Brit jazz archival treasure trove!

[A Lark Ascending]

Details of the cd are here:

http://www.reelrecordings.org/trad_dads_dirty_boppers_and_free_fusioneers.php

120 pages in now - when he's describing the music and musicians he's intreresting. Chronology is all over the place, but lots of interesting anecdotes. Will get me relistening to some of this music.

Edited February 2, 2013 by A Lark Ascending

[JETman]

Details of the cd are here:

http://www.reelrecor..._fusioneers.php

120 pages in now - when he's describing the music and musicians he's intreresting. Chronology is all over the place, but lots of interesting anecdotes. Will get me relistening to some of this music.

The link does not contain the details I was looking for, other than to mention the "finding of rare recordings".. There is no mention of the sources for these recordings. I was hoping that your familiarity with the British jazz scene would allow you to answer my question easily.

[sidewinder]

120 pages in now - when he's describing the music and musicians he's intreresting. Chronology is all over the place, but lots of interesting anecdotes. Will get me relistening to some of this music.

Now we're talking ! I'm going to have to pick up this one I guess - and pretend that I'm this guy when reading it.

[A Lark Ascending]

Continues to be an uncomfortable read.

I've just read two chapters on drugs and race. In both cases there's an unfortunate hectoring tone with regard to the issues discussed. I'd imagine this book will be mainly read by people already familiar with at least some of the music and musicians and well used to the social issues that frame the chapters. But we are addressed as if this is all quite unfamiliar and need instructing.

The odd thing is that within those chapters you get discussions of the music and musicians that are interesting and that could stand quite freely without being part of a race or drugs umbrella. He's going over familiar ground with Joe Harriott but his discussion of Mike Taylor, Mike Osborne and John Mayer is much more engaging.

If you want to test whether the book is for you you might try the opening 2 pages of the chapter on drugs - 'One Scotch, One Bourbon, One Beer.'

Edited February 3, 2013 by A Lark Ascending

[RogerF]

The link does not contain the details I was looking for, other than to mention the "finding of rare recordings".. There is no mention of the sources for these recordings. I was hoping that your familiarity with the British jazz scene would allow you to answer my question easily.

The CD contains only previously unreleased tracks taken from reel to reel tapes unearthed from various sources, usually from the musicians themselves.

The book is going to be controversial because it doesn't take a neutral stance but a pugnaciously (?) political one. This is obviously the author's prerogative. Personally, if I had written this book, I would have left this out and concentrated on the music and perhaps the history of its development in Britain. But having said that it's better produced than John Wickes' Innovation in British Jazz which, despite its excellent comprehensiveness, suffered from woeful (lack of) sub-editing and production. Duncan Heining knows his stuff too and knows (or knew) many of the musicians personally. But, I find the more books that are written about British Jazz and British jazz musicians, the more there is a tendency for them to be long-winded possibly as compensation for the lack of airtime or publicity these musicians receive in the various mainstream media. For me - and I admit I am somewhat biased here - the definitive British jazz book is Ian Carr's Music Outside which concentrated on the music and musicians and was relatively short.

Notwithstanding the above comments I still think Duncan Heining and Mike King should be applauded for their book and CD respectively. It's very brave to write and release books and CDs on an art form which has become increasingly marginalised over recent years - check out the dearth of John Fordham printed reviews in Friday's Guardian, for example. Even in the online version they are few and far between. And let's not get started on Radio 3!

Edited February 3, 2013 by RogerF

[JETman]

The link does not contain the details I was looking for, other than to mention the "finding of rare recordings".. There is no mention of the sources for these recordings. I was hoping that your familiarity with the British jazz scene would allow you to answer my question easily.

The CD contains only previously unreleased tracks taken from reel to reel tapes unearthed from various sources, usually from the musicians themselves.

The book is going to be controversial because it doesn't take a neutral stance but a pugnaciously (?) political one. This is obviously the author's prerogative. Personally, if I had written this book, I would have left this out and concentrated on the music and perhaps the history of its development in Britain. But having said that it's better produced than John Wickes' Innovation in British Jazz which, despite its excellent comprehensiveness, suffered from woeful (lack of) sub-editing and production. Duncan Heining knows his stuff too and knows (or knew) many of the musicians personally. But, I find the more books that are written about British Jazz and British jazz musicians, the more there is a tendency for them to be long-winded possibly as compensation for the lack of airtime or publicity these musicians receive in the various mainstream media. For me - and I admit I am somewhat biased here - the definitive British jazz book is Ian Carr's Music Outside which concentrated on the music and musicians and was relatively short.

Notwithstanding the above comments I still think Duncan Heining and Mike King should be applauded for their book and CD respectively. It's very brave to write and release books and CDs on an art form which has become increasingly marginalised over recent years - check out the dearth of John Fordham printed reviews in Friday's Guardian, for example. Even in the online version they are few and far between. And let's not get started on Radio 3!

Thanks, Roger. I was hoping that would be the case. Here's hoping that Reel decides to release more from those various sources.

[sidewinder]

Agree with what Roger said about the 'Innovations In British Jazz'. Contains quite a bit of good information but the content is all over the place and really needed strict editing. The Ian Carr 'Music Outside' book remains the 'gold standard' for me too.

[A Lark Ascending]

The book is going to be controversial because it doesn't take a neutral stance but a pugnaciously (?) political one.

I don't find the book particularly controversial. I've yet to read anything that you'd not have heard bandied around a university student union bar in the 70s. If anything surprises it is the very old fashioned nature of the political analysis.

In its favour when he is writing about the music he draws you in - he's got me listening to things again and making lists of things I'd like to hear.

