Mozart - The Violin Sonatas

[king ubu]

I'm deeply in love with Szgeti and Grumiaux' recordings of Mozart's violin sonatas (Szigeti on Vangaurd Classics, with Horszowski mostly, some with Szell, Grumiaux of course with Clara Haskil, alas noth complete). Then I also think Kagan/Richter are mighty good, but there I've only got four plus a fragmentary one (in the Richter ICON box) - is there more around?

But now ... I spent time with the Lumières box again yesterday, also playing the disc with two sonatas played by Chiara Banchini and Temenuschka Vesselinova (rec. 1993). Their discs (three releases, five CDs) are OOP, around on iTunes for ridiculous prices ... not sure I want to hunt these, but I am interested in these pieces, actually in love with a few of them, and it is a bit weird that there are comparatively few recordings around --- and no, I don't need Perlman or Mutter here, possibly Szeryng/Haebler one day, as I like Szeryng's Mozart concertos quite some, but really, Szigeti and Grumiaux are so good, if I buy other recordings, they rather ought to be different and HIP, I guess.

So far, what I have is this disc:

I've not played it often yet, stumbled over it by accident ... but my impression so far is pretty darn good! They play K 454, K 379/373a and K 296, as well as the variations on "Au bord d'une fontaine" K 360/374b.

Just now I was in a store which had the usual suspects there, but also this one, which I bought and plan to play today or tomorrow:

This set, rec. 1989 (disc two) and 1990 (disc one) contains on the first CD K 301-305 and on the second K 454, 481 and 526. First impression while perusing the player in the shop was pretty good, too.

Anyone has any opinions, favourites, other (including but not necessarily HIP) recordings to recommend?

[J.A.W.]

These non-HIP recordings are pretty good in my view:

Sonatas for Violin and Piano Nos.18, K301; 21, K304; 26, K378; 27, K379
• Augustin Dumay and Maria João Pires – DG

Sonatas for Violin and Piano Nos.27, K379; 32, K454; 35, K526
• Christian Tetzlaff and Lars Vogt – Ondine

As I've said ad nauseam I don't like the sound of a fortepiano, that's why I don't have any HIP performances of these sonatas.

Edited April 20, 2013 by J.A.W.

[Larry Kart]

Szymon Goldberg/Radu Lupu, even though Goldberg is somewhat past his prime.

An apt comment from a poster elsewhere: "I also like the Goldberg/Lupu recordings on Decca.... The violin tone is the tone of an old man, but has a special human quality, i can't describe."

[mikeweil]

I highly recommend Anton Steck and Marieke Spaans with the K 301-306 Sonatas - I saw them live with some, and here you get one of the all too rare opportunities to here Mozart on a tangent piano. There is more and more evidence that Mozart has owned a piano of this type, and it is perfectly suited to his music. The recording sounds excellent, and you get plenty of interviews (in German) with the two about the music. (There are cheap used copies on amazon.)

Edited April 20, 2013 by mikeweil

[king ubu]

Had to look up what a tangent piano is ... interesting, I guess, and rather different (less smooth) in sound than a fortepiano?

Do you know either of the two releases I pictured?

@Larry: not familiar with Goldberg at all yet ... got Lupu's Decca solo recorings here, but haven't yet started exploring them (need to dig into Schnabel's Schubert first, and that needs both time and the right moment).

[Larry Kart]

Had to look up what a tangent piano is ... interesting, I guess, and rather different (less smooth) in sound than a fortepiano?

Do you know either of the two releases I pictured?

@Larry: not familiar with Goldberg at all yet ... got Lupu's Decca solo recorings here, but haven't yet started exploring them (need to dig into Schnabel's Schubert first, and that needs both time and the right moment).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Szymon_Goldberg

If you have Spotify check out the Goldberg/Lupu K. 521. It's a great performance IMO of one of IMO the greatest pieces ever written. If you plug in Goldberg Lupu Mozart on Spotify, you'll get the whole set but undifferentiated. K. 521 begins sixth from the bottom of the whole schmeer.

[J.A.W.]

