Jump to content

Fats Navarro biography


Recommended Posts

Q,

Where is Conception released?

LV

L,

It's more obscure than I thought. I have it on the Bird Box Vol. 5 (JUTB 3005) - it's listed as Conception/ Deception. However the Bird Box is now pretty hard to find. I also have it on Philology Bird's Eyes vol. 51. If you go to the Philology Home Page, look for the Live Catalogue. Down near the the bottom you will see the message:

!!!! PLUS 58 VOLUMES OF UNOFFICIAL BIRD'S EYES FROM VOL. 26 TO VOL.83 ( W 857 TO W 874 ) !!!! ASK FOR DETAILED LISTS !!!! It's one of those. (That is quite a list! :rolleyes:).

Also it's on a Charlie Parker Birdland Sessions Vol. 2 on Ember, and I think there is a Miles Davis Birdland 1950 (or somesuch title) that also has it.

Just to confuse matters more, on Bird's Eyes Vol. 51 there is a remarkable "Slow 52nd Street Theme", which supposedly features Miles, but which to my ears seems too advanced for Miles for the time, and may well be Fats! (All of this material comes from Boris Broadcasts, which may explain the dating problems).

I should clarify that the Bird/ Bud Fats/ session and the Birdland jam session are obviously different groups (although both sessions are included on Bird's Eyes 51, which is sub-titled Bird'n Fats in 1950). Bird makes only a brief appearance at the end of Conception/ Deception) . (In my previous post I said the rhythm section was the same for both sessions - certainly Blakey is on both, but Walter Bishop Jr. would seem to be the pianist for the jam rather than Bud).

Anyway these Fats Birdland sessions have so much incredible music, plus the intrigue. It'd be a great broadcast!

Q

Edited by Quasimado
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
  • 1 month later...

This book moves between narrative and music examples -- long sections of musical transcriptions and accompanying text. Loren Schoenberg and Bob Belden are both much better at that sort of writing than what's found here, which is not to discount the information which comes of it. Just very glad I've learned to read music somewhat in the last year because it will be essential to getting the most out of this book. Very glad, too, the transcriptions are in trumpet key.

The Birdland All Stars are listed as performing on June 30, 1950 with Miles and Fats; J.J. Johnson; Brew Moore; Tadd Dameron and Walter Bishop Jr.; Curly (Russell?); Art Blakey, Roy Haynes plus Chubby Newsome singing on two tunes. Fats is only on four tracks. Bishop and Haynes on Conception, Eronel and the last 52nd Street Theme only.

The authors point to Navarro's lack of wind and how hard that makes it for him to construct solos of any continuity. They say, "Many have commented Navarro plays poorly here (on Conception), not knowing the changes, but there is not much musical evidence for this. What is really hampering him is his physical condition and the unusual construction of 14 bars and a pedal point, a structure which he does not seem familiar with. Davis makes it difficult for him, by extending his solo 4 bars into his opening chorus. Navarro does manage to catch up and ends the first chorus of his solo correctly. In the next chorus things get messed up again. There are approximately 35 bars in the first A part, but after some yelling and help from the pianist, he comes back on the track. The third chorus works out fine. Miles Davis enters again after the piano solo and in his last solo it is he who messed up the form, his chorus lasting 64 bars. In the coda there is a saxophone, which sounds remarkably like Charlie Parker joined by Navarro. This has made some commentators believer that Parker was present. We think that it is Brew Moore playing a Parker-like phrase in his high register."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This book moves between narrative and music examples -- long sections of musical transcriptions and accompanying text. Loren Schoenberg and Bob Belden are both much better at that sort of writing than what's found here, which is not to discount the information which comes of it. Just very glad I've learned to read music somewhat in the last year because it will be essential to getting the most out of this book. Very glad, too, the transcriptions are in trumpet key.

The Birdland All Stars are listed as performing on June 30, 1950 with Miles and Fats; J.J. Johnson; Brew Moore; Tadd Dameron and Walter Bishop Jr.; Curly (Russell?); Art Blakey, Roy Haynes plus Chubby Newsome singing on two tunes. Fats is only on four tracks. Bishop and Haynes on Conception, Eronel and the last 52nd Street Theme only.

