Mingus - Pithecanthropus Erectus

[trane_fanatic]

How bad is the mastering on the 1990 US Atlantic issue CD?

I am able to buy a copy for $2, but have heard horror stories about the sound & been told to avoid it at all costs, literally. It's that terrible?

Edited May 8, 2008 by trane_fanatic

[RDK]

I can't imagine any Mingus sounding so bad that I wouldn't grab it in a heartbeat for two bucks!

[kh1958]

How bad is the mastering on the 1990 US Atlantic issue CD?

I am able to buy a copy for $2, but have heard horror stories about the sound & been told to avoid it at all costs, literally. It's that terrible?

I'm not sure that it's the mastering of that particular issue. It's a January 1956 Atlantic recording in mono. I don't have the original issue (or any pre-1970s LP issue), but every version of this I've ever heard (on LP and CD) make it sound like a sub-par engineering job. The music cuts through that concern, though--it's fantastic.

[JSngry]

Get it.

[Hot Ptah]

I have that CD. The sound is not that bad and the music is essential.

[BruceH]

I've only heard an earlier vinyl version, and the sound wasn't great, but certainly wasn't a deal-breaker either. For two bucks you can hardly go wrong. It's MINGUS fer pete's sake!

[porcy62]

I've got a black label early pressing. Not the greatest recording of my collection, but definitely one of the most treasured because of the Muzik. Get it, in any legal (and illegal) way.

That two bucks cd I mean. Don't even try to cross the italian border.

Edited May 8, 2008 by porcy62

[trane_fanatic]

I wonder what the sound on "The Passions Of A Man" Rhino/Atlantic box is like. Much better?

Edited May 8, 2008 by trane_fanatic

[jazzbo]

Better. Much better? Well maybe, I haven't heard that original cd for a long time. The box set sound is plenty good for Atlantic recordings of that vintage, straight honest transfer to digital. It's how I have all that material now and I never feel I need to find something better (and this has never been audiophile quality stuff anyway, but the music, man the music is something else).

[Claude]

In my experience, later CD "remasters" of most Mingus Atlantic sessions don't sound like new transfers but rather as if the existing transfers were tweaked a bit (more treble generally).

I have a 1998 european reissue of Pithecanthropus Erectus which sounds poor as well (for 1956 studio standards).

[Shawn]

BUY THE DAMN THING!

Hell you could almost get 2 of them for less than a gallon of gas.

p.s.

for what it's worth, that session wasn't really recorded that well in the first place (it's the weakest sounding in that box set), so I doubt the improvement would be earth shattering on the newer remaster.

Edited May 9, 2008 by Shawn

[Chuck Nessa]

Very few Atlantic sessions have great sound. Deal with it. Enjoy the music and feel blessed the machines were running.

[Late]

The music is indispensable.

If you want the "best" sound for Atlantic recordings (which might be an oxymoron), look to the Japanese editions. The latest 24-bit version of Jimmy Giuffre's The 3 (an Atlantic recording) sounds amazing. Much better, I think, than the Mosaic version.

I've always thought Ornette's work for the label was some of the best recorded stuff that Atlantic did (jazz-wise).

[Claude]

The music is indispensable.

If you want the "best" sound for Atlantic recordings (which might be an oxymoron), look to the Japanese editions. The latest 24-bit version of Jimmy Giuffre's The 3 (an Atlantic recording) sounds amazing. Much better, I think, than the Mosaic version.

I've heard a japanese 24bit remaster of "Mingus at Antibes", and it sounded horribly bright and thin compared to a european late 90's reissue.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Very few Atlantic sessions have great sound. Deal with it. Enjoy the music and feel blessed the machines were running.

I was thinking that a few days ago, listening to Milt Jackson's "Plenty, plenty soul" (Japanese AMCY). I don't have too much from the fifties - a few Ray Charles, is most of what else, I think. "Soul brothers" isn't too hot, either. Well, the music is...

But this is in marked contrast to their fifties R&B recordings, which sound great to me.

I think Atlantic's recordings did improve in the sixties.

MG

[kh1958]

Blues and Roots and Oh Yeah are well recorded. The Clown is better recorded than Pithecanthropus Erectus, but compare it to Tijuana Moods, featuring almost the same band, and the RCA recording is far superior sonically.

[trane_fanatic]

Thanks for all of the feedback, guys! I think I'll just find a good price on the "Passions..." box used and buy that. Don't really need any more duplicates of material no matter how cheap it is.

[Late]

Any thoughts, twelve years later, as to what compact disc edition of Pithecanthropus Erectus sounds best? ("Best" being a relative term, of course.) I have a Japanese K2 20-bit edition, and Mingus's bass is artificially boosted. Anyone here happen to have heard the (ridiculous term ahead) MQA-UHQCD edition?

The music, it goes without saying, is irreproachable.

[Chuck Nessa]

LOL!

The master tapes burned before the first cd edition.

 

Edited September 26, 2020 by Chuck Nessa

[bertrand]

4 hours ago, Chuck Nessa said:

LOL!

The master tapes burned before the first cd edition.

 

So it wasn't just unissued sessions?

[Kevin Bresnahan]

There doesn't appear to be a 1990 CD release of this title: https://www.discogs.com/The-Charlie-Mingus-Jazz-Workshop-Pithecanthropus-Erectus/master/176929

 I have a copy of the 1987 release and I don't recall it sounding terrible. In fact, given that a lot of the later releases could be compressed a bit, it might be the best that this date will sound on a CD release. The 1987 release has an alternate cover:

[sonnymax]

1 hour ago, bresna said:

There doesn't appear to be a 1990 CD release of this title.

Pithecanthropus Erectus was reissued in 1990 on CD in Europe (Atlantic 7567-81456-2). It likely features the same mastering as your 1987 domestic release. Personally, I like the 2011 Japanese SACD (WPGR-10003) better.

[kh1958]

5 hours ago, bresna said:

There doesn't appear to be a 1990 CD release of this title: https://www.discogs.com/The-Charlie-Mingus-Jazz-Workshop-Pithecanthropus-Erectus/master/176929

 I have a copy of the 1987 release and I don't recall it sounding terrible. In fact, given that a lot of the later releases could be compressed a bit, it might be the best that this date will sound on a CD release. The 1987 release has an alternate cover:

That is the cover from the late 1970s lp reissue. At that time the original  album was long out of print. 

[clifford_thornton]

well... there was a late 70s Japanese pressing, which would have been available as an import at the time.

[sonnymax]

1 hour ago, kh1958 said:

That is the cover from the late 1970s lp reissue.

True, but it was also used for some CD reissues in the late 80s, like the one Kevin owns.