I highly recommend Anton Steck and Marieke Spaans with the K 301-306 Sonatas - I saw them live with some, and here you get one of the all too rare opportunities to here Mozart on a tangent piano. There is more and more evidence that Mozart has owned a piano of this type, and it is perfectly suited to his music. The recording sounds excellent, and you get plenty of interviews (in German) with the two about the music. (There are cheap used copies on amazon.)

Audio clips on AMG: http://www.allmusic.com/album/mozart-paris-1778-6-sonates-k-301-306-mw0001871677

On first hearing on my crappy computer speakers I didn't dislike the sound of the tangent piano as much as what I've heard of most fortepianos. Hm.

Did they record anything else?

Edited April 20, 2013 by J.A.W.

[king ubu]

Thanks Larry, but I don't subscribe to any such streaming services. However I see the Mozart box on London/Decca is around for a very good price on amazon.de - I'll order it. Not sure if Hartnack's book on violinists is out in english, but I've found it very useful (although old and sometimes very far away in style and language) and his mere page and a bit on Goldberg (summed up in a later chapter together with Odnoposoff and Gitlis) do make me want to check out Goldberg (though he only does mention Mozart's a major concerto and the Brahms sonatas as far as repertoire goes).

[Peter Friedman]

I have the Grumiaux /Walter Klien 4 CD Box on Philips

It would be difficult, in my opinion, to find a better set than that.

[king ubu]

Complete editions of those are going at those silly fantasy prices on amazon, it seems ... I love Grumiaux/Haskil, would you know how Grumiaux/Klien compares?

[J.A.W.]

I have the Grumiaux /Walter Klien 4 CD Box on Philips

It would be difficult, in my opinion, to find a better set than that.

That set goes for big bucks on all Amazon sites I've checked, usually more than $400. Ridiculous.

Edited April 20, 2013 by J.A.W.

[mikeweil]

It's a bit hard to explain ... there are two main differences between a tangent piano and a fortepiano.

One is the mechanics, which is less interesting for the listener, but important for the player.

The second aspect is the medium that strikes the string. In a fortepiano it is a hammer head, which developped into the modern hammer type covered with felt. The early 18th century fortepianos built by Bartolomeo Cristofori in Florence had handmade cardboard rolls covered with thin, soft leather, later viennese models had wooden heads covered with leather, replaced with felt over the time for the softer sound. Tangent pianos have wooden rods striking the string, which produces a harder, more brilliant sound resembling that of a plucked string in a harpsichord. Softer sounds were achieved by so-called moderators, thin stripes of cloth and/or felt placed between the tangents and the strings by levers or pedals (a feature of Viennese fortepianos, too). Thus you have a wide tonal palette ranging from harpsichord-like sounds to softest fortepiano-type sounds, depending on the attack and the use of moderators. There is growing evidence that the fortepiano Anton Walter built for Mozart was either a tangent piano or a fortepiano with naked wooden hammers. Furthermore this explains some rather puzzling aspects in Mozarts sonatas which call for a different sound from movement to movement for optimal performance (this was the subject of Siegbert Rampe's book on Mozart's piano music), which can be easily done with a tangent piano with moderators. Dutch pianist Arthur Schoonderwoerd currently explores these things in cooperation with piano builder Bill Juergenson. There is a complete series of the piano sonatas using different instruments, available only as download from a German Clasical Forum (Eroica Klassikforum). Schoonderwoerd records the piano concertos for the Dutch Accent label in similar fashion.

The main reason the tangent piano was in use for only a rather short period of time was its rather low volume in ensembles (a problem with early fortepianos just as well) and the mechanics which require a real pro player - if you hit the key too softly the tangent will not touch the string and you have no sound at all! Fortepiano mechanics ensure the hammer reaches the string in any case, so it was playable by amateurs which were an extremely important market at the time. But tangent pianos were obviously in wider use than previously thought and suits a lot of music from the second half of the 18th century perfectly. Hungarian pianist Miklós Spanyi recorded a whole series with the tangent piano for Hungaroton, an many C.P.E. Bach piano concertos for BIS. Just recently, a forgotten tangent piano in perfect condition was discovered in an attic in Germany that should be recorded soon. This all is the result of rather recent research, so recordings are scarce - and since old habits die hard, HIP pianists will not get accustomed to tangent instruments that easily, as they are harder to play.

