colinmce Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Oh yeah!! I have West Coast Hot, but would buy those records again in a heartbeat. Will you pair the Carter-Bradford albums? And obviously I think you should go for the Tapscott. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 And good news. Looks like I have the rights to Carter Bradford Flying Dutchman and, if I wish, Tapscott, The Giant Is Awakened. So that is very very good news. The Flying Dutchman catalog was finally sold and I got first rights to those performances. Those I'll do soon, because I need some big smackers to do Joe Daley correctly. Hooray! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 The Tapscott is a favorite, too. Glad to see that one might be reissued. Much love for the Carter-Bradford Dutchmans as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ep1str0phy Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) Go with the Tapscott. Go with the Tapscott. I already own the old Novus CD that pairs it with a Carter/Bradford side, but that issue has been unavailable for ages and I'd easily buy the Tapscott again. If the qualifications for reissue have something to do with historical importance, critical status, originality, and performance quality for the idiom, I'd say that The Giant Is Awakened meets every single criterion--it's maybe the greatest underground LA jazz record ever waxed. Misc. reasons: (1) It's the best documentation of Horace Tapscott's 60's/70's music, even with all the Nimbus sides circulating--there's a degree of ensemble precision, cohesion, and conciseness on the record that exceeds any of the PAPA music or even Tapscott's later small group stuff, The Dark Tree notwithstanding. (2) The Giant Is Awakened hosts one of the darkest, freakiest rhythm section hookups on record. Everything with Tapscott & Everett Brown, Jr. is at least good, but there are moments on The Giant Is Awakened that touch the epic pathos of the Tyner/Garrison/Jones rhythm section. The rhythm section here actually reminds me of, at least in terms of feel, communication, and mobility, any number of rhythm sections that featured Harry Miller and Louis Moholo (specifically the ones with Chris McGregor and Keith Tippett), though the LA guys are heavier and somewhat less ethereal. The general impression is comparable to a number of post-Coltrane ensemble contexts (Pharoah Sanders's 70's bands, Tyner's 70's bands), but freer, less anxiously propulsive (in a decidedly West Coast v. East Coast way), and a little angrier. (3) This is, I believe, Arthur Blythe's first appearance on record, and it's staggering just how fully-realized his playing is at this juncture. It's not quite in the orbit of the Dolphy wheelhouse--it's a somewhat less fluid and darker in tone--but it captures the raspy menace that Dolphy essayed on stuff like "Mendacity" and Out to Lunch and endows it with a sort of barwalking, R&B-ish bite. (4) This is a key album for a specific subset of the LA jazz scene--namely the sort of afrocentric, post-Coltrane jazz with very tangible ties to Black Nationalism--and while it is not necessarily representative of the entirety of that scene or even Tapscott's music in-and-of-itself, it was an early (historical) indicator that some very different stuff was going on out West. I own and have avidly listened to plenty of LA jazz from this period, and nothing else so vividly captures the urgency and energy of LA's gritty underbelly. The seeds of LA alternative hip-hop (in the album's vampy, heavy grooves), its free jazz/creative music scene, modern black LA jazz--it's all there. I could write pages and pages--I'm a strong advocate of Tapscott and especially this one and The Dark Tree. Edited April 16, 2012 by ep1str0phy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Yeah, great news! I'll jump at each of them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 as something of an aside, i often wondered about how we all would get to hear the contents of the Tapscott collection at UCLA http://findaid.oac.cdlib.org/findaid/ark:/13030/kt187019m6/dsc/#c02-1.2.8.2.2 no idea about an details, but there is - among others - a lot of material by the Giant Is Awawkened band listed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Man Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Hey all, thanks to all of you who recommended I hear Gene Shaw's Carnival Sketches. Very fine LP which I had never heard. Love it. And yes this must be his best work as it is awfully good. I guess next will be Steig. And good news. Looks like I have the rights to Carter Bradford Flying Dutchman and, if I wish, Tapscott, The Giant Is Awakened. So that is very very good news. The Flying Dutchman catalog was finally sold and I got first rights to those performances. Those I'll do soon, because I need some big smackers to do Joe Daley correctly. I'll probably just run 1000 Joe Daley's and it will be a gorgeous box set and a one time take it or leave it affair. Anyway, we're making progress here. And for those who have not heard Steig's Flute Fever, you'll be wowed. Good news that you have the rights to the Horace Tapscott & John Carter/Bobby Bradford Flying Dutchman recordings. Re-issues for all of those would be VERY welcome. ...and your idea about putting out the Joe Daley boxset as a limited-edition, premium product seems sound. Just don't make it so expensive that even collectors might think twice! Looking forward to receiving my Clare Fischer when it comes out shortly. I see the pre-order price has suddenly shot up to £30 on Amazon (UK)...what's all that about? Luckily I pre-ordered at the initial price of £14. Anyway, I think we should set up a thread specifically to cover your re-issue program, Jonathan. How about "International Phonograph Re-Issue Program"? Catchy, eh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Anyway, I think we should set up a thread specifically to cover your re-issue program, Jonathan. How about "International Phonograph Re-Issue Program"? Catchy, eh! Or change the title of this thread - Jonathan can do that himself: click on "edit" --> "use full editor" --> thread title at the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Anyway, I think we should set up a thread specifically to cover your re-issue program, Jonathan. How about "International Phonograph Re-Issue Program"? Catchy, eh! Or change the title of this thread - Jonathan can do that himself: click on "edit" --> "use full editor" --> thread title at the top. Done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Anyway, I think we