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Vintage Vinyl - Do You Store LPs IN or OUT of the sleeve???


Eric

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When shipping used lps, the standard seems to be to remove the lp from the jacket. I guess the idea is to prevent the lp from splitting the jacket seam enroute. My question - once the lp arrives, should the vinyl be stored outside of the sleeve (but within an inner sleeve and next to the jacket - all wrapped snug by an outer sleeve)?

For the record, I have owned jazz lps for 25 years plus and have always stored the lps inside the jacket. To my knowledge, I have never split a seam. But now, I am wondering if I should make a switch. Part of me thinks the benefit of "lower exposure to seam splits" would be offset by "potential damage to the vinyl from storing lps out of the jacket". Part of me thinks I would never get so anal as to even pose this question. Thoughts and abuse welcome ...

Edited by Eric
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Depends on the condition of the jacket, or if the jacket itself is made of especially fragile material. In such cases, I store outside. Flimsy Futura, Birth and Euro private jackets get this treatment. Also, a few handmade or silk-screened covers that I have are stored separately. If I'm really worried, I keep a piece of cardboard in between the jacket and the LP, and store in a self-sealing sleeve.

Ship outside, always...

Edited by clifford_thornton
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I always store the LP behind the sleeve, in one of those Japanese anti-static inners, when I can get hold of them.

Me too, or between the sleeve if it's a getefold cover. And all inside in a plastic outer sleeve, for dust.

I always store my lps outside the cover but wth a plastic cover over everything. Ring wear and seam splits are my reasons too. I know it's a little anal, but I want to protect the covers as well as the records. After all, a lot of the covers are works of art too!

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I always store the LP behind the sleeve, in one of those Japanese anti-static inners, when I can get hold of them.

Me too, or between the sleeve if it's a getefold cover. And all inside in a plastic outer sleeve, for dust.

Yep, I do the same with one of those thick PVC covers. Plus cardboard inner if its a flimsy rarity.

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I always store the LP behind the sleeve, in one of those Japanese anti-static inners, when I can get hold of them.

Me too, or between the sleeve if it's a getefold cover. And all inside in a plastic outer sleeve, for dust.

Yep, I do the same with one of those thick PVC covers. Plus cardboard inner if its a flimsy rarity.

Now that's is on the edge of psycopathology :D

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Great minds think alike... :)

Or maybe we are both anal retentives... :huh:

I wouldn't tell it to your psychoanalist, be elusive: Uh, yes, I like music, it relaxes me...no, actually, you know, I am not a real collector...just like jazz. No, I don't spend too much money on it, you know, used vinyl is cheaper... :w

Edited by porcy62
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I keep my sleeves in a different building than the LPs. The sleeves are kept in a fireproof concrete vault within an underground chamber. The walls of the concrete vault are two feet thick, and can withstand a direct hit by a hydrogen bomb. This building is in an undisclosed location.

Then, each LP is stored in another undisclosed location, in a dust free, "clean room" certified chamber, slightly larger than the LP itself. Each chamber, one for each LP, features air blowing so that the LP is suspended in mid-air within the chamber, never touching any surface.

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I keep my sleeves in a different building than the LPs. The sleeves are kept in a fireproof concrete vault within an underground chamber. The walls of the concrete vault are two feet thick, and can withstand a direct hit by a hydrogen bomb. This building is in an undisclosed location.

Then, each LP is stored in another undisclosed location, in a dust free, "clean room" certified chamber, slightly larger than the LP itself. Each chamber, one for each LP, features air blowing so that the LP is suspended in mid-air within the chamber, never touching any surface.

Didn't you shield the chambers? I am saying it because cosmic uncharged particles may damage the pigments of the sleeves in long term, common concrete doesn't do the job. My suggestions is a combination of magnetic field and XXX materials. You can find the formulas on NASA website.

Edited by porcy62
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I keep my sleeves in a different building than the LPs. The sleeves are kept in a fireproof concrete vault within an underground chamber. The walls of the concrete vault are two feet thick, and can withstand a direct hit by a hydrogen bomb. This building is in an undisclosed location.

Then, each LP is stored in another undisclosed location, in a dust free, "clean room" certified chamber, slightly larger than the LP itself. Each chamber, one for each LP, features air blowing so that the LP is suspended in mid-air within the chamber, never touching any surface.

I'd go to that expense too if I had your collection of Boots Randolph sides.

:g

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I've never heard of shipping the LP outside the sleeve, nor have I ever received any like that. If packed in a box correctly, how could shipping inside the sleeve lead to seam splitting. And what about the protection of the LP? Isn't it more likely to crack or scratch en route if shipped outside the sleeve?

(From someone who obviously doesn't trade much in vinyl.)

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I've never heard of shipping the LP outside the sleeve, nor have I ever received any like that. If packed in a box correctly, how could shipping inside the sleeve lead to seam splitting. And what about the protection of the LP? Isn't it more likely to crack or scratch en route if shipped outside the sleeve?

(From someone who obviously doesn't trade much in vinyl.)

Doesn't matter how well it's packed in a box, an LP can and will move around inside a sleeve during shipment. Think about it - the LP has more mass than the outer or inner sleeves by far, so if it shifts back and forth even a little bit, it can definitely split the seams of the sleeves, especially if those sleeves are old and fragile.

