The graying of the record store

[marcello]

Here's a article from Encore that may interest everyone, including this:

Nearly 281 million digital singles were purchased through July 2, compared to 158.8 million in the time frame last year. More than 14 million full-album downloads were purchased in the first six months of this year, more than double the 6.5 million bought in the first half of 2005.

And this:

Independent record labels accounted for 12.79 percent of market share.

Edited July 17, 2006 by marcello

[Quincy]

We have a long-time independent owner who is also adding a vinyl section. He was the first in town to start selling CDs and got rid of vinyl 20 some years ago. The other independent kept records the whole time and it's a younger lot going back to the stacks.

Adding vinyl isn't just about selling old records. Artists such as Cat Power have been releasing vinyl versions of albums for some time. Her latest "The Greatest" had a bonus track not on the CD (or at least 2nd pressings on), which is kind of amusing as the CD format has more space, but there you go.

Jazz may seem darn near dead, but the Indie music scene is full of music collecting geeks. The kids I know buy CD singles and imports along with the regular releases, and hunt down songs that end up only on soundtracks. They are just as obsessive & compulsive as some jazzbo trying to hunt down rarities. And their geekiness requires that they own the physical object because they want the doodles, pictures and liner notes along with the music.

Are the twentysomethings the end of the line for those who desire pressed discs? I dunno, maybe. But as I have 20 years on them then maybe there will still be record stores for as long as my hearing holds out.

Edited July 17, 2006 by Quincy

[David Ayers]

Lou's Records in Encinitas, CA seems to continue to buck these trends.

By the way interest in music and interest in consuming music are different things.

We went through a period when people were asked to define themselves by patterns of musical interest. That seems tedious now and I am glad we are out of it.

I don't know how far the small number of us who pile up lots of records indicate the reality of 'interest' in music.

In a related vein, I think that people should have read all sorts of things; that notion of mine is only tangentially related to the existence or otherwise of independent bookshops. Barely related at all in fact. In fact, absolutely unrelated. So - it all depends on how we think of 'interest' in music, and what we believe is at stake and in what way.

PS In my experience most young people love music; whether they want to pile up musical commodities like nerds - well, that's for us greedy materialists, not for them... (they seem to be creatures of spirit, the little blighters! They'll learn.)

Edited July 17, 2006 by David Ayers

[andybleaden]

Yes I see some sense in the article. However I can now buy more types of music now and quicker than before.

As commented elsewhere and before we have become very used to the fact that there are lots of Blue Note CDs out there. There never used to be when I started buying em. ...and they cost lots more then than they do now. Why?/...Look around and I can buy the same cd here in the UK at HMV type of places for lots more then I want to pay for them. Alternatively I can go online and get it from the an online distributor for heaps less.

Case in point is the new Grant Green cd at Mozambique...ordered through here....my fav board. How easy is that and for not lots of bucks ( I believe I preordered it for $9.70- the shops over here would have wanted me to part with double that I am more than sure)

Things change I admit but not always with such black and white results.

Just think. How many years as a Grant Green fan did you sit and sulk knowing full well that they would 'never' reissue Final Comedown ( ok it was never that good), Iron City let alone previously unreleasable live sessions

[andybleaden]

of course I can always download the mp3 too!!!

but that would not be so great as having it as a cd would it

[RDK]

Lou's Records in Encinitas, CA seems to continue to buck these trends.

That's because it's a terrific store that has an incredible selection of CDs (new and used) and vinyl of all genres. And very good prices. It's perhaps the only indie/used store that i go to where i buy more new than used.

[RDK]

As for the article in general, I can sympathize. I have the same problem finding a place that will test the tubes in my old black and white TV...

[David Ayers]

Lou's Records in Encinitas, CA seems to continue to buck these trends.

That's because it's a terrific store that has an incredible selection of CDs (new and used) and vinyl of all genres. And very good prices. It's perhaps the only indie/used store that i go to where i buy more new than used.

They also host gigs in the (small) car park and promote bands.

[GA Russell]

The last 10 (or so) years have had the most music "in print" in my lifetime.

