Last Shop Standing (Whatever happened to record shops?)

[sidewinder]

Up for Bill's London report !

[BillF]

Called in at GRAMEX not far from Waterloo Station last week. The jazz is downstairs, classical on the ground floor. Not much jazz vinyl (the proprietor is a very nice chap and is keen to expand his selection) but they did have a couple of OOP Mosaic sets. I picked up the Condon Mob and if anyone is interested in the Prima/Manone, there was a copy of that one which is probably still there.

It came as a shock to see the old 'Tower' aka ex-Fopp at Picadilly Circus all boarded up and vacated - a real sign of the times . The nice Fopp store on Goodge St has also been closed, by the looks of it. "Rays Jazz" though was looking OK (with 'Empirical' doing a nice live gig in the de-jazzed cafe area). The jazz section is now moved to the 2nd floor and shares space with the DVDs and classical music. Still a good choice of music there.

Strangely though, in light of the above - Central London looked pretty vibrant with the West End restaurants doing good business and European tourists spending like crazy. Strange times indeed !

Was at Ray's on Tuesday and have to say I found things pretty glum, compared to my last visit two years ago. The removal of the café area has taken away the atmosphere and left a lot of space which has been filled with patently non-jazz material, such as movie DVDs and world music. And business is definitely not booming! In the 40 minutes I was there from about 4:30 only one other guy came in (depressingly as old as me) and, like me, left without purchasing. One order was placed by phone while I was there, which accounted for total business. Otherwise the only action was the counter guy's chatting up an admittedly very attractive young woman cleaner as she passed through the shop. Dobell's in its heyday it wasn't! (Digression: yesterday's Guardian carried a brief obituary on Doug Dobell's 50-something-year-old actress daughter.) In comparison, things were buzzing in the classical section next door. Things aren't helped by the prices. Last week I received the Dutch Jazz Orchestra's Moon Dreams from an American supplier via Amazon.uk which cost me £7.33 plus £1.21 p&p, a total of £8.54. Ray's wanted £14 for it! So I think what I was looking at in Ray's was the final death throes of the once-booming bricks-and-mortar jazz record trade. Sad! But it was nice to see the "Rare As Hen's Teeth" vinyl section was still there and even nicer to realise that some of those highly priced items are sitting on my shelf here!

As to Central London being vibrant, I agree about the tourists, but found very obvious signs of the recession as I retraced my walking route of two years ago from Soho to Euston station. Then, despite the lateness of the hour (about 7pm) I passed many plate-glassed media/creative industry workplaces full of trendy young people still hard at work as I headed station-ward in a throng of late commuters. This time the stream of commuters has dwindled to a trickle and some of those workplaces were now empty premises. My daughter, now London resident, has a poignant tale of two acquaintances who were coining it as suppliers of champagne to city slickers, but are now working as supermarket shelf stackers! All of this was a revelation to me, as Manchester appears to be booming. One of our biggest industries here now is higher education and the dearth of jobs for 18-year-olds has led to such an increase in student numbers that we now have 90,000 in the three universities, which is putting a massive strain on the infrastructure - especially public transport and roads.

Edited October 8, 2009 by BillF

[JohnS]

Sad news, I lost interest in the 'new' Rays years ago. Unless there's an unmissable concert at the South Bank I can't see me visiting London soon.

HOORAY, I've made Funkateer!

Edited October 8, 2009 by JohnS

[BillF]

Sad news, I lost interest in the 'new' Rays years ago. Unless there's an unmissable concert at the South Bank I can't see me visiting London soon.

HOORAY, I've made Funkateer!

Welcome to the Funk club!

[ornette]

The one I remember in Birmingham was just outside the city centre over one of the ring roads (don't ask me which...Birmingham's ring roads criss cross endlessly) at a place called, I think, St. Giles Circus (next to a large church, St Giles perhaps?). A jazz specialist shop with a hefty stock...I think it was the first place I saw Mosaics. Think its gone now.

That would be The Record Centre, run by the irrepressible Ray Purslow. Wide choice of modern jazz downstairs, vocals (including a massive Sinatra selection), swing, big bands upstairs. Closed in May 2007 on Ray's retirement. Picture shows the final day. This was the second shop. The first was also on Lower Loveday Street, a few doors on.

[The church is St Chad's, first Catholic cathedral built in England since the Reformation, designed by Pugin.]

I've found this thread fascinating since I was a regular visitor to jazz shops in central London in the sixties - I lived then in Hayes, so was familiar with Squires in Ealing, mentioned in an earlier post. Remember buying there 'How My Heart Sings' by Bill Evans, still a favourite.

I always started at Collet's (Ray's) in New Oxford Street - bought many BYGs there, always a great atmosphere in the basement. Then onto Dobell's (agree it was less friendly) and Asmans. I always liked visiting Mole, especially the first shop. A memory is of everyone listening to the radio - not jazz. It was the afternoon Graham Hick scored 405 not out at Taunton.

