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LCD vs Plasma


medjuck

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A couple of questions to our US friends:

Do they broadcasting only -over the air- nor by cable or satellite?

Do you note the difference between a HD shooting program and non HD ?

I mean that a real HD should starts from the camera and ends on your HD screen.

Because HD cameras are quite expensive, I presume they use them in studio or for particular events really popular with big budget like NBA, ecc. In a football (soccer for you overseas ;) ) match there are dozens of cameras, they all should be HD. Since the trend is light ENG troupes around the world to get the events, I suspect that most of what you are watching at is not HD from starts to ends.

Not clear what happens over the air but in NYC cable and satellite carry about 8-10 non-pay "hi def" channels and some of the premium services, e.g., HBO, come in hi def versions. I get CBS, NBC, ABC, TNT (one of Turner's channels), one of the ESPN channels, and some hi def only offerings from Discovery and PBS.

Viz whether it's hi def from end-to-end, it's difficult to tell. There's clearly some variation between the various channels and even between the programs on the same channel. Some look like 480 lines at 16:9. Some channels go back and forth between aspect ratios, suggesting that even at the source not all of it is hi def. But when it is hi def, you can immediately tell the difference in more than the aspect ratio. It's not subtle. I look for the grass.

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Realism and quality are subjective, but I can't agree that the CRTs provide more definition.

Realism is not subjective, that's the reason because every tape for broadcasting has, or should have, standard color bars at its start, because you can measure the color, and tune up the broadcasting. To put it simple let's we say we have a scale from 0 to 1, black should be 0, white 1, if black is 0.2 it appears like dark grey, if is less then 0 we have a kind of unatural grey that seems a damaged LCD monitor.

Definition depends of the number of pixels, or lines, if you prefer.

In order to appreciate an HD monitor you need, like you said, an HD source. AFIK there are no channels that broadcast in HD, a part some experimental one. We would need a new HD software and HD players.

As usual we are seeing the common 'war of formats', Sony HD is different from Panasonic HD, they are based on different algoritms of compression, (you have to compress every frame of a movie shooted on film), they are, at moment, incompatible.

HD is probably going to cancel movie shooting on film. But, in order to show a movie in a theater you have to transfer your HD movie on film, because theaters haven't got HD projector.

As you can see the thing are a bit mess at the moment.

Frankly would you bet 4K on this?

This discussion is very interesting but reminds me of this interchange:

Sonia: Immorality is subjective

Boris: Yes, but subjectivity is objective

Sonia: Not in any rational scheme of perception

Boris: Perception is irrational and implies imminence ...

:lol::lol::lol:

and by the way, how good is that 26 inch Sharp LCD?

The Sharps are not so bad because they are manufactered outside US. :P

Skeith! Long times!

How are you?

I'm good Porcy and you?

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Realism and quality are subjective, but I can't agree that the CRTs provide more definition.

Realism is not subjective, that's the reason because every tape for broadcasting has, or should have, standard color bars at its start, because you can measure the color, and tune up the broadcasting. To put it simple let's we say we have a scale from 0 to 1, black should be 0, white 1, if black is 0.2 it appears like dark grey, if is less then 0 we have a kind of unatural grey that seems a damaged LCD monitor.

Definition depends of the number of pixels, or lines, if you prefer.

In order to appreciate an HD monitor you need, like you said, an HD source. AFIK there are no channels that broadcast in HD, a part some experimental one. We would need a new HD software and HD players.

As usual we are seeing the common 'war of formats', Sony HD is different from Panasonic HD, they are based on different algoritms of compression, (you have to compress every frame of a movie shooted on film), they are, at moment, incompatible.

HD is probably going to cancel movie shooting on film. But, in order to show a movie in a theater you have to transfer your HD movie on film, because theaters haven't got HD projector.

As you can see the thing are a bit mess at the moment.

Frankly would you bet 4K on this?

This discussion is very interesting but reminds me of this interchange:

Sonia: Immorality is subjective

Boris: Yes, but subjectivity is objective

Sonia: Not in any rational scheme of perception

Boris: Perception is irrational and implies imminence ...

:lol::lol::lol:

and by the way, how good is that 26 inch Sharp LCD?

The Sharps are not so bad because they are manufactered outside US. :P

Skeith! Long times!

How are you?

I'm good Porcy and you?

I am fine, thanks.

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I keep reading about the differences between the 2 but no ones seems to say defintively which is best. Also is there a good monitor with no receiver or speakers available?

Actually no one can "say to you which is best". It will be from your perspective anyway. If you have been doing reading and research, make a decision and go with it. :cool:

I went for a 42" Panasonic Viera plasma and am pretty happy with it.

