Soul Stream Posted March 9, 2003 Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 I've had the collection of Chet Baker singing on Pacific Jazz for many years now. I've always loved it. Both musically and for the singing. I know a lot of people hate his playing and his singing. However, this may be one of my top 10 lps/cds. I just always get a very honest feel from it. And I think it's artistry rises way above just some sort of easy listening. Is anybody with/against....? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted March 9, 2003 Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 Hey Soul Stream, I have Chet Baker's She Was Too Good To Me on CTI. I don't listen to it much, but for some reason I have deemed it worthy of saving for another listen. Is his Pacific stuff similar or better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Stream Posted March 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 To me, the very early stuff on Pacific Jazz is his best. Especially the "Sings." Not just for the singing, but his trumpet playing on those sides is extremely lyrical and beautiful. He might just take a chorus, but they are spare and wonderful to me. Even a brief intro of his on these sides is extremely memorable. I think I could hum every note on these ones. Pick up "The Best of Chet Baker Sings" on Pacific Jazz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted March 9, 2003 Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 Cool, thanks. I'll have to check that out. I have very little jazz vocals, but I have heard some I like. I have John Coltrane & Johnny Hartman that I like very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzmoose Posted March 9, 2003 Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 Okay, I'll confess. I have one Chet Baker album, Chet, which I enjoy once in a while. I had never heard his vocals before, but heard him a couple of weeks on the radio (KCSM, of course!). My first thought was "What a strange sounding woman!". Second thought was "You know, I really dislike this." Third was "Please let me die! I pray to Shiva every day...". Okay, that was really Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, but you get the idea. Listening to Chet Baker sing for me is like watching Michael Jackson's nose disintegrate. Repulsive and unnatural. Sorry... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Stream Posted March 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 I think those are the feelings of many, so don't feel like you're raining on the parade. A lot of his post Pacific Jazz vocal work I don't admire. Some of the late, late stuff I do. The early sixties stuff especially on (is it Prestige?, I can't think, some NYC stuff) is bad, uninspired, really flat, ect. I do love the Pacific stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fenohr Posted March 9, 2003 Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 I can take the PJ vocals in small doses, but i cant sit through the whole album. The Riverside stuff was pretty weak IMO. Now as far as his trumpet playing i would recommend the three Prestige cd's that contain the three day session he did in Aug of 1965. Those sessions produced 5 or 6 albums which are now on the cd's On A Misty Night, Stairway To The Stars and Lonely Star. The band was Chet on Fluglehorn,George Coleman tenor, Kirk Lightsey piano, Herman Wright bass and Roy Brooks drums. Chet was dialed in on these sessions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Stream Posted March 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2003 I've never checked those out Bill. Thanks for the head up. Hopefully some of it will be on emusic.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.D. Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 I think Chet Bakers vocals were never great.. passable perhaps, and I do think they deteriorated with time. The latter day recordings with Getz are very painful, especially when he scats. The earlier recordings are the best if you want his vocals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 What would you guys recommend from Chet where he leaves the singing up to his trumpet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.D. Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Well if you have nothing, the Pacific Jazz era is up there... somehow Jazz musicians are best at the beginning of their careers.. damn watch the flames on that statement. There are exceptions The three Prestige CD's that Bill recommended.. no vocals, Prestige trying to do a Miles Quintet repeat... not quite making it, but still good Chet If you have no . or little Baker thats where I'd go Pacific Jazz first Baker in Paris on verve.. think there was a fairly new comp.. hate the label though The Prestiges Bill suggests After that, you're either hooked.. asnd you'll find your own way or you'll move onto something else...... How much Clifford Brown do you have... Thanks B3 er Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Whoops, I didn't read far enough to see Bill's recs. I thought it had turned into the "bash Chet's vocals" thread. I only have one Clifford Brown, the "Ultimate" compilation. "Delilah" and "Stardust" are my favorite tracks. My collection has holes big enough to skipper an aircraft carrier through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.D. Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 (edited) I only have one Clifford Brown, the "Ultimate" compilation. "Delilah" and "Stardust" are my favorite tracks. My collection has holes big enough to skipper an aircraft carrier through. Haven't got the quote thing doen yet...but if that is so...you're in for a big treat Get Blakeys ONE NIGHT AT BIRDLAND where Clifford plays ONCE IN A WHILE then watch your dollars go... Won't stop you liking Chet Baker... but it's a whole new world Do it for me ....you don't like it...I'll send you cash in the mail... but Please BE HONEST You have to go there. Edited March 10, 2003 by P.D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim R Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 To me, the very early stuff on Pacific Jazz is his best. Especially the "Sings." Not just for the singing, but his trumpet playing on those sides is extremely lyrical and beautiful. He might just take a chorus, but they are spare and wonderful to me. Even a brief intro of his on these sides is extremely memorable. I think I could hum every note on these ones. Soul Stream, I'm right with you. I bought a copy of the original 12" version of the LP at a garage sale many years ago, and I've been a big fan of Chet ever since. You're absolutely right to mention his trumpet playing on those sessions. Despite the title and concept of the album, with the focus on the vocals, this is some of the best of Chet's trumpet playing, not to mention Russ Freeman's piano work. I went on to collect a LOT of Chet, and although I agree to an extent with some of the above criticisms, I think there are a lot of worthwhile discs out there besides the Prestige marathon session from '65. A few I would recommend are his RCA recordings from the early 60's; the aforementioned "She Was Too Good To Me"; "Deep In A Dream" (Moon) from 1976... kind of obscure; "Once Upon A Summertime" (Artists House/Galaxy); "Little Girl Blue" (Philology); and the "Last Great Concert- Straight From The Heart/My Favorite Songs" (Enja). Just to name some of my personal favorites. Chet did record prolifically in europe during the 80's, and some of it is bad. If you love Chet, it's just a matter of weeding out the bad from the good from the great... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 PD, I have been slowly trying to "balls up" my collection as was recommended to me at the BNBB a little over a year ago. I have been buying a lot of Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Herbie Hancock, and Grant Green. I have scheduled my next purchases to include Art Blakey, Hank Mobley, and at your recommendation, some Clifford Brown. If the version of "Once In A While" you mention is the caliber of "Delilah," I'm sure I'll dig it. Thanks for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.D. Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 I also forgot to put a plug in for Chet Bakers Paris recordings, They were on 4cds from verve, and I think verve recently put out a one CD issue of recordings culled from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clandy44 Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Soul Stream-I like Chet's singing and playing. Have a bunch of his work from early to late. I'm a huge fan of West Coast stuff from the early 50s with Chet and many others. The Paris cds (a 4 set from Barclay) are from 1955-I listen to Vol 2 all the time. Later, I really like Live at Nicks and Diane. Yeah, he had dental troubles, not to mention other troubles later, but he was a smarter, more mature player who didn't waste notes. Always found his singing to move me, but I like alot of non-traditional vocal types (Red Allen, Tea, Astaire, Don Redman). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Posted March 11, 2003 Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 For a long time I *hated* Chet Baker. I hated the way he played. I hated the way he sang. I hated the pathetic cult that grew up around him after his gradual disintegration from drug abuse and his mysterious death. I hated the way people romanticised him (the same way I used to hate the way people romanticised Billie Holiday). Then, a few years ago, I got "Chet" (because of Bill Evans, really) and I was surprised to find that I liked it. I picked up the stuff he did on PJ with Gerry Mulligan and on his own with the great Russ Freeman, and I found that I liked that stuff too. While I wasn't crazy about the vocals, I did like his playing with Getz in the 80s. After that, the only remaining hurdle was the singing. I picked up "Chet Baker Sings", and I never looked back. I'm a fan now. I love his playing. I love his singing. Still hate that stupid cult, though. I don't think his life or death were glamorous. He was a sad, but talented, man who lived a rather pathetic life. That's the odd thing about Getz: he abused himself as badly as Baker did, but it never interfered with his playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Stream Posted March 11, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 Alexander brings up a good point. I think many people are turned off to Chet because of his cult status. Many think, well...he was o.k, but just so glorified for his so-so ability. The looks, the lifestyle, the attitude. I wondered the same thing about myself liking him. Then, after several years I realized...I would like this music if it were sung and played by anyone. It's easy to be put off by people's looks, both good and bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted March 11, 2003 Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 FWIW, I enjoy Chet's playing on the Art Pepper date (Playboys) as well as Grey December. I'll have to give his recording w/Warne Marsh (Blues for a Reason) a couple more spins to get an impression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John L Posted March 11, 2003 Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 Alexander: So maybe there is hope for me yet? I have never really been able to "get" Chet Baker. It is not that I hate him. I can more or less enjoy listening to him, especially with Russ Freeman, who I do like quite a bit. But I don't hear the magic. Maybe it is just not my cup of tea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertblues Posted March 11, 2003 Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 I have always been partial to "The Italian Sessions", Baker plays with a lot of fire here. And Rene Thomas & Bobby Jaspar are great on this one as well. No vocals, and that's a good thing... B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Christensen Posted March 12, 2003 Report Share Posted March 12, 2003 Well, I have quite a few things with Chet B., and I agree that the singing he did in the fifties are the best, but there were a sadness in his late years that gets to me (just like Lady Day's last recordings). Somebody recommend to go to Clifford B. for trumpetplaying, he cuts Chet B. by miles (no pun), but what about the guy from where Clifford B. comes, namely Fats Navarro, who is (was) one of the all time greats of modern trumpetplaying, as a matter of fact (IMHO) he is on par with Dizzy and above Miles D. He only died too young (29), so he is forgotten by most people. just my two cents Vic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Stream Posted March 12, 2003 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2003 These guys are all giants. Fats, Clifford, Miles, ect. But I'll throw Chet's name up there too. A lot of jazz is about virtuosity. Some is not, like Lady Day or Miles to a lesser extent. I'll put Chet in that same bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clandy44 Posted March 12, 2003 Report Share Posted March 12, 2003 Chet's sound always appealed to me because I am not wed to having trumpeters work the high register like Maynard, Roy or Harry James-I have always grooved on the likes of Miles, Kenny Dorham and the like. And I never paid attention to Chet's so-called cult status because it was before my time. What attracts me to Chet is the melody, which is never far from anything he did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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