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Tim McG

MLB Hot Stove League 2012-13

520 posts in this topic

On this signing: Well, good luck with Pujols and Hamilton in the same clubhouse, that is a terrible mix, and besides, the LA area is the last place Hamilton needs to be with his history. This has disaster written all over it. :tdown

The same yapping idiots that wanted Hamilton gone in the first place (i.e. the local sports media) have been going on and on about this powerful Angels lineup that now features Hamilton and Pujols. Seems I recall Pujols had a disastrous year last year, pretty much singlehandedly kept the Angels outta the playoffs, if memory serves.

These same chuckleheads claimed that Hamilton will thrive because he's going to be "surrounded by stars." Uh huh. Because that's ALWAYS a good idea. Clearly, brains are not required to work in sports media....

I wish nothing but the best for Hamilton, because he was a HUGE part of the Rangers getting to their first and second World Series, playoff wins, etc etc etc. I realize sports is a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately game, but if anyone around here has the gall to boo Hamilton when he returns, then I hope they choke on their Superdog. Not saying I wish he'd re-signed with the Rangers, but he sure as hell deserved a more graceful exit.

Furthermore, coming home empty-handed is a helluva lot smarter than blowing money just because the sports hounds say you need to make a big splash at the winter meetings. So many times the "big splash" has come back to bite the Rangers in the ass, a lot more times than I wish to remember!

Seriously, the way the Angels are spending money to lose, you'd think Tom Hicks & John Hart had taken over the franchise. I genuinely feel bad for Angels fans.

Phat Albert had a terrible...April . 4 RBI's .217 BA. still finished the year hitting .285, with 30 HR's and 105 RBIs. As soon as Mike Trout was called up(people forget he was sick in spring training, lost a lot of weight) everyone on the Angels was better. Now, the Angels have taken a streaky, but great hitter(43 HR's 128 RBI'S which lead the team of course) away from the their chief division rival...and the Rangers don't have anyone yet to replace his output. Who knows what will happen 5 years from now, but for the next 3 years, they will likely be the team to beat.

And while there may be more fair weather Dodger fans than Angel fans, the Angels not only have a future HOF'er, they now add one of the best hitters in the game, to a lineup that has Trumbo, Morales, and of course the most exciting player in the game, in Trout.

If I lived in the LA area, which team would I pay money to see? Well, which has the more exciting players? Matt Kemp is great, perhaps the best hitter in the NL, but he isn't going to score from 1st on a single like Trout can at any time. Who else is exciting on the Dodgers club? A-Gon? Great hitter, but exciting???

Zack was payed like his name is Sabbathia, but he ain't him...and talk about a guy playing on the wrong team if he doesn't win right away....

Oh well, at least people are talking the teams in LA, and in the AL West.....

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The team may suck but they were probably going to suck anyway.

There are several teams that should pay you for use of this slogan for 2013 marketing purposes.

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How do I go about trademarking it? ;)

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Wait'll Nash comes back...it's a loooong season.

Oh yeah, now the Lakers' salvation is to be found in a 49 year-old point guard. Good times at Showtime! :bad:

Um...he's 38.

On this signing: Well, good luck with Pujols and Hamilton in the same clubhouse, that is a terrible mix, and besides, the LA area is the last place Hamilton needs to be with his history. This has disaster written all over it. :tdown

The same yapping idiots that wanted Hamilton gone in the first place (i.e. the local sports media) have been going on and on about this powerful Angels lineup that now features Hamilton and Pujols. Seems I recall Pujols had a disastrous year last year, pretty much singlehandedly kept the Angels outta the playoffs, if memory serves.

These same chuckleheads claimed that Hamilton will thrive because he's going to be "surrounded by stars." Uh huh. Because that's ALWAYS a good idea. Clearly, brains are not required to work in sports media....

I wish nothing but the best for Hamilton, because he was a HUGE part of the Rangers getting to their first and second World Series, playoff wins, etc etc etc. I realize sports is a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately game, but if anyone around here has the gall to boo Hamilton when he returns, then I hope they choke on their Superdog. Not saying I wish he'd re-signed with the Rangers, but he sure as hell deserved a more graceful exit.

Furthermore, coming home empty-handed is a helluva lot smarter than blowing money just because the sports hounds say you need to make a big splash at the winter meetings. So many times the "big splash" has come back to bite the Rangers in the ass, a lot more times than I wish to remember!

Seriously, the way the Angels are spending money to lose, you'd think Tom Hicks & John Hart had taken over the franchise. I genuinely feel bad for Angels fans.

I dunno.