Ahh yes, another 42 Panasonic viewer. I have a Panasonic Viera also and it is just beautiful. I am addicted to the HD channels. :D

Let me tell you one thing, and I am speaking as professional film and video editor. None of the today's LCD or Plasma monitors can reach the definition, the realism and the quality of good catode tube monitor. When I check my final work for broadcasting I do it on a professional Sony catode tube monitor, 15 inch, that cost twice the price of the best flat screen you can find on consumer market. So if you HAVE TO buy a flat screen, do it, I understand all the facilities that a flat screen has compared to a bulky cathode tube. If you HAVE TO buy a biggest TV, buy it, I know that manufacturers deleted from their catalog cathode tube bigger then 17 inch. BUT if you don't need a new TV, just wait. Technology is running fast, companies put huge amount of money in the field. Flat screen IS the THING now. Maybe we will have some pleasant surprise in the next future.

I'm curious, WHAT is a catode tube?? Did you mean CATHODE RAY TUBE?? :huh:

am i the only one who can't see porcy's avatar...?

-e-

No, I can't see Porcy's avatar either! :(

It took me forever to make a decision when I was in the market last year.

I ended up going LCD and got a Phillips. The Sharp Aquos line is very nice as well.

It took me a long time to make a decision also. Funny thing was, the decision I made was the same decision I started out with while I was still confused. So everybody do some research, make a decision and go for it. :cool:

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Let me tell you one thing, and I am speaking as professional film and video editor. None of the today's LCD or Plasma monitors can reach the definition, the realism and the quality of good catode tube monitor. When I check my final work for broadcasting I do it on a professional Sony catode tube monitor, 15 inch, that cost twice the price of the best flat screen you can find on consumer market. So if you HAVE TO buy a flat screen, do it, I understand all the facilities that a flat screen has compared to a bulky cathode tube. If you HAVE TO buy a biggest TV, buy it, I know that manufacturers deleted from their catalog cathode tube bigger then 17 inch. BUT if you don't need a new TV, just wait. Technology is running fast, companies put huge amount of money in the field. Flat screen IS the THING now. Maybe we will have some pleasant surprise in the next future.

I'm curious, WHAT is a catode tube?? Did you mean CATHODE RAY TUBE?? :huh:

Tommy DeVito: What do you mean I'm funny?

Henry Hill: It's funny, you know. It's a good story, it's funny, you're a funny guy.

[laughs]

Tommy DeVito: what do you mean, you mean the way I talk? What?

Henry Hill: It's just, you know. You're just funny, it's... funny, the way you tell the story and everything.

Tommy DeVito: [it becomes quiet] Funny how? What's funny about it?

Anthony Stabile: Tommy no, You got it all wrong.

Tommy DeVito: Oh, oh, Anthony. He's a big boy, he knows what he said. What did ya say? Funny how?

Henry Hill: Jus...

Tommy DeVito: What?

Henry Hill: Just... ya know... you're funny.

Tommy DeVito: You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little fucked up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to fuckin' amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

Henry Hill: Just... you know, how you tell the story, what?

Tommy DeVito: No, no, I don't know, you said it. How do I know? You said I'm funny. How the fuck am I funny, what the fuck is so funny about me? Tell me, tell me what's funny!

Henry Hill: [long pause] Get the fuck out of here, Tommy!

Tommy DeVito: [everyone laughs] Ya motherfucker! I almost had him, I almost had him. Ya stuttering prick ya. Frankie, was he shaking? I wonder about you sometimes,

Yes, I apology for my maccaroni english style. But you should watch at The Goodfather sagas some more times, Goodfellas or at least The Sopranos. You seems the only one here who didn't understand it.

Edited by porcy62
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I am really serious in wanting to know about various LCD TVs.

I notice that the Sharp or Sony 26" sets run about $1000. But brands like Westinghouse, Olevia, and some others run about $500-$600 for the same size. Some sales people tell me the cheaper ones are fine and you pay more for the name brand. Anyone know if this is so?

One other thing - it frustrates me that none of these LCD TVs come with a headphone jack. This allows me to watch late at night and not bother others and to watch at inappropriate volumes for late night hours. One salesperson suggested I could plug the headphones into an "Audio Out" connection on the LCD TV, but that won't silence the speakers in the TV as a headphone jack does, correct?

Any advice on this from those in the know?

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I don't know of headphone jacks on any TVs. All have audio outputs, though, designed to connect to stereo/multichanel amps, so you could always plug your headphone into that (your amp/receiver that is). And yes, you should be able to disable the TV's speakers.

