Lester Young Mosaic set

[Edward]

This may have been commented upon elsewhere, but it seems that the Lester Young Mosaic set has been a strong seller. I purchased my copy when I placed an order for the Art Farmer/Benny Golson set, and, when it arrived yesterday, I was suprised to see that it was numbered 3,126 of an edition of 5,000 sets maximum. The set was released last spring.

Now, I realize that Mosaic sets are not shipped in strict sequential order, but, nevertheless, there is a strong correlation between an individual set's number and how many copies of the set have actually sold. Although there is obviously reason to doubt that the Lester Young set will continue to sell at this same torrid pace, anyone intending to acquire this set would probably do well to consider purchasing it with his/her next Mosaic order. If the set continues to sell at one-half the present rate, it appears that it will sell out (not time out) before the end of next year.

[ejp626]

Probably doesn't hurt that it is one of the smaller sets in terms of CDs. I really had to convince myself to get the Chu Berry (I believe 7 CDs) and it will be a similar struggle with the Armstrong, though I am sure I will buy it.

By the way, the Chu Berry is currently on back-order which suggests it is selling reasonably well.

[tranemonk]

hm.... I've got the Verve 7 CD set of Lester so I'm disinclined to get this one.... :mellow:

[J.A.W.]

hm.... I've got the Verve 7 CD set of Lester so I'm disinclined to get this one.... :mellow:

Why?

Lester Young's 1936-1940 recordings that are collected on the Mosaic set outclass his 1950s Verve dates, at least to my ears.

Edited March 12, 2009 by J.A.W.

[Ron S]

Now, I realize that Mosaic sets are not shipped in strict sequential order

Actually, the big boxes are. There was a discussion here about this several years ago, and Brad shared an email response he had received from Mosaic which stated that the big boxes are numbered sequentially by computer as they are shipped, as reflected by the printed serial number in the invoice and the hand-written number in the booklet. Which just confirms that the Young set is, indeed, selling very well.

[BeBop]

hm.... I've got the Verve 7 CD set of Lester so I'm disinclined to get this one.... :mellow:

Why?

Lester Young's 1936-1940 recordings that are collected on the Mosaic set outclass his 1950s Verve dates, at least to my ears.

I agree. There was no better Pres than 1936-40, in my opinion. I'd consider it among the five most-essential collections of jazz, ever, along with, Bird's Dial material, Louis Armstrong Hot Five/Seven, Miles' Classic Quintet, and Webster/Blanton Ellington groups.

...okay, don't hold me to that specific list for more than five minutes. But this Pres will ALWAYS be in the top five.

If you've already got of most of the material - aside from some of the 'new discoveries' - you're adequately covered. But you MUST have SOME of this!

Edited March 12, 2009 by BeBop

[jazzbo]

Agreed.

[WD45]

Could it be that since it is fewer discs/lower price, more people are ready to spring for it in the current economy?

I have been eyeballing it because of that price.

IT is one of the reasons that I was bummed the Braxton set was so many discs.

[John L]

It seems that Mosaic probably did get more orders for this set than expected. It went temporarily out of stock twice last year. I can't think of another Mosaic set that did that.

The music is incredible, of course.

[David Ayers]

So act now and don't let them jazztet your rear zone on this one!

[king ubu]

For international customers, smaller sets are much nicer to buy - orders under 100$ can be shipped surface and often slip by the customs. That includes sets of 3-5 discs only, alas (used to be up do 6CD sets, but not since their last prize raise).

That may be part of the fast selling... but also generally, I'd be happy to see more 4CD and 5CD sets. Of course if they go for a big body of work, sets will be larger and I'll still buy them, but I love some of the smaller sets from earlier years (Thad Jones, Jones/Lewis, Sam Rivers, Illinois Jacquet, Byrd/Adams, Curtis Fuller - just a few that come to mind immediately).

[tranemonk]

Now this has FAR more appeal to me than the Armstrong... and even slightly more than the Goodman....

Keep twisting my arm.... :blink: :0

hm.... I've got the Verve 7 CD set of Lester so I'm disinclined to get this one.... :mellow:

Why?

Lester Young's 1936-1940 recordings that are collected on the Mosaic set outclass his 1950s Verve dates, at least to my ears.