It could work yo the Angels' advantage, too.

Theoretically, the team has two big bats in the line-up. If both Hamilton and Puljols have great years, the Angels will be a tough out for the always competitive AL West.

I just don't think two prima donnas (Pujols & Hamilton) in the same clubhouse has ever worked outside of the Yankees, and I don't think Mike Scioscia is up to the challenge of managing this particular set of players. Scioscia is best when you have a bunch of overachieving players, who fight hard for each win, but when it comes to top-notch talent, he's not so good. I predict he will lose the clubhouse, and will be gone by the All-Star break. The Great Carnac Has Spoken!

PS: 39, 49, 79, it doesn't matter, Nash is old and washed up, he'll be terrible with the Lakers! Mark it! Good Heavens, I'm on a roll tonight!

Edited by Matthew

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j. buss is a trainwreck.....

the yankees seem to have learned their lesson, kind of. now the angels, tigers, bosox, and dodgers have caught 'longterm' hallucinations.

Jerry Buss brought the Lakers 11 championships. I don't see that as a liability, TBH.

I believe that the "j. buss" aloc was referring to is Jerry's son, Jim, who seems to have usurped control from Mitch Kupchak.

Edited by paul secor

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j. buss is a trainwreck.....

the yankees seem to have learned their lesson, kind of. now the angels, tigers, bosox, and dodgers have caught 'longterm' hallucinations.

Jerry Buss brought the Lakers 11 championships. I don't see that as a liability, TBH.

I believe that the "j. buss" aloc was referring to is Jerry's son, Jim, who seems to have usurped control from Mitch Kupchak.

indeed--thanks paul.

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R. A. Dickey to the Blue Jays -- I guess with no hockey, they have to do something up there, but two-years, 25 million seems a lot for Dickey.

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This says it all: from the N.Y. Times http://bats.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/17/r-a-dickey-climbs-mountains-the-mets-dig-holes/

"The Mets now have pulled off a perverse daily double, in consecutive seasons dumping the National League batting champion, in Jose Reyes, and the Cy Young award winner, in Dickey."

Reyes did leave as a free agent, but the Mets weren't even in the chase to resign him. The Mets now have David Wright surrounded by players who are essentially minor leaguers.

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Wait'll Nash comes back...it's a loooong season.

Oh yeah, now the Lakers' salvation is to be found in a 49 year-old point guard. Good times at Showtime! :bad:

Um...he's 38.

On this signing: Well, good luck with Pujols and Hamilton in the same clubhouse, that is a terrible mix, and besides, the LA area is the last place Hamilton needs to be with his history. This has disaster written all over it. :tdown

The same yapping idiots that wanted Hamilton gone in the first place (i.e. the local sports media) have been going on and on about this powerful Angels lineup that now features Hamilton and Pujols. Seems I recall Pujols had a disastrous year last year, pretty much singlehandedly kept the Angels outta the playoffs, if memory serves.

These same chuckleheads claimed that Hamilton will thrive because he's going to be "surrounded by stars." Uh huh. Because that's ALWAYS a good idea. Clearly, brains are not required to work in sports media....

I wish nothing but the best for Hamilton, because he was a HUGE part of the Rangers getting to their first and second World Series, playoff wins, etc etc etc. I realize sports is a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately game, but if anyone around here has the gall to boo Hamilton when he returns, then I hope they choke on their Superdog. Not saying I wish he'd re-signed with the Rangers, but he sure as hell deserved a more graceful exit.

Furthermore, coming home empty-handed is a helluva lot smarter than blowing money just because the sports hounds say you need to make a big splash at the winter meetings. So many times the "big splash" has come back to bite the Rangers in the ass, a lot more times than I wish to remember!

Seriously, the way the Angels are spending money to lose, you'd think Tom Hicks & John Hart had taken over the franchise. I genuinely feel bad for Angels fans.

I dunno.

It could work yo the Angels' advantage, too.

Theoretically, the team has two big bats in the line-up. If both Hamilton and Puljols have great years, the Angels will be a tough out for the always competitive AL West.

I just don't think two prima donnas (Pujols & Hamilton) in the same clubhouse has ever worked outside of the Yankees, and I don't think Mike Scioscia is up to the challenge of managing this particular set of players. Scioscia is best when you have a bunch of overachieving players, who fight hard for each win, but when it comes to top-notch talent, he's not so good. I predict he will lose the clubhouse, and will be gone by the All-Star break. The Great Carnac Has Spoken!

PS: 39, 49, 79, it doesn't matter, Nash is old and washed up, he'll be terrible with the Lakers! Mark it! Good Heavens, I'm on a roll tonight!

