future compatible. I'd like to think consumer resistance helped stop it but maybe not.

Exactly my original point - there's no reason for the record companies to change anything in the unlikely event they repress. They would simply grab the glass master and send it to the factory.

Just like dual disc, it was a poorly thought out product in the first place. I have my doubts about forward compatability of dual layer SACD's also (indeed, I have severe doubts about their durability also). All these are just another example of why recorded music is dying, it is that record companies became adversarial with their customers in order to 'protect' their physical product and their investment in a model which was no longer relevant, but which they had substantial interest in trying to maintain - even when it was clear that their customers wanted a service, not something they didn't want forced down their throat.

Let's face it - when buying a product generally pisses off the customers, but they buy it grudgingly in the absence of a good alternative, the product is marked for extinction the minute customers find that alternative - in fact, they will pay more and compromise quality to move off it, such is their resentment.

That's what's happening to physcal music, and CC is simply another symptom.

It's entirely unlikely that consumer resistance had anything to do with dropping CC. The record companies are long past having any concern about their customers. It was simply the ineffectiveness of the control and an accounting decision that the cost was no longer justified.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

If you are referring to the glass master used to press the actual discs

It seems I was. Those are the ones which would have to be changed and it won't happen.

on an audio system like mine, it's pretty hard for something to be really bad

That's where my problem is. They play on a quality system, but sometimes fail on others, and may not be 100% future compatible. I'd like to think consumer resistance helped stop it but maybe not.

Exactly my original point - there's no reason for the record companies to change anything in the unlikely event they repress. They would simply grab the glass master and send it to the factory.

Just like dual disc, it was a poorly thought out product in the first place. I have my doubts about forward compatability of dual layer SACD's also (indeed, I have severe doubts about their durability also). All these are just another example of why recorded music is dying, it is that record companies became adversarial with their customers in order to 'protect' their physical product and their investment in a model which was no longer relevant, but which they had substantial interest in trying to maintain - even when it was clear that their customers wanted a service, not something they didn't want forced down their throat.

Let's face it - when buying a product generally pisses off the customers, but they buy it grudgingly in the absence of a good alternative, the product is marked for extinction the minute customers find that alternative - in fact, they will pay more and compromise quality to move off it, such is their resentment.

That's what's happening to physcal music, and CC is simply another symptom.

It's entirely unlikely that consumer resistance had anything to do with dropping CC. The record companies are long past having any concern about their customers. It was simply the ineffectiveness of the control and an accounting decision that the cost was no longer justified.

I think if I were a marketing manager in a major company, I'd reckon it worthwhile to pay a small team of statisticians to research the locations in which records were being sold - if only to focus promotion effort geographically. That should reveal a lot of US items being sold in Europe in competition with European product. The US managers wouldn't worry, but the European managers have targets and, if they weren't meeting them...

MG