should set up a thread specifically to cover your re-issue program, Jonathan. How about "International Phonograph Re-Issue Program"? Catchy, eh! Or change the title of this thread - Jonathan can do that himself: click on "edit" --> "use full editor" --> thread title at the top. Done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Man Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Anyway, I think we should set up a thread specifically to cover your re-issue program, Jonathan. How about "International Phonograph Re-Issue Program"? Catchy, eh! Or change the title of this thread - Jonathan can do that himself: click on "edit" --> "use full editor" --> thread title at the top. Done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanhorwich Posted April 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Dear All, Thanks so much for all your comments. Well I will be putting out all three Flying Dutchman issues. So all will come out. Nice write up ep1str0phy. Very fine. I would not pair the two Carter Bradfords. I might issue both at the same time, but they would each be separate in their own packaging. So all three in their own packaging. On the Amazon UK price of the Fischer I have no idea what that rise was about. Strange. And for those of you who are not familiar with the Fischer work, it is not avant in any sense. It is very down the middle but brilliantly so. It is large ensemble arrangement at its finest bar nobody. For those not used to this genre, listen to it many many times and you'll soon hear how original the writing and arranging is as compared with your normal big band. There is very little solo work and even that is subjugated to the greater palette of the band. Hope you guys love it as I do. For some it will not be instant love. And for some it may never be. But for me it is desert island. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmce Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 I'm guessing the answer is "No" but do you think it would be feasible to release all three Flying Dutchmans at the same time? People might be more inclined to buy them all in one go. I'm thinking of the old RVG days, stopping by the record shop to grab all four on release day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Great post ep1. A friend of mine gave (!) me the Tapscott LP years ago and it's incredible indeed. I generally like most of the Nimbus stuff too, but it doesn't quite have the same go-for-broke ruggedness that the Dutchman LP has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalupa Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 The Tapscott is a favorite, too. Glad to see that one might be reissued. Much love for the Carter-Bradford Dutchmans as well. Agree. I will buy all 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) The Tapscott is a favorite, too. Glad to see that one might be reissued. Much love for the Carter-Bradford Dutchmans as well. Agree. I will buy all 3. Haven't heard them, but am certainly interested. Edited April 17, 2012 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhoots Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 The Tapscott is a favorite, too. Glad to see that one might be reissued. Much love for the Carter-Bradford Dutchmans as well. Agree. I will buy all 3. Haven't heard them, but am certainly interested. I had all 3 on vinyl. Sold for $$$ back 15 years ago. Probably residing in Japan. I'll definitely buy all 3 on CD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ep1str0phy Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Great post ep1. A friend of mine gave (!) me the Tapscott LP years ago and it's incredible indeed. I generally like most of the Nimbus stuff too, but it doesn't quite have the same go-for-broke ruggedness that the Dutchman LP has. Thanks! The crazy thing that got me about the Dark Tree was just how dismissive some of the other UGMAA people were with regard to The Giant Is Awakened--someone in the book calls it something like a "'B' day for those guys"--when it's really the iconic example of that music on record. One imagines (1) that that music must have been ridiculous in a live setting, stretching out for Coltrane lengths of time and (2) that the subtle "corporate" influence on The Giant Is Awakened may have tainted the recording for the movement somewhat. That Nimbus stuff is colorful and very unique--nothing else sounds quite like it--but it's just so much rougher and less to-the-point that the Flying Dutchman side. The Giant Is Awakened is kind of like a New York album in that way--just short, sweet, and tough. And thanks, JLH--I'll buy all three, too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 I haven't read the book, but I should check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 I'm wondering who owns Flying Dutchman now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 I'm wondering who owns Flying Dutchman now. It is owned by Sony and distributed by their Legacy subsidiary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) Not my understanding. Unless something changed recently. Edited April 17, 2012 by Chuck Nessa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) Not my understanding. Unless something changed recently. Well, that's the info I got a while ago. Maybe I was misinformed - so who does own FD? Edited April 17, 2012 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalupa Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Not my understanding. Unless something changed recently. Well, that's the info I got a while ago. Maybe I was misinformed - so who does own FD? I thought someone, maybe JLH, posted last year that Thiele's daughters owned the rights to the catalog. Furthermore they didn't want to license the FD recordings out piecemeal because they felt they would get more money for the recordings if they sold them all together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Not my understanding. Unless something changed recently. Well, that's the info I got a while ago. Maybe I was misinformed - so who does own FD? I thought someone, maybe JLH, posted last year that Thiele's daughters owned the rights to the catalog. Furthermore they didn't want to license the FD recordings out piecemeal because they felt they would get more money for the recordings if they sold them all together. The info I got was that they had sold FD. Maybe the answer is somewhere earlier in this thread, but I don't have time to re-read it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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