We'll see.

This says it all: from the N.Y. Times http://bats.blogs.ny...mets-dig-holes/

"The Mets now have pulled off a perverse daily double, in consecutive seasons dumping the National League batting champion, in Jose Reyes, and the Cy Young award winner, in Dickey."

Reyes did leave as a free agent, but the Mets weren't even in the chase to resign him. The Mets now have David Wright surrounded by players who are essentially minor leaguers.

Dickey has struggled in the past other than having this one sterling year. He certainly deserved the Cy young, but maybe the Mets know something we don't...

Edited by GoodSpeak

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Dickey probably won't have another year like he did in 2012, but he's a guy who will go out and give you everything he's got every time he takes the mound. He gave the Mets a chance to win just about every time he took the mound last year. Dickey was the only bona fide major leaguer in their starting rotation. He (and David Wright) gave Mets fans a reason to come out and root for their team. The rest of the Mets' starters would be long relievers - that's probably a stretch - or in the minors if they were on a team that was a contender. And their starting lineup - with the exception of Wright - would be bench players or in the minors if they played for a contender.

A good friend of mine is a loyal Mets fan and he's disgusted by this. Trading your best pitcher for some might be's/could be's is spitting in your fans' faces.

Edited by paul secor

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Dickey probably won't have another year like he did in 2012, but he's a guy who will go out and give you everything he's got every time he takes the mound. He gave the Mets a chance to win just about every time he took the mound last year. Dickey was the only bona fide major leaguer in their starting rotation. He (and David Wright) gave Mets fans a reason to come out and root for their team. The rest of the Mets' starters would be long relievers - that's probably a stretch - or in the minors if they were on a team that was a contender. And their starting lineup - with the exception of Wright - would be bench players or in the minors if they played for a contender.

A good friend of mine is a loyal Mets fan and he's disgusted by this. Trading your best pitcher for some might be's/could be's is spitting in your fans' faces.

Don't you mean trading away your "best" pitcher who had one good year in his entire career and just turned 38 from a team that has no chance of going anywhere in the two years the Blue Jays signed him too? Has your friend been paying attention to just how much money the owners of the Mets have lost as a result of the whole Bernie Madoff thing? Just this year they agreed to pay $162 million on top of all the other money the lost. Even if they had both Reyes and Dickey they were not going anywhere anytime soon. Never mind in the next two years.

Edited by Blue Train

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I thought the Mets came out well in the trade- they're not gonna contend until Dickey's in his 40s. They get a catcher who is supposed to be a sure thing, a 20 year old pitcher who throws 95+, they get rid of Thole, too. With an eye to the future, they did well. In a year or two, the Mets may have one of the best rotations in baseball. Niese, Matt Harvey, Dillon Gee, Zach Wheeler, IF they all develop OK they could have a great rotation.

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Dickey probably won't have another year like he did in 2012, but he's a guy who will go out and give you everything he's got every time he takes the mound. He gave the Mets a chance to win just about every time he took the mound last year. Dickey was the only bona fide major leaguer in their starting rotation. He (and David Wright) gave Mets fans a reason to come out and root for their team. The rest of the Mets' starters would be long relievers - that's probably a stretch - or in the minors if they were on a team that was a contender. And their starting lineup - with the exception of Wright - would be bench players or in the minors if they played for a contender.

A good friend of mine is a loyal Mets fan and he's disgusted by this. Trading your best pitcher for some might be's/could be's is spitting in your fans' faces.

Don't you mean trading away your "best" pitcher who had one good year in his entire career and just turned 38 from a team that has no chance of going anywhere in the two years the Blue Jays signed him too? Has your friend been paying attention to just how much money the owners of the Mets have lost as a result of the whole Bernie Madoff thing? Just this year they agreed to pay $162 million on top of all the other money the lost. Even if they had both Reyes and Dickey they were not going anywhere anytime soon. Never mind in the next two years.

Mets fans aren't responsible for the Mets owners' financial wheeling and dealing with Madoff. If they can't afford to put a decent team on the field when they're located in a large population/big market area, they should sell the team. Mets fans deserve better. They're the ones who are buying the tickets and paying for cable TV. Are they supposed to feel sorry for the owners? Wilpon and company made their deals with Madoff. No one forced them to be greedy.

And, regardless of his age and career record, Dickey was still the Mets' best pitcher - not their "best" pitcher.