[Jazzjet]

Things aren't helped by the prices. Last week I received the Dutch Jazz Orchestra's Moon Dreams from an American supplier via Amazon.uk which cost me £7.33 plus £1.21 p&p, a total of £8.54. Ray's wanted £14 for it! So I think what I was looking at in Ray's was the final death throes of the once-booming bricks-and-mortar jazz record trade.

That's very much my experience. I've lost count of how many times I've browsed in my local ( soulless ) HMV, only to go home and order via Amazon for several quids saving. Mind you, the same is true of shopping for books but it hasn't seemed to have had the same dramatic impact on bricks and mortar book shops ( or not where I live anyhow ). Maybe its the ubiquitous 3 for 2 offers plus the in-store coffee stores. Book shops usually have a more friendly and welcoming atmosphere than record shops ( although that 'atmosphere' used to be part of the appeal of the old record shops ).

[J.A.W.]

Bill's report above makes me feel old and sad...

[Jazzjet]

I always started at Collet's (Ray's) in New Oxford Street - bought many BYGs there, always a great atmosphere in the basement. Then onto Dobell's (agree it was less friendly) and Asmans. I always liked visiting Mole, especially the first shop. A memory is of everyone listening to the radio - not jazz. It was the afternoon Graham Hick scored 405 not out at Taunton.

Ray ( of 'Rays Jazz' ) was a big cricket fan too and you would have been just as likely to hear the radio on in his shop. Must be a connection between jazz and cricket. Probably, as my wife says, hours of boredom interrupted by a few moments of excitement!

[sidewinder]

I always started at Collet's (Ray's) in New Oxford Street - bought many BYGs there, always a great atmosphere in the basement. Then onto Dobell's (agree it was less friendly) and Asmans. I always liked visiting Mole, especially the first shop. A memory is of everyone listening to the radio - not jazz. It was the afternoon Graham Hick scored 405 not out at Taunton.

Ray ( of 'Rays Jazz' ) was a big cricket fan too and you would have been just as likely to hear the radio on in his shop. Must be a connection between jazz and cricket. Probably, as my wife says, hours of boredom interrupted by a few moments of excitement!

I'm sure I remember listening in to 'Test Match Special' in the first Mole shop too !

I think I read somewhere (Jim Godbolt's book I think) that Ray was a regular in the 'Jazzers XI' that included at least one County-level player in its ranks.

[sidewinder]

Sad! But it was nice to see the "Rare As Hen's Teeth" vinyl section was still there and even nicer to realise that some of those highly priced items are sitting on my shelf here!

As to Central London being vibrant, I agree about the tourists, but found very obvious signs of the recession as I retraced my walking route of two years ago from Soho to Euston station.

I thought the 'Rare as Hen's Teeth' selection was pretty pricey - but there again it always was. OK, there was a Roswell Rudd 'America' French LP but at £50? I'll stick with my 'Free America' CD.

The recession must be hitting London as I've had no problem booking a couple of weeks accomodation there this week for later in the month. Damn good day rates for London, better than for at least 10 years. That's the positive side of this whole thing.

[Big Beat Steve]

Sad! But it was nice to see the "Rare As Hen's Teeth" vinyl section was still there and even nicer to realise that some of those highly priced items are sitting on my shelf here!

I thought the 'Rare as Hen's Teeth' selection was pretty pricey - but there again it always was. OK, there was a Roswell Rudd 'America' French LP but at £50? I'll stick with my 'Free America' CD.

Just as pricey as the items in the "Rare as Rocking Horse manure" bin that Ray's carried downstairs in the Blues section for a while. Hens' teeth upstairs in the middle of the jazz room and Manure downstairs back at the wall. I remember the first time I came across this downstairs rare items bin I noticed one of the rare items they had was a copy of the Cyril Davies LP released in the 70s on Doug Dobell's Folklore label (and bought new by me back then at Dobell's) - now (late 90s) going for 40 quid! Whew ... but I knew that in THIS case I definitely had done something right in my purchases!

[sidewinder]

I can remember seeing a Tal Farlow Norgran LP in that 'Hen's Teeth' rack at Shaftesbury Ave back in the 90s. Lots of dosh even then..

[ornette]

I always started at Collet's (Ray's) in New Oxford Street - bought many BYGs there, always a great atmosphere in the basement. Then onto Dobell's (agree it was less friendly) and Asmans. I always liked visiting Mole, especially the first shop. A memory is of everyone listening to the radio - not jazz. It was the afternoon Graham Hick scored 405 not out at Taunton.

Ray ( of 'Rays Jazz' ) was a big cricket fan too and you would have been just as likely to hear the radio on in his shop. Must be a connection between jazz and cricket. Probably, as my wife says, hours of boredom interrupted by a few moments of excitement!

I'm sure I remember listening in to 'Test Match Special' in the first Mole shop too !

I think I read somewhere (Jim Godbolt's book I think) that Ray was a regular in the 'Jazzers XI' that included at least one County-level player in its ranks.

An old school friend of mine, Tony Sawbridge, with whom I used to visit Ray's, played in the same (or a similar) team.

