False Dawns in Hi-Fi

[A Lark Ascending]

Given the speed of change in music formatting at present I was musing on a boring car drive today over some of the things that never really took off...not always because they were a bad idea, just not what the wider public wanted. In my listening lifetime I recall:

a) The 8 Track cartridge - surely the ugliest innovation of all time!

b) Direct to disc records - I recall these from the late 70s/early 80s - never completely understood them but it had something to do with the disc being cut as recording took place. I might have the name wrong. There were some jazz titles but limited numbers prevented this from ever being more than a minority interest.

c) Releases on reel to reel tapes - I might be imagining them but I seem to recall they existed.

d) The multi-CD autochanger in the boot of the car!!!!!

e) SACD - I've no reason to doubt the superior sound of these (I've never heard one) but this one clearly took music reproducing technology to a level where most listeners had no need to follow. I believe they are still being made.

f) Another one I might have imagined - booths in music stores where you can download tracks. Rapidly made redundant by online downloading...and, it has to be said, the imminent extinction of music stores.

As it happens I was listening to my iPod via one of those gadgets that are powered by the cigarette lighter and send a radio signal or some other voodoo to the car radio - I suspect we will be laughing our socks off about this little gadget very soon.

What other bizarre delights have we had?

Edited July 29, 2009 by Bev Stapleton

[jazzbo]

In my opinion 8 track tapes and pre-recorded 'reel-to-reel' tapes "made it." At least in the US. SACDs. . . well they've almost made it, they still might, they've had more longevity than many guessed. I'm really enjoying classical material on SACD, and there's quite a choice of titles.

Edited July 29, 2009 by jazzbo

[B. Clugston]

c) Releases on reel to reel tapes - I might be imagining them but I seem to recall they existed.

They did exist. I remember once seeing a reel to reel of one of Jimmy Giuffre's Verve records. Seem to recall they were still around in the 1970s though I never saw any in stores.

[A Lark Ascending]

In my opinion 8 track tapes and pre-recorded 'reel-to-reel' tapes "made it." At least in the US. SACDs. . . well they've almost made it, they still might, they've had more longevity than many guessed. I'm really enjoying classical material on SACD, and there's quite a choice of titles.

The only person I ever knew with an 8 track was a wealthy uncle c.1972-3 - his son made him buy one for the car and one for the house. I don't think they caught on here.

Never saw a pre-recorded reel-to-reel, though Revox machines were all the range when I was at university in the early 70s for those who could afford them. I had friends who built up nice collections of other peoples' record collections on those tapes (an earlier version of illegal file sharing!).

SACD certainly never made a big impression in the UK shops. There was never more than a small area of shelf space for SACD - I think they sold more directly out of Hi-Fi shops.

[Quincy]

a) The 8 Track cartridge - surely the ugliest innovation of all time!

I did a year or so of college radio in 1985. I was surprised to discover that 8 tracks were still being used, though not for music. Our 30 second public service announcements (or those we didn't read) were on 8 track.

My first stereo had an 8 track player as my best friend's older brother was adamant that it was a superior format to cassette. (He was institutionalized a few years later, though I don't think it for his format preference.) I only bought 8 8 tracks before I figured out I was better off sticking to vinyl. I still haven't replaced Fleetwood Mac Rumors, Montrose's 1st, or 2 Peter Framptons (Live and the unfortunate titled I'm In You.)

c) Releases on reel to reel tapes - I might be imagining them but I seem to recall they existed.

I still run into these. We have a record store that sells used ones, and I see them at garage sales too.

e) SACD - I've no reason to doubt the superior sound of these (I've never heard one) but this one clearly took music reproducing technology to a level where most listeners had no need to follow. I believe they are still being made.

Oh there's always debate about how or whether the human ear can hear the frequencies, but there are many fine releases, especially classical so I'm happy I took the plunge even though I was rather late. Although I have yet to buy any Hoffman is putting out a number of the Blue Notes on SACD. DVD-A/dualdisc is probably deader than SACD, but I happen to love the sound of the Talking Head reissues as well as the Neil Young 70/71 releases (which are now blu-ray.) As each are either packaged with a redundant CD or have the CD on the other side, it's easy to compare and yes, I prefer the high-res side thank you very much.

What other bizarre delights have we had?