I agree. There was no better Pres than 1936-40, in my opinion. I'd consider it among the five most-essential collections of jazz, ever, along with, Bird's Dial material, Louis Armstrong Hot Five/Seven, Miles' Classic Quintet, and Webster/Blanton Ellington groups.

...okay, don't hold me to that specific list for more than five minutes. But this Pres will ALWAYS be in the top five.

If you've already got of most of the material - aside from some of the 'new discoveries' - you're adequately covered. But you MUST have SOME of this!

[mikeweil]

Seems I have to place this on my must order list for next month ...

[Fred]

I agree. There was no better Pres than 1936-40, in my opinion. I'd consider it among the five most-essential collections of jazz, ever, along with, Bird's Dial material, Louis Armstrong Hot Five/Seven, Miles' Classic Quintet, and Webster/Blanton Ellington groups.

...okay, don't hold me to that specific list for more than five minutes. But this Pres will ALWAYS be in the top five.

If you've already got of most of the material - aside from some of the 'new discoveries' - you're adequately covered. But you MUST have SOME of this!

I STRONGLY agree.

[JSngry]

It sold briskly to me...

[Chuck Nessa]

Taxi War Dance is required. Otherwise f***k off.

The Deccas, as a group, are more important but the Columbias are great!!!

[johnlitweiler]

Taxi War Dance is required. Otherwise f***k off.

The Deccas, as a group, are more important but the Columbias are great!!!

'Taxi War Dance,' 'Easy Does It,' 'Lester Leaps In,' 'Dickie's Dream,' all the Smith-Jones Inc. tracks (especially the quintet 'Lady Be Good,' Young's perfect solo) and probably some others I'm forgetting are utterly crucial, and they are all 1939-40 Columbia Basie-Prez works. More than the Deccas, these Young solos were a turning point for the jazz saxophone. Endlessly subtle and graceful. Chuck, I'm surprised - what makes you think the Deccas are more important?

[Chuck Nessa]

Taxi War Dance is required. Otherwise f***k off.

The Deccas, as a group, are more important but the Columbias are great!!!

'Taxi War Dance,' 'Easy Does It,' 'Lester Leaps In,' 'Dickie's Dream,' all the Smith-Jones Inc. tracks (especially the quintet 'Lady Be Good,' Young's perfect solo) and probably some others I'm forgetting are utterly crucial, and they are all 1939-40 Columbia Basie-Prez works. More than the Deccas, these Young solos were a turning point for the jazz saxophone. Endlessly subtle and graceful. Chuck, I'm surprised - what makes you think the Deccas are more important?

First, I apologize for my rude outburst. Sorry.

Now on to the Deccas which have a "loosie-goosie" feel that fits Lester to a tee. The charted discipline of the Columbias suited him for a while but ultimately led to his feeling "hemmed in" and his exit. This is not necessarily fact, just my interpretation of what I hear.

The Smith-Jones titles (including 'Lady, Be Good') pre-date the Deccas and amplify my point. 'Taxi War Dance" comes from the first Columbia session (six weeks after the last Decca) and 'Dickie's Dream' and 'Lester Leaps In' were small group recordings (not the 'band'). I love the Columbias but the Decca recordings were something else.

[johnlitweiler]

Taxi War Dance is required. Otherwise f***k off.

The Deccas, as a group, are more important but the Columbias are great!!!

'Taxi War Dance,' 'Easy Does It,' 'Lester Leaps In,' 'Dickie's Dream,' all the Smith-Jones Inc. tracks (especially the quintet 'Lady Be Good,' Young's perfect solo) and probably some others I'm forgetting are utterly crucial, and they are all 1939-40 Columbia Basie-Prez works. More than the Deccas, these Young solos were a turning point for the jazz saxophone. Endlessly subtle and graceful. Chuck, I'm surprised - what makes you think the Deccas are more important?

First, I apologize for my rude outburst. Sorry.

Now on to the Deccas which have a "loosie-goosie" feel that fits Lester to a tee. The charted discipline of the Columbias suited him for a while but ultimately led to his feeling "hemmed in" and his exit. This is not necessarily fact, just my interpretation of what I hear.

The Smith-Jones titles (including 'Lady, Be Good') pre-date the Deccas and amplify my point. 'Taxi War Dance" comes from the first Columbia session (six weeks after the last Decca) and 'Dickie's Dream' and 'Lester Leaps In' were small group recordings (not the 'band'). I love the Columbias but the Decca recordings were something else.

