How about some Sonny Criss ?

[davidsherr]

Welcome also to the Board, David and thank you for sharing your memories of the session.

I have the Horace Tapscott bio open in front of me so here's an extract of the text that refers to the session:

'The first day we went to the studio to record, we found another band there. All these other cats were around, like Dick Nash, Conte Condoli and Pete Christlieb. I didn't even know who Pete was then; he was just out of school. We came walking in with our guys and, man, we went off. I went off on Sonny first and then the producer from the record company. Don Schlitten from Prestige Records had brought in all these other cats. Sonny went crazy. He got drunk and got to hollering and screaming. So we had to get out of there and cool it. I walked out of the studio.

Cecilia came after me and said, "Baby, you spent the money already. You can get sued for this." We had paid bills and got out of some problems. So I had to go back and do it. We did get Everett Brown on drums, and their cats read the music well, but our cats had it down. They didn't need the music in front of them and we were getting a sound after playing the tunes at all the gigs. We had rehearsed every day, all day, because we had nothing but time. There wasn't much else going on for us during the day. And when we went to the clubs at night, we'd be just poppin'. I told the cats who did the recording that I wasn't angry with them, that this had nothing to do with them. It was between me and this guy, Schlitten.

That was a rough day, a real rough day.

After the experiences with Prestige and Flying Dutchman, my reputation was like, "He's really gone crazy now. No telling what he might do in the studio."'

I am at a loss as to what all this means. (Incidentally, I ordered the book which is supposed to be delivered on 8/28.)

Nothing like that happened. There was only one day and it began at 1PM and ended at 7PM, right on schedule. No one from Horace's band showed up except Everett Brown and Ray Draper (thanks for the clarification, Nico). No one "went off" on anyone and Sonny did not get drunk. No "crazy" no "screaming" no "hollering". No one walked out of the studio. As I have said, Sonny, not Don Schlitten, hired the band. Horace was thoroughly professional throughout the session, although clearly not an experienced conductor. I remember him, head down, leafing through the scores, grinning nervously when the union rep showed up.

Horace must have been paid pretty well for his work. ("We had paid bills and got out of some problems.") Remember that he was not yet established ("We had rehearsed every day, all day, because we had nothing but time. There wasn't much else going on for us during the day.") and the opportunity to have his work recorded on a recognized jazz label with a soloist like Sonny (and well known jazz musicians like Tommy, Teddy, Al, Conte,) must have been a big boost.

Horace was a nice guy, quiet, a little shy. I knew him from LACC and a few dance gigs we had played (and ridden to) together. He seemed slow to anger and when he did it would simmer rather than erupt. Maybe I just didn't know him well enough to see another side to him or maybe there wasn't any. I don't know what to make of the passage quoted above.

[davidsherr]

I got Songs of the Unsung yesterday and am up to page 90. Apparently he was considerably more volatile than I perceived. At school and on the gig he seemed pretty mild-mannered, easy-going. But I met him a lot later than the incidents he recounts that involved fighting, and the environment at LACC, ca. 1961, was pretty collegial considering how competitive musicians (especially young ones) can be. He was well accepted by then.

He seems to conflate his two experiences at LACC. He attended in the early 1950s and again in the early 60s. He implies that his bad experience with Bob McDonald and his good one with Dominick DiSarro happened at the same time, but they were not there at the same time. McDonald left CC after the 1957-58 school year. DiSarro arrived for the 1958-59 school year. McDonald returned in the mid-1960s but by that time Horace was well into his career.

I still can't make heads or tails of the Sonny's Dream session story, a complete fabrication.

Edited August 27, 2008 by david sherr

[Niko]

about time to ask everett brown if still possible ! (according to isoardi's other book, he moved to kansas city, in the 80s and had parkinson's disease, isoardi interviewed him in 2000)

[Chas]

What recording studio was used for Sonny's Dream ?

[sidewinder]

I still can't make heads or tails of the Sonny's Dream session story, a complete fabrication.

Wow - Reading the book I'd assumed it was an accurate recollection of what actually happened but your comments completely over-turn them. Amazing how we'd assumed that such things were 'gospel'.

[Niko]

I still can't make heads or tails of the Sonny's Dream session story, a complete fabrication.

Wow - Reading the book I'd assumed it was an accurate recollection of what actually happened but your comments completely over-turn them. Amazing how we'd assumed that such things were 'gospel'.

it's funny, having a co-author who gets the scientific thing right doesn't mean the musician can't tell bs... wouldn't have expected this either (though looking back at the other isoardi book i would say, while tapscott comes across as a serious person in many ways, it does not completely blow me away that the story is half made up)

bottom line is, i guess, tapscott would have preferred to bring in lester robertson for dick nash etc but it didn't work out... (and this is what i would have guessed from the line-up anyway)

[davidsherr]

What recording studio was used for Sonny's Dream ?

I'm pretty sure it was Columbia Records but might have been RCA. When I am in LA (maybe Dec., maybe sooner) I'll see if I still have my 1968 calendar.

It sounds as if Everett Brown might not be well enough to be too much help, but Dick Nash and Pete Christlieb are still very active. Sonny and Dick were old, close friends and there is hardly a trombone player in Dick's class. I don't know Lester Robertson's playing. I don't know how much contact, if any, Pete and Sonny had other than that session and as I mentioned earlier, Pete played a solo that never made it to the record or the cd re-release with its alternate takes.

Edited September 4, 2008 by david sherr

[Chuck Nessa]

What recording studio was used for Sonny's Dream ?

I'm pretty sure it was Columbia Records but might have been RCA. When I am in LA (maybe Dec., maybe sooner) I'll see if I still have my 1968 calendar.

The listed engineer is Mickey Crawford. I believe he worked for RCA at the time and Don always liked using RCA studios. Eight months later he recorded I'll Catch the Sun at RCA in LA.

[davidsherr]

I was wrong about Pete Christlieb.  He knew Sonny before I did.  Sonny encouraged him, invited him to gigs to sit in and was somewhat of a mentor.