Edited by paul secor

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I thought the Mets came out well in the trade- they're not gonna contend until Dickey's in his 40s. They get a catcher who is supposed to be a sure thing, a 20 year old pitcher who throws 95+, they get rid of Thole, too. With an eye to the future, they did well. In a year or two, the Mets may have one of the best rotations in baseball. Niese, Matt Harvey, Dillon Gee, Zach Wheeler, IF they all develop OK they could have a great rotation.

A lot if IFs there. I doubt that the Mets will have one of the best rotations in baseball in a year or even two. We shall see. Given the Mets' track record over the past four seasons, one has to be doubtful.

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This says it all: from the N.Y. Times http://bats.blogs.ny...mets-dig-holes/

"The Mets now have pulled off a perverse daily double, in consecutive seasons dumping the National League batting champion, in Jose Reyes, and the Cy Young award winner, in Dickey."

Reyes did leave as a free agent, but the Mets weren't even in the chase to resign him. The Mets now have David Wright surrounded by players who are essentially minor leaguers.

I read that but that was just plaiin stupid. They parlayed Dickey into one of the best catching prospects and the 11th best prospect over all, plus a prospect who could potentially be a top of the rotation pitcher.

So what's wrong with that? :w

They were probably going to finish next to last again. Reminds me of the story Ralph Kiner told when he went to see Branch Rickey about a raise after he had a good year but the Pirates finished last or near the bottom. Rickey said no to a raise and reportedly said "Ralph, we finished last with you and can finish last without you."

The trade also brings to mind Graig Nettles' quip about Sparky Lyle the year after Sparky won the Cy Young when the Yankees brought in Goose Gossage: "From Cy Young to Sayonara.".

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This says it all: from the N.Y. Times http://bats.blogs.ny...mets-dig-holes/

"The Mets now have pulled off a perverse daily double, in consecutive seasons dumping the National League batting champion, in Jose Reyes, and the Cy Young award winner, in Dickey."

Reyes did leave as a free agent, but the Mets weren't even in the chase to resign him. The Mets now have David Wright surrounded by players who are essentially minor leaguers.

I read that but that was just plaiin stupid. They parlayed Dickey into one of the best catching prospects and the 11th best prospect over all, plus a prospect who could potentially be a top of the rotation pitcher.

So what's wrong with that? :w

They were probably going to finish next to last again. Reminds me of the story Ralph Kiner told when he went to see Branch Rickey about a raise after he had a good year but the Pirates finished last or near the bottom. Rickey said no to a raise and reportedly said "Ralph, we finished last with you and can finish last without you."

The trade also brings to mind Graig Nettles' quip about Sparky Lyle the year after Sparky won the Cy Young when the Yankees brought in Goose Gossage: "From Cy Young to Sayonara.".

The Pirates may have finished last with Kiner, but at least he gave the fans someone to come out and see.

The Mets have no one worth seeing, with the exception of Wright, and other teams will just pitch around him. Wilpon should sell the team to someone who can and will put a decent team on the field.

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I thought the Mets came out well in the trade- they're not gonna contend until Dickey's in his 40s. They get a catcher who is supposed to be a sure thing, a 20 year old pitcher who throws 95+, they get rid of Thole, too. With an eye to the future, they did well. In a year or two, the Mets may have one of the best rotations in baseball. Niese, Matt Harvey, Dillon Gee, Zach Wheeler, IF they all develop OK they could have a great rotation.

A lot if IFs there. I doubt that the Mets will have one of the best rotations in baseball in a year or even two. We shall see. Given the Mets' track record over the past four seasons, one has to be doubtful.

As a Phillies fan that has seen Harvey pitch, I agree with PhillyQ. Dickey had a great year but what are the chances that he does that again?

1980 World Series meets Family Feud

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I thought the Mets came out well in the trade- they're not gonna contend until Dickey's in his 40s. They get a catcher who is supposed to be a sure thing, a 20 year old pitcher who throws 95+, they get rid of Thole, too. With an eye to the future, they did well. In a year or two, the Mets may have one of the best rotations in baseball. Niese, Matt Harvey, Dillon Gee, Zach Wheeler, IF they all develop OK they could have a great rotation.

A lot if IFs there. I doubt that the Mets will have one of the best rotations in baseball in a year or even two. We shall see. Given the Mets' track record over the past four seasons, one has to be doubtful.

I capitalized the 'if' for that very reason. The young pitchers may or may not become something, but it at least looks like there may be a plan, even if it takes a couple years. They now have a young catcher, pretty young infield, young starting pitching, no bullpen and no outfield. After the stain of Bay(his salary) departs and Santana goes, the Mets may have some real $$ to spend on a few good players and we COULD see something good develop. I'm a Yank fan, but a NYer through and through and I'd love to see the Mets get respectable again.

