Complete Mozart Piano Concertos

[Larry Kart]

it's not THAT elusive!! it's only the modern instrument perfect technique hegemony that makes it seem so, also the gross misunderstanding of Mozartean 'style,' which even at its most 'galant' should never be precious, any more than CPE Bach should be precious. death to public radio Mozart!!

also, there's PLENTY of Mozart that can be played for background-- most of the serenades, dances, etc-- it's asinine, and just plain wrong to treat the PCs that.

by far the most important thing is to understand the operatic rhetoric of these works which-- like an opera-- DO allow for a variety of valid performance depending on circumstance, they should all be DISTINCT (if not Dink Johnson).

the use of period orchestras is an important step in that direction thought not the only one; Schnabel, for instance, figured out a legit approach with people far more versed in Wagner and Brahms.

the real question as with Handel is ORNAMENTATION.

try these on like your moms favorite panties--

K. 595--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zfNW9XQ9ME

K. 540--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y36tQ56C3b8

Robert Levin on Mozart sonatas--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWKbOGMqDVw

Bilson Haydn--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvbWnR5QKFE

Dink Johnson >>>>>>> Keith Jarrett too (tho' Jarrett's no worse than Uchida)

It's always been interesting to me that I've heard far more forgettable performances of the Mozart concertos than any of the other standard repertoire piano concertos, from Beethoven through Rachmaninoff. The balance in Mozart -- between intensity and repose, grace and guts, pulse and relaxation, respect for classical structure but also depth of feeling -- is really hard to get right.

That's been my experience, too, darn it. All I can do is point to/enjoy the pianists who bring the music to life for me (e.g, Perlemuter and Rubinstein) and wonder why so many others don't.

I'm reminded, too, of a revelatory performance of the Clarinet Concerto with Karl Leister and (to my disbelief) Karajan (on EMI, in a box with other Mozart wind concerti played by BPO principals of the time). Not that there aren't plenty of nice or better recordings of the work, but there was a certain "instantaniety" of rhythm to Leister's phrasing that made this familiar piece seem like I'd never before heard all that was there.

It has something to do with the fundamental transparency of the music and the purity of the melodic expression. It looks fairly simple on the page and doesn't require finger-busting technique, but it's tricky to get to the emotional core of the music. Sometimes chefs will say that the hardest thing to do is to perfectly roast a chicken -- not fancy techniques, no fancy sauces, no layers of ingredients. Just pure fundamental technique. Not the most sublime metaphor perhaps, but maybe great Mozart is as elusive as the ideal roast chicken.

Didn't like Staier much here, too "pecky"; much preferred Bilson. Moms, if you're familiar with Anthony Newman's fortepiano recordings of the Mozart sonatas, what do you think? I have Vol. 1 and am impressed. OTOH, as with many fortepiano performances I've heard of this repertoire, so much seems to come down to the choice of instrument e.g. Bilson's warmer, more "piano-like" one versus Staier's tinkle box. Also, I've just ordered from Berkshire the Music & Arts two-CD Casadesus set of Mozart concerti (in concert, with various French radio orchestras and conductors).

[J.A.W.]

I've tried recordings with fortepiano of works by composers like Mozart and Beethoven, and I can't stand the sound of the instruments that were used. Thin, some sounded like a "tinkle box" as Larry so aptly described it, and they all fell away in forte passages, especially in the higher octaves. Not for me.

Edited June 7, 2011 by J.A.W.

[Larry Kart]

Four very good Mozart concerti performances from Casadesus (in concert from 1958-69 with the French National Radio Orchestra and various conductors -- Von Matacic, Martinon, Monteux, and Zinman) at Berkshire, $9.98 for two discs:

http://www2.broinc.com/search.php?row=0&brocode=&stocknum=&text=casadesus+mozart+Zinman&filter=all&cd=1&submit=Search

Sound is a bit acidic, but Casadesus' rhythmic urgency is quite something.

[MomsMobley]

New Brautigam concerto series on BIS--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLHzeMBgS5o

Casadesus is as good as modern instrument Mozart ever got or will get, definitely.

[mandrill]

FWIW, a list of "great performances" of the Mozart PC from the reigning (albeit at times eccentric) rec.music.classical.recordings piano maven Dan Koren:

#9 KV271 Gilels, Richter

#10 KV365 Gilels/Gilels, Casadesus/Casadesus

#13 KV415 Michelangeli

#15 KV450 Michelangeli, Richter

#17 KV453 Bashkirov, Edwin Fischer, Richter, Casadesus

#20 KV466 Michelangeli, Richter, Schnabel, Rubinstein

#21 KV467 Gilels, Lipatti, Casadesus

#22 KV482 Richter, Casadesus

#23 KV488 Horowitz, Rubinstein, Casadesus

#24 KV491 Bashkirov, Fischer, Richter, Casadesus

#25 KV503 Edwin Fischer, Richter, Casadesus

#26 KV537 Casadesus

#27 KV595 Gilels, Richter, Schnabel, Casadesus

Don't always agree with Koren myself on these or any of his enthusiasms or execrations, though I usually find his enthusiasms to be quite reliable, more so than his put downs.

Just looking at this list i can see that Mr. Koren loves his Mozart played in grand style. No wonder he bashed Immerseel to the point of insulting in one of his threads. I'll take Immerseel over likes of Horowitz & Rubinstein in Mozart any time.

[B. Goren.]

WA Mozart was born 256 years ago today.

[king ubu]

just posted over in the sonatas thread before remembering this one, which I've perused before ...

in the PC's ...

Perahia ... et al are fucking butchers.

Really? I found them very good!

But my favorites are Schnabel, the few I have by Gieseking (488, 491), Edwin Fischer, Rubinstein doing 491 with Krips (the others with Wallenstein are good but nowhere near Krips) and what I've heard so far of Casadesus was mighty fine, too (got to dig deeper there, the cheapo Sony 5 CD set is waiting to be explored), then Gould's 491, and some of Clara Haskil's, too.

...

I have heard quite a few pianists play the Mozart piano concertos. I personally find the Perahia recordings my favorites overall. There is an elegant quality to the way Perahia approaches the Mozart concertos that for me speaks to the times and environment during which these pieces were composed and performed. ...

I'm very much of this same opinion ... love the Perahias.

Mom's, can you try and explain your contempt for his recordings a bit more exactly? (Are you still around anyway?)

Almost forgot -- Arthur Rubinstein, four concerti from 1961 with Wallenstein and one from 1958 with Krips on two very full CDs (K.453, 466, 467, 488, and 491) from RCA:

http://www.amazon.co...06869583&sr=1-1

I love K 491 with Krips but somehow find the orchestra much less engaging on the Wallenstein recordings. Not Rubinstein's fault at all, but the Krips stands out for me.

[paul secor]

I was driving this morning and heard Mozart's piano concerto no. 23 - John O'Conor/Mackerras/Scottish C.O. It caught my ear, but I was driving so that doesn't necessarily mean much. Anyone have any thoughts or opinions?

[soulpope]

1 hour ago, paul secor said:

I was driving this morning and heard Mozart's piano concerto no. 23 - John O'Conor/Mackerras/Scottish C.O. It caught my ear, but I was driving so that doesn't necessarily mean much. Anyone have any thoughts or opinions?

I believe this performance is quite good .... John O`Connor`s interpretative approach - for some listeners him being a stickler for details - is obviously a matter of taste  .... my preferred performance is by Friedrich Gulda and Nikolaus Harnoncourt/Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra from 1982 (Mozart`s Piano Concerto 23 is coupled here with 26) ....

[paul secor]

Thanks for the feedback!

[MomsMobley]