It's great to hear the band evolve on the Deccas and to hear Hershel Evans play. To me something of the band spirit began to vanish when he died, in 1938 already. They were playing charts by Henderson and Redman at the beginning and by Durham and Clayton eventually - 'charted discipline' or a decline in quality? (The great head arrangements like 'Jumping @ the Woodside' and my favorite 'Panassie Stomp' [incredibly hot] were a minority.) 'Charted discipline' isn't the issue, I think. The ensemble spirit of the best Basie Deccas is a rare and precious (in the good sense of the word) quality that no jazz group has been able to sustain for long. Think of Oliver 1923, JRM 1926, Parker-Gillespie when they met in 1945-6, Ornette 1959-60, Mitchell-Bowie-Favors 1966-mid-'67. That spirit results from a rare combination of personalities and characters and talents and times; people naturally change, grow apart, then. Like a drummer once told me, it's like having a good wife.

For me the Deccas have too many pop songs and novelties like 'Stop Beatin' 'Round the Mulberry Bush.' The fault of the times? Because there are some junk songs on some Basie broadcasts from the period. Or Jack Kapp's fault? I blame him for the trashy songs Louis Armstrong recorded (Louis does not play those on his radio broadcasts) and for the awful singer that destroys what began as a great Johnny Dodds session w/Charlie Shavers, among other crimes. (On the other hand, bless him for recording Lunceford, Webb, Kirk, Johnson.)

[John L]

The Decca and Columbia recordings are both essential (IMO). The Deccas perhaps capture the Basie band at its absolute peak better than the Columbias. But if I had to choose between the two for Pres, I would take the Columbias. One reason is that they give Pres a lot more room than the Deccas. Sometimes, Pres might not make as perfect use of that room, but still...l

My absolute favorite session from Columbia is the small group date that produced Live and Love Tonight. I would even give up both takes of Taxi War Dance and the entire Lester Leaps In session before that parting with that track.

Edited March 14, 2009 by John L

[Shrdlu]

I'm with you, Hans (and others), on Pres's 30s work being superior to most of the Verve material. If only the LP format had been available back then! As I posted elsewhere, I have some 30s airshots where Pres is able to stretch out, and they are marvelous.

Re the Decca vs the Columbia Basies, the early band (on the Deccas and the first few Columbia dates) was much better, as things were more casual back then. I really love those recordings. As time progressed, there was a transition to what is, for me, an over-arranged and over-rehearsed feel. The later recordings, from that point and for the rest of Basie's career, are boring, I think. It was just a formula. ("One more time", hee hee. Thad Jones, for one, got so sick of it that he eventually left.) Of course, if you take the 50s, for example, the soloists were nowhere near the caliber of the 30s guys such as Pres himself, Buck Clayton, Harry Edison and so on. And the original rhythm section was at the top of the list for all time.

[gmonahan]

I'm with Chuck here. The Deccas are much looser and they just seem to me to *swing* harder, and Prez is just transcendental on some of them. I know it's probably an unfair choice since it's a classic, but listen to his wild clarinet on "Jumpin' at the Woodside."

And I LOVE "Mulberry Bush"! Rushing is great on that recording! (There are very few recordings he *wasn't* great on!)

greg mo

[JSngry]

But....

The very best Prez w/Basie that I've heard is from some 1944 airshots.

[BeBop]

But....

The very best Prez w/Basie that I've heard is from some 1944 airshots.

The NBCs? Or the Lincoln Hotel Ballroom?

Is there a decent collection of these? Or will I have to continue to live with the scatterings across such stalt labels as Ajaz, Ajax, Jazz Anthology...

[JSngry]

The Lincoln.

AFAIK, there is no decent "under one roof" collection of these, unless the late, lamented Masters Of Jazz label got to them before they folded. God knows there should be. The best LP I've come across was on some label called "Everybody's". It was Everybody's EV-3002, and besides the '44 Basie items, it had 2 superb cuts by Prez's first post-Basie combo (w/Shad & John collins), as well as 1 cut by the Young Brothers Band. Sublime music from start to finish, and all I got it on is a 20 year-old cassette dub from a buddy of mine.

This stuff ain't exactly "common" by any stretch of the imagination, but hell, it has been put out there, if only on some already obscure, "collector's" labels. I guess all those damn pirates who just copy shit from legit labels are too lazy to do some real work...