Edited by PHILLYQ

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People forget, but 2012 was Dickey's 3rd straight very good year. 2010 ERA, 2.84, 2011, 3.28, and 2012, 2.73

But, at 38, would he, even as a knuckle baller be there by the time the Mets were competitive again? If the talent isn’t there now,(or all that deep on the farm) don’t you have to trade off good players to get back prospects?

Now, the Mets financial situation...only because Bud is friends with the Wilpons does it seem they are given a longer leash. If the team isn’t very good in 2013, fans need to stop showing up, that' is about the only thing that gets owners and overlords to pay attention.

Weird how both NY teams are acting like they are the Twins with a very limited budget to work with. I know the Yankees Luxury tax was/is going to go up quite a bit, but they are going to have a tough time competing with the Jays, down a few bats and starting pitchers. Now, if only the fans would stop showing up in the Bronx...

Edited by BERIGAN

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This says it all: from the N.Y. Times http://bats.blogs.ny...mets-dig-holes/

"The Mets now have pulled off a perverse daily double, in consecutive seasons dumping the National League batting champion, in Jose Reyes, and the Cy Young award winner, in Dickey."

Reyes did leave as a free agent, but the Mets weren't even in the chase to resign him. The Mets now have David Wright surrounded by players who are essentially minor leaguers.

I read that but that was just plaiin stupid. They parlayed Dickey into one of the best catching prospects and the 11th best prospect over all, plus a prospect who could potentially be a top of the rotation pitcher.

So what's wrong with that? :w

They were probably going to finish next to last again. Reminds me of the story Ralph Kiner told when he went to see Branch Rickey about a raise after he had a good year but the Pirates finished last or near the bottom. Rickey said no to a raise and reportedly said "Ralph, we finished last with you and can finish last without you."

The trade also brings to mind Graig Nettles' quip about Sparky Lyle the year after Sparky won the Cy Young when the Yankees brought in Goose Gossage: "From Cy Young to Sayonara.".

The Pirates may have finished last with Kiner, but at least he gave the fans someone to come out and see.

The Mets have no one worth seeing, with the exception of Wright, and other teams will just pitch around him. Wilpon should sell the team to someone who can and will put a decent team on the field.

It's not just about giving the fans something to see because let's face it fans come out to see winners and I doubt there will be a lot of fans out there in 2013. Hopefully, they are building for the future. Starting pitching will be good eventually and the infield is not bad. Rest of the team needs major work, especially the outfield.

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....but it at least looks like there may be a plan...After the stain of Bay(his salary) departs

From the Mets to Mariners. It's not going to be a happy season for either "M" team but it's so depressing on this end that the one "big pickup" is a 34 year old outfielder that the Mets didn't want anymore. Ugh.

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Dickey probably won't have another year like he did in 2012, but he's a guy who will go out and give you everything he's got every time he takes the mound. He gave the Mets a chance to win just about every time he took the mound last year. Dickey was the only bona fide major leaguer in their starting rotation. He (and David Wright) gave Mets fans a reason to come out and root for their team. The rest of the Mets' starters would be long relievers - that's probably a stretch - or in the minors if they were on a team that was a contender. And their starting lineup - with the exception of Wright - would be bench players or in the minors if they played for a contender.

A good friend of mine is a loyal Mets fan and he's disgusted by this. Trading your best pitcher for some might be's/could be's is spitting in your fans' faces.

Good point.

I remember being plenty ticked off when the Giants traded Jason Schmidt. He was one of my favorite Giants at the time. But, after starting a few games for the [hated] Dodgers, he went on the IR list and never pitched again. So, I certainly see how Mets fans would be angry, but there again, maybe they figured to get something for Dickey before he was totally spent. I dunno.

Edited by GoodSpeak

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even the best knuckle ballers are liabilities without a catcher possessing the unique ability to handle their unique offerings.

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even the best knuckle ballers are liabilities without a catcher possessing the unique ability to handle their unique offerings.

That's why they traded Josh Thole to the Jays as well. However, R.A. Is not your typical knuckleballer. He has excellent control and also throws a fastball. More than other pitchers, he has mastered the knuckler.

Edited by Brad

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even the best knuckle ballers are liabilities without a catcher possessing the unique ability to handle their unique offerings.

That's why they traded Josh Thole to the Jays as well. However, R.A. Is not your typical knuckleballer. He has excellent control and also throws a fastball. More than other pitchers, he has mastered the knuckler.

No doubt.

I hear even his knuckler comes in at 90 mph :o

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