His strengths are as a music journalist, used to writing reviews and magazine length articles. He's made the mistake of thinking that because it's a book he has to imitate the scholarly works he's read. I just don't think he's up to that. To me the book reads like a vast collection of cuttings, some from his own interviews, most from other secondary sources, stiched together with rather vague set of theories, couched (in the 'science parts') in a language he has learned from academic tomes ( if he tells me what 'we must' do one more time I might just scream.)

Agree, it's good to have a book about the era; and that the Wickes book suffered badly from the editing. But I'd draw the comparison with 'Dazzling Stranger', Colin Harper's book on Bert Jansch set very much in the context of the same period. To my mind, a far more confident book.

The CD is marvellous.

[sambrasa]

The CD contains only previously unreleased tracks taken from reel to reel tapes unearthed from various sources, usually from the musicians themselves.

So it seem to contain.

I made some unfortunate assumptions few posts earlier.

Interesting to compare the Amancio d'Silva "Joyce Country" here to the one released on Integration LP: this version is much shorter (does not have the long guitar solo interlude), has Don Rendell on sax and promiment harpsichord (both missing on LP version). LP does not say when recorded, but Alyn Shipton's Ian Carr book takes a guess: London 1968. This version is recorded January 1st, 1969. Where does it come from? Is there more where this came from?

Edited February 4, 2013 by sambrasa

[Jazzjet]

The CD is available from Amazon at just £10.02 - a real bargain. My copy arrives tomorrow so can't wait to listen.

[A Lark Ascending]

The chapter on John Stevens, Derek Bailey and the AAM is a good read. A story I've read across magazine articles, sleeve notes etc (and in Wickes) but all in one place here.

[skeith]

Would this include Richard III's bones??

[A Lark Ascending]

Would this include Richard III's bones??

Would this include Richard III's bones??

If you can find a way to relate them to structural conditions in late capitalism I'm sure he'll include them in the next edition.

Read to within 30 pages of the end last night and had to throw it aside. The political chapters at the end are absolutely dreadful - basically rehearsing a lot of second hand socio-babble and desperately trying to latch on aspects of British jazz.

Some terrible editing too. He reviews the early John Surman albums in one chapter; and then does more or less the same thing again in a later chapter.

Notwithstanding the interesting sections about the music itself, I have to say this is the worst book I've read in years in any genre (and I read 'The Da Vinci Code'!)

Edited February 6, 2013 by A Lark Ascending

[sidewinder]

Would this include Richard III's bones??

I've a hunch it might not..

Will tread carefully on this one as a result of Bev's comments. Shame - was looking forward to it !

Maybe we should write 'The Book' ourselves. Post-retirement project perhaps?

Edited February 6, 2013 by sidewinder

[Jazzjet]

Listened to the CD today. Some fascinating material. The Osborne - Surman Quartet from 1966 is excellent and brings back great memories of the Westbrook sextet. The Henry Lowther - Lyn Dobson Quintet is also great and shows Lowther in excellent form even back in 1964.

The liner notes mention 'Simply Not Cricket : A British Jazz Discography' by Philippe Renaud. Has anyone read this? Volume 1 ( 1964-1994 ) is on special offer with Volume 2 ( 1995 - 2000 ) from Jazzscript, although still not exactly cheap.

[sidewinder]

Yes, I've got both volumes of 'Simply Not Cricket'. Bought them at the Bath Festival many years ago. They are French publications with very little written content but a very useful listing of 'Brit jazz' albums and the accompanying cover art (in black and white).

[A Lark Ascending]

Simply Not Cricket is mainly lists. Useful but not a thing to sit and read. Some nice covers

[A Lark Ascending]

Maybe we should write 'The Book' ourselves. Post-retirement project perhaps?

Well, at least we'd leave the reader in no doubt as to who 'we' are.

[sambrasa]

Notwithstanding the interesting sections about the music itself, I have to say this is the worst book I've read in years in any genre (and I read 'The Da Vinci Code'!)

The worst book about jazz I've encountered must be John Zorn: Tradition and Transgression by J.Brackett. He totally avoids touching the music itself and sticks to semiotic mumbo jumbo that's can be really tiresome. For example when talking about the album "Gift" he makes big deal about the fact that gift means poison in some Germanic languages but does not reference the actual music. I could not force myself to read all of it though, maybe if gets good? Nah.

The British writer who did the Jan Garbarek & ECM book (could not find it at amazon right now so can't name names) uses similar meta approach but since he has something to say his book is a win. (This one's a good one, folks, recommended.)

[sidewinder]

Having read the book cover to cover now I must agree that it's a bit of a mixed bag - some very interesting sections covering the likes of Joseph Holbrooke Trio, AMM, Neil Ardley/NJO, Mike Osborne, Graham Collier & Mike Westbrook but far too much inter-linking with Marxist theory to spin a (very debatable and somewhat biased) narrative. The section on drugs/alchohol was quite interesting - hadn't heard of that Bert Courtley chlorodyne story. The musical 'critique' is also good - can't disagree with many of the choices re: key recordings. Some artists mentioned briefly in passing deserve much more prominence though - Dick Morrissey, Amancio D'Silva and Ronnie Ross come to mind. Having said that - people such as Ray Russell, Mike Taylor and Howard Riley get the prominent mentions they deserve. Nice to see John Dankworth's 60s big band writing given prominence too.

There's really two books here - with a very good one covering British Jazz developments 1960-75 trying to get out. I found the sloppy editing/proofing in parts very annoying too. Kudos though that this book was written in the first place - the author's considerable knowledge of and enthusiasm for the music wins through.

Edited August 18, 2013 by sidewinder