I've felt for the past five years that the period of 1995-present has been the Golden Age for fans of 50s and 60s jazz.

Naturally, I would have enjoyed living in New York at that time (and being old enough to get into the clubs!) to see all of my heroes performing live. But since that was not an option, the best I can do is collect records, and there has never been a better time than this!

In the liner notes to the Fantasy 4-CD compilation The Contemporary Records Story, it is pointed out that there are more Contemporary albums currently in print than at any time during the company's existence!

[Hot Ptah]

Kansas City has seen the closing of its two great used music stores this year, the Music Exchange and Recycled Sounds.

The Music Exchange may reopen in a new location after selling off most of its CD stock (but not its 1 million+ vinyl albums) but it has not reopened yet.

Recycled Sounds was owned by Anne Winter, who said that the store was still a going concern. It made an effort to reach out to young people, who made up a lot of the customers. The staff was knowledgable about current pop and rock and hosted bands for in-store concerts. The store also had a good, ever changing selection of jazz--the good stuff seemed to fly out of there all the time.

In a newspaper article about the store's closing, Ms. Winter said that she just did not feel like running a music store any more. She has another job and she had lost her enthusiasm for the store. She commented that since she closed the store, she had a deeper love of music again, because she "didn't have to listen to so much bad music to stay up to date."

[Eric]

Kansas City has seen the closing of its two great used music stores this year, the Music Exchange and Recycled Sounds.

The Music Exchange may reopen in a new location after selling off most of its CD stock (but not its 1 million+ vinyl albums) but it has not reopened yet.

Recycled Sounds was owned by Anne Winter, who said that the store was still a going concern. It made an effort to reach out to young people, who made up a lot of the customers. The staff was knowledgable about current pop and rock and hosted bands for in-store concerts. The store also had a good, ever changing selection of jazz--the good stuff seemed to fly out of there all the time.

In a newspaper article about the store's closing, Ms. Winter said that she just did not feel like running a music store any more. She has another job and she had lost her enthusiasm for the store. She commented that since she closed the store, she had a deeper love of music again, because she "didn't have to listen to so much bad music to stay up to date."

HP,

I just saw there is a new vinyl place over by 64th & Quivera. My son and I are going to check it out this weekend. I am guessing it is the old CD Warehouse location:

http://www.vinyl-renaissance.com/servlet/StoreFront

I also heard that Music Exchange had relocated into the West Bottoms - can't recall the specific address.

My son tells me there is also a place over on 39th Street and we have also been to a bookstore on 39th that has some vinyl in the basement. Very eclectic selection.

I was very bummed when Recycled Sounds closed, but at least I caught their sale.

Best record store in the area is still Love Garden in Lawrence, although I am very eager to check out Vinyl Renaissance.

There is also a used CD/vinyl store over on 75th Street in OP (or Shawnee) that is cool - Needmore Discs.

Actually pretty refreshing to see all the new places "filling the void" after the demise of RS and ME.

Eric

[Hot Ptah]

Eric, Love Garden in Lawrence, Kansas is great. To me, nothing else yet equals the Music Exchange or Recycled Sounds. I have driven by the Music Exchange's new location in the West Bottoms but it has not been open. With the owner's well publicized personal problems, I wonder if it will ever reopen.

Zebedee's on 39th Street is promising, but needs more new stock. The owner used to own Alley Cat Records on Main Street, and on the last day of that store's existence, he sold me the box set of the Complete John Coltrane on Prestige for cheap--so I am rooting for him to succeed at Zebedee's, which is in a start-up mode.

Prospero's Books on 39th Street has a limited amount of vinyl and almost no jazz CDs in their basement now. The owner talked about turning it into a great music store, but it has not happened yet.

I have not checked out the Kansas stores yet.

There have always been a lot of used music stores coming and going in Kansas City. I recall fondly Love Records and Exile, for example. I wonder if the new stores will really make it this time.

[Ken Dryden]

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the artificially high retail prices maintained by labels for their CDs.

[Jim Alfredson]

This whole discussion is predicated on the notion that music "matters" to most people.

