Passing Ships

[Shrdlu]

There was a long thread on this, but the search facility did not find it, so maybe it was deleted.

I don't want to draw special attention to myself, but I have only recently heard this "new" album, and I really enjoyed it. The writing, soloing and overall vibe of the session makes it well worth releasing. There were even moments reminiscent of the early Blue Note Hill albums. It's definitely not a dud project.

One comment re the instrumentation. Michael (a great producer) operates in a hurry, and sometimes makes a minor error with this (such as the "alto clarinet" that is really an E flat contrabass, and a harpsichord on a rare Hubbard session that was listed as a celeste). I am pretty sure that the instrument played by Joe Farrell, listed as an "English horn", is really a regular oboe. The English horn, known more often as a cor anglais, has a characteristic deep, "nasal" sound that makes it a wonderful tone color in an orchestra; once you've heard one, you will recognize it anytime later. The sound I hear on the Hill date is the lighter, thinner sound of an oboe, and the part played is well within the oboe range; there would be little point in using a cor anglais for that part. A cor anglais passage is usually scored at or near the low end of its range, to take advantage of that special tone color.

[sidewinder]

You could well be right Shrdlu - I would have said this was an oboe too.

Mighty fine album by the way. Unfortunately my copy is giving skipping problems in the CD player but seems to work OK on other machines. I believe JohnS has had some problems playing this one too. Maybe the copy protection is the culprit?

[Daniel A]

...such as the "alto clarinet" that is really an E flat contrabass,

I think the E-flat contrabass is also known as a 'contra alto clarinet'. Maybe that was the reason for the confusion?

Not intended to sidetrack your 'Passing Ships' thread... B)

Edited December 19, 2003 by Daniel A

[Claude]

There was a long thread on this, but the search facility did not find it, so maybe it was deleted.

The thread is still there, you probably did not go back in time far enough with your search, as the default is only 30 days.

Andrew Hill - Passing Ships, initial impressions

[Swinging Swede]

Unfortunately my copy is giving skipping problems in the CD player but seems to work OK on other machines. I believe JohnS has had some problems playing this one too. Maybe the copy protection is the culprit?

It very well could be. To prevent ripping, lots of errors are inserted in the audio tracks to make them unlistenable on a computer. But the errors may be more than what the error correction scheme on some regular CD players can handle as well. Or it may be that a scratch, that wouldn’t affect the playability of a regular error-free CD, is enough to push the error level over the edge and make the disc skip. This is exactly what Philips has warned of: that normal wear and tear will make these discs unplayable in a few years. There is however a simple solution: Get the American CD versions instead.

[JohnS]

Not only did mine skip, the player took ages to recognise the disc. The replacement cd seems fine but in the meantime I have changed my cd player.

As skipping errors seem so uncommon these days I'm blaming copy protection, though that said this is the first to show any problems. I shall definitely think twice about buying Euro Blue Notes in future.

[John C]

Its definitely the copy prottection. My CD player wont play them either.

Sidewinder you can diagnose the problem on your player like this:

"an easy way to check the PIC type onboard a player is to switch on the player without a disc inside and then press and hold down the PROG button (making sure, of course that the Softkey is selected to CD) until the display shows a code as follows;

CD3.5/CD5/CDX/CDS2:

P103-108 & P501 = No Copy-Protection update onboard.

P109 = Copy-Protection replay enabled.

P315 = Copy-Protection replay and enhanced features enabled (withdrawn - see below)."

£35 quid to have an upgrade to your player if needed.

John

[Shrdlu]

If Blue Note has some way of assessing customers' reactions to this, surely they will dump the "protection".

Claude, you're probably right. It is hard to keep up with settings on the computer, stoves, cars etc. There is so much trivia to remember. I'm usually tired when I look at this site, too.

That low clarinet IS sometimes called a contra alto clarinet, Daniel (daft name, isn't it?), but they should still give it a correct name. When I first saw the listing, I was expecting to hear the real alto clarinet, which is just a fifth lower than the standard Bb clarinet.

Getting back to the Hill album, my favorite track so far is the title track, a modal piece somewhat in the vein of several modal classics.

[sidewinder]

Its definitely the copy prottection. My CD player wont play them either.

Sidewinder you can diagnose the problem on your player like this:

"an easy way to check the PIC type onboard a player is to switch on the player without a disc inside and then press and hold down the PROG button (making sure, of course that the Softkey is selected to CD) until the display shows a code as follows;

CD3.5/CD5/CDX/CDS2:

P103-108 & P501 = No Copy-Protection update onboard.