To me the thought of audiophile 45 rpm records give me the willies, but if people like them and it gets them off the couch more often, who am I to pee in their punchbowl.

Edited July 29, 2009 by Quincy

[Jazzjet]

Given the speed of change in music formatting at present I was musing on a boring car drive today over some of the things that never really took off...not always because they were a bad idea, just not what the wider public wanted. In my listening lifetime I recall:

a) The 8 Track cartridge - surely the ugliest innovation of all time!

b) Direct to disc records - I recall these from the late 70s/early 80s - never completely understood them but it had something to do with the disc being cut as recording took place. I might have the name wrong. There were some jazz titles but limited numbers prevented this from ever being more than a minority interest.

c) Releases on reel to reel tapes - I might be imagining them but I seem to recall they existed.

d) The multi-CD autochanger in the boot of the car!!!!!

e) SACD - I've no reason to doubt the superior sound of these (I've never heard one) but this one clearly took music reproducing technology to a level where most listeners had no need to follow. I believe they are still being made.

f) Another one I might have imagined - booths in music stores where you can download tracks. Rapidly made redundant by online downloading...and, it has to be said, the imminent extinction of music stores.

As it happens I was listening to my iPod via one of those gadgets that are powered by the cigarette lighter and send a radio signal or some other voodoo to the car radio - I suspect we will be laughing our socks off about this little gadget very soon.

What other bizarre delights have we had?

MiniDiscs? I've got a player/recorder but don't use it much any more. Nice and compact format but never really caught on as far as I'm aware.

I used to work in a record shop in the late 60s and we stocked some 8 track cartridges. Not sure I remember selling any though.

I've often thought that there's got to be a workable business model for physical record shops today. Something that combines the physical ambience of a shop with the modern technology of digital downloads. Not sure what it is though - otherwise I would have made some money!

[A Lark Ascending]

I've often thought that there's got to be a workable business model for physical record shops today. Something that combines the physical ambience of a shop with the modern technology of digital downloads. Not sure what it is though - otherwise I would have made some money!

Can I suggest you don't experiment in Redruth!

[Hot Ptah]

8 tracks were a major format in the U.S. for many years. I think that many people used them as their main format, instead of LPs or cassettes. I think that all major rock albums were released on 8 track. Many people had 8 track players in their cars .

I remember articles about how 8 tracks sounded better than cassettes, from an audiophile standpoint, but the music would be interrupted in mid song while the tracks noisily changed.

I still see many 8 track tapes for sale at used music stores.

[BeBop]

I know they're still 'round-about in some form, but the laser turntable still seems to have been ahead of its time...and perhaps it always will be.

[rockefeller center]

SACD - LOL

[Chuck Nessa]

Still no mention of the various versions of quad lps (there was a battle of formats - SQ and QS) or quad 8s.

FWIW, initially 8 tracks (quarter inch tape) were superior in audio quality to cassettes but the lousy mechanics of the tape container ultimately killed it. The life of the 8 track was prolonged by the quantity of units installed in trucks. You could still find racks of 8 tracks in roadside diners a few years ago. Reel to reel tapes were championed by audiophiles when they were introduced (classical fans were the biggest supporters and the earliest stereo recordings were issued in that format) but this was sabotaged by the "industry" when they tried to save money by reducing the speed from 7.5 ips to 3.75 ips. Hardware improvements and new tape formulations (along with the introduction of Dolby) let the cassette prevail, but this was mostly a pop music format. The folks caring about sound stayed with vinyl.

Edited July 29, 2009 by Chuck Nessa

[BeBop]

How about a false sunset? The LP LIVES!

[BeBop]

I should be careful about overplaying the continued "life" of the LP. As a used product, it's still widely traded and pretty widely available...provided you're not looking for Blue Note original pressings or Sun Ra sold-at-concert-onlies.

As a new product, it's a big niche. I'm always amazed how much pop music comes out in this form, even today. But it's a niche. And damned expensive at that. Still, good to have around.

[Chuck Nessa]

The limitations of the lp format are rarely discussed.

[JSngry]

16 2/3 RPM

[Dave James]

Quadraphonic four channel sound.

Also, does anyone else remember 4 track tapes? They switched twice as often as an 8 track. Brutal. Or, the vibrasonic, a car attachment that routed the music through an echo device. In my cruisin' days I ran my 8 track tape player through two of these (one for each channel).