I say that, right now, it doesn't. For most people, it's little, if anything more, than a disposable lifestyle accessory. Simple as that. The number of people who really "care" continues to shrink.

It's hard to care about something when you're constantly inundated with it (and the stuff you're inundated with is usually piss poor at that!) I mean, do we really need music EVERYWHERE? Do I need to be listening to Top 40 dreck while taking a dump in restuarant? Do I need to hear 80s nostalgia while pumping gas at the gas station? Do I need to hear soft rock while waiting for my dentist? Can't I just read in peace?

As for the article in general, I can sympathize. I have the same problem finding a place that will test the tubes in my old black and white TV...

LOL!

[etherbored]

well, to address jim's statements, i think we can all appreciate just how ridiculous the marketeers of this country (if not world) have gotten at exploiting a demograph or consumer base with music. i mean, my god, sitting in a movie theater before a film, while filling my car with gas, standing in line at the bank. our culture is being obliterated with musical subterfuge! am i right? and oh the dreck. i sympathize with the owner of the shop in kansas city when she lamets how much bad music she has to listen to remain au curant.

as for what the future holds for the state of music for true afficianados, i prefer to think that intelligence and taste is intelligence and taste, period; neither the i-pod nor downloading will supplant it. in other words, there will always be a place for the mosaic records of the world. however marginal or slim (as we've always been, anyway), collectors of tangibile musics will remain. word to the observation about 'the final comedown'!

however, i'll leave the door open for technology to advance to the state where the experience of purchasing and enjoying a recording comes near to replicating that of a record store. who knows - maybe in a few years we'll all have the abiltity to print out comercial grade high quality artwork and burn a true 24-bit/96-mhz pressing from a wells stored digital master. all i do know is that the ability to harness the technology to enhance our experience is there. right now, it seems that whether the marketplace will actually realize this opportunity is somewhat grim. but the dust is far from clearing...

-e-

Edited July 19, 2006 by etherbored

[DMP]

I agree with the view that the past few years (and the CD era in general) has been some sort of "golden age" for jazz albums. There has to be more material available than ever before (and my wish lost seems to dwindle daily). As a kid, buying jazz in the LP era (early '60's on) whole parts of jazz catalogs were out of print or discontinued. (I think I got "Waltz For Debby" as a cut-out!) Today (as one example) we're pissed because we can only get Jutta Hipp at the Hickory House in a couple of versions - 40 years ago it had completely disappeared! Not only is there so much available, it's often loaded with extra material that we couldn't even imagine as kids. (Out-takes from "Kind of Blue" and "Love Supreme" - who knew?)

But, as to the original point of this thread, it's all too true that the retail outlets that we all love are pretty much doomed. Let's hope our CD collections don't turn to dust, we may never see so much again.

[Hot Ptah]

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the artificially high retail prices maintained by labels for their CDs.

The music stores that I have been discussing mostly sell used CDs for $8 and less.

Another point which has not been stressed is the uninviting nature of indie record stores for a lot of people. Many of them have music fanatics working as clerks, who either lacked social skills when they started work, or lost their social skills while working at the store. My wife refuses to shop at indie stores, for example, because the clerks are rude, and ridicule her without cause. She also finds the "funky" nature of the carpet, restrooms, furnishings and decor to be real turnoffs--she does not find them to be quaint or interesting or atmospheric.

I think that the days of the hippie or alternative rock influenced indie music store may be dwindling fast.

An interesting phenomenon is the rise of Half Price Books, a chain which started as a single indie shop in Texas, but now has dozens of stores in about half of the U.S. I have been to three of their stores. They are all brightly lit, clean, and painted white inside, and kept spotless and organized. They carry publisher's overstocks of books, CDs and DVDs/videos, plus whatever people bring in off the street to sell. They have good selection, low prices, and many music gems--imports, box sets (including Propers) and other rare and obscure stuff. They have a discount section where jazz CDs I want to get are priced at $1 or $3. They have interesting vinyl music sections. The selection of music is close to what the long time indie stores are stocking--in some ways the Half Price Books music selection is superior. This is not a sterile environment, because the selection is surprisingly deep and unusual.