Edited by RDK
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I am really serious in wanting to know about various LCD TVs.

I notice that the Sharp or Sony 26" sets run about $1000. But brands like Westinghouse, Olevia, and some others run about $500-$600 for the same size. Some sales people tell me the cheaper ones are fine and you pay more for the name brand. Anyone know if this is so?

One other thing - it frustrates me that none of these LCD TVs come with a headphone jack. This allows me to watch late at night and not bother others and to watch at inappropriate volumes for late night hours. One salesperson suggested I could plug the headphones into an "Audio Out" connection on the LCD TV, but that won't silence the speakers in the TV as a headphone jack does, correct?

Any advice on this from those in the know?

If you got the money, there is a solution to add a headphone jack to any audio gear with line outputs. $399 is the price you'll pay.

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Can I turn off a TVs speakers by using the remote

On the Sony, yes. I have the TV speakers set to off and run the audio through my stereo.

I would assume the other makes are similar in this regard.

I run the TV audio through the hi-fi.

Damned awesome - especially if you are viewing things like 'Miles Electric'.

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Agreed. The only problem I have is that sometimes the audio and video get out of sync (the stereo amp processes the sound slightly faster than the TV processes the image), but there is a feature on the DVD player to adjust for that. Unfortunately, it seems that the A/V gap shifts a bit through any given DVD, but it isn't a serious enough of an issue to get me to listen through the TV (in which case the probem never occurs at all).

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My personal opinion, which others will doubtless say is insane, is that the X-series is not worth the premium over the S-series. It looks a little better, but not two or three grand better IMO. Then again:

1) I appreciate good video quality, but don't obsess over it

2) My budget may be different from yours

3) I'm also anticipating that the top-end technology today is going to look like the bottom-end technology in a couple years. IM somewhat informed O it will be a couple years before the rate of progress starts to flatten out.

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good points, but in a paltry 32" the difference is less than $200.00 from other sony series..

in any event, there's no way i'm going to consummate a deal until well after the christmas season. something (history perhaps?) tells me that msrp's will soften no later than second quarter '07.

-e-

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Except for the latest 1080p sets or Sammy's DLP LED, prices have already dropped a lot imo. The way technology goes these days, you can spend a lifetime waiting for better/cheaper devices. I bought a 56" Samsung DLP a few months back for $1500 shipped and it's already a couple of hundred bucks cheaper. But HDTV looks so fine on it i wish I stepped up and bought it months earlier.

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good points, but in a paltry 32" the difference is less than $200.00 from other sony series..

in any event, there's no way i'm going to consummate a deal until well after the christmas season. something (history perhaps?) tells me that msrp's will soften no later than second quarter '07.

-e-

Really??? Wow, was I off base!

In that case, the X series does have a better picture, even to my not-too-obsessive eyes. I'd personally spring for the extra couple hundred bucks.

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yep, the sony 32" xbr (2K msrp) is available for $1299.00 + $28.00 shipping via an amazon vendor. i'm in full on pavlovian salivate mode after auditioning several sets over the past couple months and falling in love with this model. to my eye, which is hardly obsessive, the image blurring is virtually non-existent while the imaging seems warmer, richer (which is so completely subjective). my burgeoning film collection is dying to be seen on it.

-e-

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The way technology goes these days, you can spend a lifetime waiting for better/cheaper devices.

Ain't that the truth. I certainly wouldn't waste time waiting for the supposed next great thing. I spent $2,200 for my 42" Sony LCD RP 3 years ago. I could get better quality today for less money (although I must say, I think mine holds up surprisingly well after 3 years) but we've gotten immeasurable enjoyment out of this TV.

My wife thought I was nuts when I bought it, but within days she understood. We're still in awe of it after all this time.

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I agree. If you simply want a large screen, or if you watch a lot of DVDs or higher definition sources, now is the time to get a LCD (or plasma), because >42" screens have become affordable and the image quality has improved a lot.

On the other hand, there is no point in replacing a CRT screen with a small LCD (32") to watch standard definition TV, except for the convenience (flatness and reduced weight).

It will a couple of years until the next great thing (SED screens) becomes a realistic purchasing option.

During the 2006 Consumer Electronics Show, Toshiba showed working prototypes of SEDs to attendees, and indicated expected availability in mid-to-late 2006[8]. Toshiba and Canon again delayed their plan to sell the television sets to the fourth quarter of 2007[9]. Analysts think the long ramp-up to mass-production will give LCD and plasma screens a chance to further drop in price, thus becoming harder to compete with. Toshiba cited pricing pressure as a reason for the latest delay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-condu...emitter_display

Edited by Claude
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