This used to drive me crazy when I'd buy laserdiscs from eBay sellers who didn't have a clue how to pack them. Laserdiscs are considerably heavier than LPs, and especially in the later days of the format the outer sleeves kept getting flimsier and flimsier. Combine those conditions with the frequent use of inner plastic sleeves shaped like semicircles which allowed the maximum possible amount of shifting/movement of the disc within the outer sleeve, and it wasn't uncommon for me to receive a disc that had completely punched through all three closed seams of the jacket. :tdown

As for cracking or scratching if shipped outside the sleeve, there shouldn't be any problems so long as the disc in its inner sleeve is wrapped up against the outer sleeve with bubblewrap or something similar. If you want to provide maximum protection, you'd probably also "sandwich" the disc/sleeve between two sheets of cardboard or something similarly stiff, then put that inside a properly-sized box (one that's large enough for the disc to lie flat in, not wedged in diagonally).

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I've never heard of shipping the LP outside the sleeve, nor have I ever received any like that. If packed in a box correctly, how could shipping inside the sleeve lead to seam splitting. And what about the protection of the LP? Isn't it more likely to crack or scratch en route if shipped outside the sleeve?

(From someone who obviously doesn't trade much in vinyl.)

If the LP is shipped in the sleeve, and tightly sealed, you may not have a seam split, but you can get ringwear.

If the LP is shipped in the sleeve, and not tightly packed, the vinyl can slip and create a seam split.

Either way, its bad news.

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Nicely said, Hot Ptah! The paranoid fear of cover wear really goes to funny extremes sometimes ... :D :D

Or should I just consider myself lucky for being outside the U.S. and therefore owning a larger percentage of non-U.S. pressings?

IMO a lot of wear can be avoided just by halfway careful handling and a minimum of common sense (e.g. by not cramming your shelves too full so you have to squeeze your records in and drag them out), and all this without any fancy separate storage tricks, etc. I don't like storing EVERY single album in plastic sleeves; this makes it pretty hard to see where everything is anyway once your collection exceeds a certain (sizable) limit (as the spines of the covers become hard to read inside the plastic outer sleeves).

Anyway, in my collection my 50s and early 60s originals (all bought secondhand) all go in plastic sleeves to minimize further rubbing and ring wear but the records ALWAYS go inside the sleeve where they belong. Sole exception: Notoriously tight fits such as some of those Crown LP's.

And with more recent (re)issues that are not really going to appreciate much in the long run anyway it does not matter that much. After all the way your collection stays in good shape also is a matter of handling; most of my records have stood up pretty well (even many U.S. pressings), and even on SECONDHAND records bought years ago the covers haven't deteriorated any further at all in MY possession ...

... that is, with one major exception: those shoddy 70s U.S. cardboard thingies... ;)

Those DREADFUL U.S. cardboard covers used ever since LP's came along really were lousy indeed compared to many European pressings of the late 60s/70s/80s. Those hyper-flimsy paper strips that folded over the edges and onto the rear or front end to hold everything together practically BEG for seam splits to happen. How can you seriously expect TWO cardboards AND something more or less thick in between to be held together by a thin PAPER strip if you continuously ply those cardboard layers open at one end to remove the contents? ;)

Would cardboard or reinforced paper patterns of twice the LP size that fold over and just are glued together along their flaps (made of the same thicker material) have been outside the maximum size of what U.S. printing plants apparently were able to handle for decades? Not very flattering for that industry in #1 among the industrialized nations. ;) ;)

And then to top it all, those 70s U.S. pressings with their awful printing ink quality that caused ring wear by rubbing off in practically NO time at all. I've seen lots of them literally develop ring wear in the shop racks as soon as they remained in the racks for more than a couple of weeks.

With that kind of shabby cover printing quality I'd not even be sure ring wear can be avoided by storing the record outside the cover (as recommended here). Not much difference if your record rubs against that lousy priner's ink from the outside or inside (witness the color of a ring-worn front cover found on the back of the adjacent cover against which the cover has been rubbing on the shelf... ;); in that case it'd just end up on the inner sleeve now stored outside).

Prestige and Fantasy albums of that time were particularly bad among jazz labels. Quite a few of my U.S. Prestige twofers of the 70s bought brand new back then have developed considerable ring wear through the years in my vinyl rack from rubbing against their neighbors on the shelf (not ideal, I know ... now I know better ...) YET LOTs of German or French printings bought new at the same time are almost as pristine as they were when purchased.

(Note I am talking about 70s or early 80s issues - 50s European pressings often had quite thin and fragile covers - yet even the ring wear on those older covers hardly ever caused any loss of printer's ink or discoloration, just shading of the record contours on the covers)

Funnily enough, ring wear was nowhere near as much of a problem with those LAMINATED 50s EmArcy LP's and similar labels. Even VG copies I cam across looked pretty good, ring-wear wise ... A prime example of how you can save in the wrong place ...

Edited by Big Beat Steve
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Always, always ship outside the sleeve.

If I have a poly-sleeve, I tend to keep the vinyl out of the sleeve. Isn't this a way to avoid ringwear?

Duh - and I thought ringwear was good. I used to take LPs to parties and get people to rub them to induce premature ringwear.

:g

MG

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