[sidewinder]

Got round to reading the book - and it is a great little read, very hard to put down once you start reading it. It works on 2 levels - both as a reminiscence of record shops and their characters up and down the land and also sort of as a business case study as to what goes wrong when the supermarkets, downloaders, pop-idol etc. start messing up the system. The section on Acorn Records I found particularly enjoyable as I have been familiar with that place since long after its inception and it is truly a miracle that it has kept going all these years. The founders were both music fans formost, which I'm sure helped a lot when times got tough.

Lots of funny stories in this book. I particularly llike the one of the customer asking for a record by 'The Loneliest Monk'.

Earlier today I was in 'Raves From The Grave', one of the shops featured in the book. They are apparently opening up a brand new store in Warminster, Wilts. later this month and Graham Jones, the author of the book will be giving a talk, accompanied with Xmas wine and refreshments. Would normally be totally unmissable but it looks as if I'll be in France that week.

Edited November 7, 2009 by sidewinder

[sidewinder]

As to Central London being vibrant, I agree about the tourists, but found very obvious signs of the recession as I retraced my walking route of two years ago from Soho to Euston station.

I'm still getting over the shock of seeing the old Virgin Megastore aka Zavvi on Oxford St morphed into a temporary chav-ette clothing emporium. That place was heaving with LP and CD buyers from the 70s right through to the 00's and, especially in the early years, thay always had a good-ish stock of jazz. Truly shocking !

Edited November 7, 2009 by sidewinder

[sidewinder]

Just to add also that when I was in West London a few weeks ago I tried to locate that short-lived branch of Honest Jon's near Cambridge Circus. I'm fairly convinced it was on Monmouth St, on the RHS as you head up towards the 'Circus'.

[J.A.W.]

The section on Acorn Records I found particularly enjoyable as I have been familiar with that place since long after its inception and it is truly a miracle that it has kept going all these years. The founders were both music fans formost, which I'm sure helped a lot when times got tough.

I bought a lot of jazz records from Acorn Music, based in the West Country - I think it was Looe, Cornwall, but I'm not sure. Are they the shop discussed in the book? What happened to the owner - I'm talking about the 1970s/1980s.

[sidewinder]

The section on Acorn Records I found particularly enjoyable as I have been familiar with that place since long after its inception and it is truly a miracle that it has kept going all these years. The founders were both music fans formost, which I'm sure helped a lot when times got tough.

I bought a lot of jazz records from Acorn Music, based in the West Country - I think it was Looe, Cornwall, but I'm not sure. Are they the shop discussed in the book? What happened to the owner - I'm talking about the 1970s/1980s.

I wonder if it is a different 'Acorn'. Acorn Records are based in Yeovil, Somerset, although I think they did have a second outlet for some time (short lived) in Weymouth, Dorset. The owner of Acorn is called Chris Lowe (the other founder, Rob, sadly passed away back in 1995).

Acorn have been around since about 1972. I bought my first Lps from them (Miles Davis 2LP sets) around '75-76.

Edited November 7, 2009 by sidewinder

[J.A.W.]

The section on Acorn Records I found particularly enjoyable as I have been familiar with that place since long after its inception and it is truly a miracle that it has kept going all these years. The founders were both music fans formost, which I'm sure helped a lot when times got tough.

I bought a lot of jazz records from Acorn Music, based in the West Country - I think it was Looe, Cornwall, but I'm not sure. Are they the shop discussed in the book? What happened to the owner - I'm talking about the 1970s/1980s.

I wonder if it is a different 'Acorn'. Acorn Records are based in Yeovil, Somerset, although I think they did have a second outlet for some time (short lived) in Weymouth, Dorset. The owner of Acorn is called Chris Lowe (the other founder, Rob, sadly passed away back in 1995).

It might not be the same. The Acorn shop I'm talking about moved south from north Devon to (again, if I remember correctly) Looe. I heard a rumour years ago - after I'd stopped buying from them - that the owner had died. I don't remember his name. Their main business seems to have been mail order.

Edited November 7, 2009 by J.A.W.

[A Lark Ascending]

Their main business seems to have been mail order.

It would have had to have been. The only passing trade in Looe is in mackeral.

Glad you enjoyed the book, Sidewinder.

I was in Hebden Bridge, West Yorks a few weeks back and had to pop into the 'prog-rock' shop mentioned and pictured in the book. Didn't buy anything but I did notice a copy of the book on display in the window.

[J.A.W.]

Their main business seems to have been mail order.

It would have had to have been. The only passing trade in Looe is in mackeral.

Hm, I don't remember the records being smelly. Maybe I didn't notice - I quite liked mackerel at the time

[A Lark Ascending]

You even know how to spell it correctly!

[J.A.W.]

You even know how to spell it correctly!

Amazing, isn't it

[A Lark Ascending]

Worth getting the packed mackerel with peppercorns. A quick, tasty mid-week meal!

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Worth getting the packed mackerel with peppercorns. A quick, tasty mid-week meal!

I like that, too!

MG