The Half Price Book stores are usually quite busy, including a lot of customers who have never set foot in any of the indie book stores or music stores that I have frequented over the years. During virtually any visit, I have seen people bringing in large boxes full of books and CDs to sell. "Ordinary people", who are not hip enough to make their way to the long time indie music stores, flock to the store in droves. They have a formula that really works.

I have picked up many jazz biographies, children's books, and CDs at Half Price Books, for ridiculously low prices. For example, a new, sealed 2CD set of Shorty Rogers, "Sweetheart of Sigmund Freud", for $1.00. It sells for over $20 at online sources.

Edited July 19, 2006 by Hot Ptah

[Alexander]

But...but...if we remove the "cultish" atmosphere of indie record (not to mention book and comic) stores, how will we maintain our sense of superiority?

[Guest youmustbe]

When I started buying Jazz records in 1959 in Chicago, I'd see something in Jazz Review, go tot the record store and the guy would say 'I don't have it but i can order it from the distributor. I'll have it next week for you'.

The Amazon of it's day!

Nothing has really changed. if the stores go out of business, so be it. If there are no more cds, just downloads, so be it.

[Hot Ptah]

When I started buying Jazz records in 1959 in Chicago, I'd see something in Jazz Review, go tot the record store and the guy would say 'I don't have it but i can order it from the distributor. I'll have it next week for you'.

The Amazon of it's day!

Nothing has really changed. if the stores go out of business, so be it. If there are no more cds, just downloads, so be it.

On some level, this is all true--once the music is in your home, it's there. I have a different experience browsing in a well stocked, vast music store with knowledgable clerks than I do when I order online. There is much more opportunity for unexpected discoveries in the music store, and the opportunity for verbal communication with the knowledgable clerks can be valuable.

[(BB)]

When I started buying Jazz records in 1959 in Chicago, I'd see something in Jazz Review, go tot the record store and the guy would say 'I don't have it but i can order it from the distributor. I'll have it next week for you'.

The Amazon of it's day!

Nothing has really changed. if the stores go out of business, so be it. If there are no more cds, just downloads, so be it.

On some level, this is all true--once the music is in your home, it's there. I have a different experience browsing in a well stocked, vast music store with knowledgable clerks than I do when I order online. There is much more opportunity for unexpected discoveries in the music store, and the opportunity for verbal communication with the knowledgable clerks can be valuable.

The argument could be made that forums such as this, are the replacement for that verbal exchange.

Bill

[andybleaden]

well......yes although look how many people here would never have met other Blue Note or Hard Bop or Soul Jazz mateys like we have here.

The only difference with a shop was that I used to ( when I was younger) get recommendations from the guy who worked at Decoy Records (in Manchester) then to try this or that and he would give it a spin ....and then I would develop my tastes elsewhere.

[Guest akanalog]

yeah normans is sketchy. boo hoo if that place goes under.

i have bought many good things there and it is a good place to find OOP or random kind of stuff, but it's not a cheap store and i have bought CDs that seem to be repackaged used discs.

[Guest akanalog]

my music buying trip on occassion-i get a bubble tea at st. alps and then i enjoy briefly checking out rocket scienetist or whatever it is called-rock it scientist? then i check out kims and then normans and then head down to downtown music gallery. then perhaps other music and tower on the way home. the jazz sections at all these stores sucks, except downtown. so i usually reserve my money for there. even the jazz vinyl selection, which used to be decent at rock it and kims and other music, pretty much suck.

generally i save lp $$$ for academy and cd $$$ for downtown...

[7/4]

my music buying trip on occassion-i get a bubble tea at st. alps and then i enjoy briefly checking out rocket scienetist or whatever it is called-rock it scientist? then i check out kims and then normans and then head down to downtown music gallery. then perhaps other music and tower on the way home. the jazz sections at all these stores sucks, except downtown. so i usually reserve my money for there. even the jazz vinyl selection, which used to be decent at rock it and kims and other music, pretty much suck.

generally i save lp $$$ for academy and cd $$$ for downtown...

Downtown is the only place I pickup CDs. I just go to Other Music for copies of the Wire and I still haven't bought the June or July issues.