P109 = Copy-Protection replay enabled.

P315 = Copy-Protection replay and enhanced features enabled (withdrawn - see below)."

£35 quid to have an upgrade to your player if needed.

John

John - thanks for the info, I'll give it a go. I'd suspected the copy protection from the start. First time this problem has ever been ouncountered on this machine.

Having said that, I'd better try the copy of 'The Flip' that I've just picked up ..

[sidewinder]

Damn - its a 'P1.06'

US Conns for me from now on...

Now - if only they issued them still on 180g vinyl..

[Bluerein]

I've just finished comparing the sound of the EU copy protected Passing Ships and The Flip against the US non copy protected ones and.......

There's a sound difference too!! The US versions have more air around the instruments. The cymbals for instance have a far more realistic ring on the non copy protected disc's.

So that's even worse imo.

Michael C (who asked me to compare them in the first place) was affraid this was the case and will conduct his own survey in US studios to confirm my findings (or trash them because I'm only human too!!!).

Keep you posted and all the best,

Reinier

[Claude]

Thanks for the info, Reinier. I hope Michael C. has some influence on EMI's decision to copyprotect their releases. I've seen some new EMI Classical titles being copycontrolled too (Prokofiev violin concertos), but most of them are not. EMI should know that it is counterproductive to do that with releases that are mainly bought by collectors.

[JohnS]

From a small sample of friends and board members around 75% of have unplayable copies of the copy protected Passing Ships. As I returned mine to the dealer presumably it will end up at back at EMI eventually. Maybe someone there will pick it up. Writing to EMI, from past experience, is a waste of time.

[7/4]

I had no problems listening to it on my new Win XP box.

[Shrdlu]

I've not had the pleasure of seeing a copy-protected Blue Note, but this might help.

A few days ago, my daughter wanted to play one of her pop CDs on the computer while hanging in a talk-room online. No copying or selling pirate copies in the street: she just wanted to play the thing. She called out to me that it would not play. I tried to read it in Nero, but was unable to get at the music.

Now, a few years ago, when the subject of copy protection came up somewhere, I bookmarked this page against a rainy day

http://www.sonicspot.com/alternatecdfsvxd/...atecdfsvxd.html

It had been sitting dormant on my favorites list since that time. Anyway, I downloaded the software (a substitute driver for the CD drive) and my daughter's CD played fine after it was installed. Since then, I have made a couple of custom burns (of unprotected CDs) for myself (editing the announcements out of two Gerry Mulligan concerts) and the CDrs sound fine, so the new driver has not harmed the operation of the computer, and, specifically, Nero. But I would point out that they do advise you to keep a backup copy of your original cdfs.vxd file, as there is a possibility that their version might not work.

I use Windows 98, by the way. I don't know whether this software works with later versions. Also, my daughter's CD may have a more primitive form of protection than on the Blue Notes - her CD does not give details. (It's an 'N Sync CD.)

[JSngry]

Perhaps your computer, accustomed as it is to your selections, merely failed to recognize 'N Sync as music...

[7/4]

Perhaps your computer, accustomed as it is to your selections, merely failed to recognize 'N Sync as music...

[Morganized]

Perhaps your computer, accustomed as it is to your selections, merely failed to recognize 'N Sync as music...

Very Good.......Very Good....LOL

[Shrdlu]

I nearly made that comment in my post. Actually, after reading that someone had gotten around the protection but felt that there might be skips or jitter in the resulting sound, I tried a few seconds of several 'N Sync tracks, but they were so jittery and jerky sounding that there was no way that I could tell if there were any technical flaws. They use a lot of rapid staccato and it just sounds like a mess.

Anyway, I'm not going to get a European BN CD, to test it! I'm glad that I have pretty much all the BN that I need by now. Many are TOCJs that do not need an upgrade.

[couw]

I've just finished comparing the sound of the EU copy protected Passing Ships and The Flip against the US non copy protected ones and.......

There's a sound difference too!! The US versions have more air around the instruments. The cymbals for instance have a far more realistic ring on the non copy protected disc's.

So that's even worse imo.

Michael C (who asked me to compare them in the first place) was affraid this was the case and will conduct his own survey in US studios to confirm my findings (or trash them because I'm only human too!!!).

Keep you posted and all the best,

Reinier

up for Reinier. Any news on this from your meeting with MC?