The authors point to Navarro's lack of wind and how hard that makes it for him to construct solos of any continuity. They say, "Many have commented Navarro plays poorly here (on Conception), not knowing the changes, but there is not much musical evidence for this. What is really hampering him is his physical condition and the unusual construction of 14 bars and a pedal point, a structure which he does not seem familiar with. Davis makes it difficult for him, by extending his solo 4 bars into his opening chorus. Navarro does manage to catch up and ends the first chorus of his solo correctly. In the next chorus things get messed up again. There are approximately 35 bars in the first A part, but after some yelling and help from the pianist, he comes back on the track. The third chorus works out fine. Miles Davis enters again after the piano solo and in his last solo it is he who messed up the form, his chorus lasting 64 bars. In the coda there is a saxophone, which sounds remarkably like Charlie Parker joined by Navarro. This has made some commentators believer that Parker was present. We think that it is Brew Moore playing a Parker-like phrase in his high register."

Thanks Laz. I just picked it up myself and am working through it.

I'm not really convinced about his Conception interpretation, but it's an opinion. The last line quoted above about Brew More playing "a Parker-like phrase in his high register" seems incredible to my ears. It's obviously Bird, at least on the take I have (imo)...

Still, overall I'm enjoying the book and learning a lot. It's a mine of information...

Q

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I'm seeing, too, there are a couple of other Navarro books with transcriptions which were previously available -- they choose not to repeat the transcriptions from the previous books in this volume, which is kind of a drag. Last night I read the passage where Fats hits the ultra high Bb. Ee-gad, man. I'm not sure if I quite follow what they mean by "talking gestures," at least not from the transcriptions. Will have to dig those out. And really want to acquire the full Band for Bonds broadcast now and get "Fats Flats."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Haven't purchased the book yet (that will come soon) but in the meantime I am relistening to the September 1949 New Jazz session with Don Lanphere and Al Haig which appears (all 18 takes of the four tunes) on the Rare Live Recordings (RLR) label. The Fats Navarro Complete Last Studio Session CD also includes a 7 minute excerpt of 'Lullaby in Rhythm' from a June 1950 broadcast from Cafe Society with a Tony Scott group with George Shearing on piano, Chuck Wayne on guitar, Leonard Gaskin on bass and Ed Shaughnessy on drums.

This hitherto unissued item was recorded by Bill Hirsch who also taped Charlie Parker in 1950 at Cafe Society!

Fats Navarro who was obviously not in top form at the time of the broadcast is splendid on the Lanphere date!

Edited by brownie
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Haven't purchased the book yet (that will come soon) but in the meantime I am relistening to the September 1949 New Jazz session with Don Lanphere and Al Haig which appears (all 18 takes of the four tunes) on the Rare Live Recordings (RLR) label. The Fats Navarro Complete Last Studio Session CD also includes a 7 minute excerpt of 'Lullaby in Rhythm' from a June 1950 broadcast from Cafe Society with a Tony Scott group with George Shearing on piano, Chuck Wayne on guitar, Leonard Gaskin on bass and Ed Shaughnessy on drums.

This hitherto unissued item was recorded by Bill Hirsch who also taped Charlie Parker in 1950 at Cafe Society!

Fats Navarro who was obviously not in top form at the time of the broadcast is splendid on the Lanphere date!

i have this "lullaby of rhythm" for years in my collection and i don´t think that it is fats navarro on trumpet! the trumpet sounds totaly different and has nothing from fats! in the "bird lore" charlie parker discography by piet koster (almere 2002) this tune is within the cafe society jam sessions from june 8, 1950. the personal is (possibly) kenny dorham, tp, tony scott, cl, dick hyman,p, possibly chuck wayne or mundell lowe, g, probably leonard gaskin,b, ed shaugnessy, d. the piano has the typical block accords of george shearing but dick hyman is a good possibility because he can play all (!) styles of jazz piano! just a suggestion.

keep boppin´

marcel

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i have this "lullaby of rhythm" for years in my collection and i don´t think that it is fats navarro on trumpet! the trumpet sounds totaly different and has nothing from fats! in the "bird lore" charlie parker discography by piet koster (almere 2002) this tune is within the cafe society jam sessions from june 8, 1950. the personal is (possibly) kenny dorham, tp, tony scott, cl, dick hyman,p, possibly chuck wayne or mundell lowe, g, probably leonard gaskin,b, ed shaugnessy, d. the piano has the typical block accords of george shearing but dick hyman is a good possibility because he can play all (!) styles of jazz piano! just a suggestion.

keep boppin´

marcel

Interesting...and thanks Marcel!

Another jazz mystery that needs to be solved!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Few weeks ago I purchased the new Fats Navarro bio written by Leif Bo Petersen & Theo Rehak. I´d say this is a dream that came true. I always have admired Fats and never thought there would be a comprehensive book about his live, his times and above all his music. This book has great reviews of about everything Fats recorded, rare fotos, solo transcriptions and everything.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 7 years later...

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...