Up over and out.

[Chuck Nessa]

Quadraphonic four channel sound.

Also, does anyone else remember 4 track tapes? They switched twice as often as an 8 track. Brutal. Or, the vibrasonic, a car attachment that routed the music through an echo device. In my cruisin' days I ran my 8 track tape player through two of these (one for each channel).

Up over and out.

Guess you didn't read my post, though I never heard of vibrasonic.

[GA Russell]

Christmas of 1967 gave us a small portable unit (don't remember the maker) that played mini (in size and length)-4 track (in operation) cartridges. I had two tapes - Jimmy Smith with four songs from his Got My Mojo Workin' album and Stan Getz with four from from Jazz Samba.

It didn't plug into the wall. The flashlight batteries ran down in one day. I returned it after 48 hours.

A few years later I remember reading in Billboard about a unit that played discs with two songs on them. They were called something like hip singles because the discs would fit in your hip pocket. I never saw them in stores.

Our 1965 stereo's turntable played 16 2/3, but I never saw such a record.

Right now there is a new item whose name I don't recall, but I've seen them in stores. They are solid state, and plug into your cell phone and iPod. They also have a dedicated player for those who do not have an mp3 player. The item has a pre-recorded album, and blank space for you to move your own music onto it. I'm guessing that they are pre-recorded mini-SD cards.

And now that I think about it, nobody has mentioned the minidisc! I believe that they were quite popular around the world, particularly in Japan. I think that they never caught on in the US because Sony kept the price too high. Once the iPod took off, Sony improved the minidisc players and brought the prices down on the players and the discs, but it was too late.

[Alexander]

DAT (Digtal Audio Tape) and DCC (Digital Compact Cassettes). They both appeared around the same time as Mini-Discs and never really went anywhere (I know that DAT was used in studios for a long time, before they went totally digital. I'm talking about commercial DATs and DCCs. I remember seeing the spinner racks in Tower during the early '90s).

[Free For All]

Sensurround®!

[papsrus]

The Edison Talking Doll, touted as the " first phonograph marketed for home entertainment, with a pre-recorded cylinder."

Problem was, as soon as the child dropped the doll, the wax cylinders would shatter. Never took off, but a milestone in early recorded music. The first "failed" audio product? The creepiness factor may have also had something to do with its failure.

Even more creepy!

Edited July 30, 2009 by papsrus

[Larry Kart]

The limitations of the lp format are rarely discussed.

Storage space and amount of sonic information that can be put on one, but what else that I'm not thinking of? I still believe that the properly recorded analog LP (or 78 for that matter? but my experience there is limited) with the proper playback equipment can sound as good as a properly recorded digital CD with etc. Some would say sounds better than, but I've never done the necessary scrupulous A/B comparisons, usually preferring to listen to music.

[sidewinder]

d) The multi-CD autochanger in the boot of the car!!!!!

I used to have one. Bose !

Have a Miles 'Bitches Brew' quadraphonic 2LP set. That one is quite a laugh when the trumpet phases in and out of the various speakers. Hearing it in stereo is a bit of a shortfall though.

The peak of the cartridge market was when they were available as an option on music centres from Sanyo etc. as an alternative to the new fangles musicassette. Top of the line was the quadraphonic option of course. Peak of the market 1972-74.

I've also got a good number of Direct Cut/Direct-To-Disk LPs. The sound on these is superb - they were well tailored to jazz as the recording had to be done in one continuous session, no breaks I believe. Lots of good things on Japanese East Wind in particular - Cedar Walton 'The Pentagon' and 'Pitt Inn' among the best.

Edited July 30, 2009 by sidewinder

[sidewinder]

Even more creepy!

Bride of Chucky?

[A Lark Ascending]

The life of the 8 track was prolonged by the quantity of units installed in trucks. You could still find racks of 8 tracks in roadside diners a few years ago.

I'd forgotten that...they used to sell them in petrol garages (gas stations to you colonials). I recall there being a lot around in Germany in the early 70s when I used to visit my parents there.

I've also got a good number of Direct Cut/Direct-To-Disk LPs

That's the name! Never heard one but I do recall them being mentioned, I think, on Peter Clayton's late Sunday night Jazz on 2 programme.