One of the finest discs by Johan Huys with pieces by Mozart, Haydn, and C.P.E. Bach from 1989, which brilliantly shows what the instrument can do is long out of print and the label René Gailly is out of business ...

I am working on a thread on tangent pianos and its recordings for my HIP forum, but my time is limited ...

Frankly, I find the tangent piano the ideal keyboard for Mozart.

Edited April 20, 2013 by mikeweil

[mikeweil]

@ J.A.W.: Sadly, there are no other recordings of the Steck/Spaans duo - both are very busy teaching at Trossingen School, look at their agendas for a possible concert in the Netherlands: Marieke Spaans & Anton Steck.

An (incomplete) tangent piano discography is found in the French Wikipédia article on tangent pianos.

Edited April 21, 2013 by mikeweil

[king ubu]

Thanks a lot, Mike!

Those claviersonaten on tangent piano sound interesting. I'll check out the samples tomorrow, it's getting too late now, and I'm being lullabied by Kathleen Baker ...

[Chuck Nessa]

I learned these pieces from Vox recordings by Pauk/Frankl around 1970 and also bought the Szigeti set. I have never found a reason to move beyond these two, but the BBC mag disc of Pauk and Frankl revisiting 3 sonatas was a treat.

[Peter Friedman]

Complete editions of those are going at those silly fantasy prices on amazon, it seems ... I love Grumiaux/Haskil, would you know how Grumiaux/Klien compares?

I bought my Grumiaux / Klien box quite a few years ago when the price was very reasonable. I just checked Amazon and see what you

mean about the crazy prices for that set.

Have not heard the Grumiaux / Haskil set so am unable to make a comparison.

[king ubu]

I learned these pieces from Vox recordings by Pauk/Frankl around 1970 and also bought the Szigeti set. I have never found a reason to move beyond these two, but the BBC mag disc of Pauk and Frankl revisiting 3 sonatas was a treat.

Of all things, there's a Quadromania set with the Pauk/Frankl recordings - never heard of these two.

Seems all of Frankl's music is out on either Membran (and sub-labels/series) or ASV ... but there's a lot, including some interesting looking Bartók!

Here's the Beeb disc:

Actually, I don't think I *need* anything beyond Szigeti here - but I'm always on the lookout, so ... I will definitely pursue a few of the recordings mentioned here (Goldberg/Lupu should be on its way by tomorrow, and that tangent piano thingie I want to hear, too!)

Edited April 21, 2013 by king ubu

[alankin]

I have the Grumiaux /Walter Klien 4 CD Box on Philips

It would be difficult, in my opinion, to find a better set than that.

That set goes for big bucks on all Amazon sites I've checked, usually more than $400. Ridiculous.

I wonder if the same material is included on the more recent (2006), larger (9 CDs) and cheaper ($35 from Amazon) Philips set: "Mozart: Violin Sonatas; String Duos & Trios"?

http://www.amazon.com/Mozart-Violin-Sonatas-String-Trios/dp/B00004YSBH/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1366514125&sr=8-5&keywords=Grumiaux+Walter+Klien+mozart+philips+sonatas

Edited April 21, 2013 by alankin

[J.A.W.]

I have the Grumiaux /Walter Klien 4 CD Box on Philips

It would be difficult, in my opinion, to find a better set than that.

That set goes for big bucks on all Amazon sites I've checked, usually more than $400. Ridiculous.

I wonder if the same material is included on the more recent (2006), larger (9 CDs) and cheaper ($35 from Amazon) Philips set: "Mozart: Violin Sonatas; String Duos & Trios"?

http://www.amazon.com/Mozart-Violin-Sonatas-String-Trios/dp/B00004YSBH/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1366514125&sr=8-5&keywords=Grumiaux+Walter+Klien+mozart+philips+sonatas

It does include the Arthur Grumiaux/Walter Klien recordings. It also has recordings by Isabelle van Keulen (violin) and Ronald Brautigam (piano or harpsichord), Gérard Poulet (violin) and Blandine Verlet (harpsichord), and Arthur Grumiaux in various settings with Arrigo Pelliccia (viola) and the Academy of St. Martin-in-the-Fields Chamber Ensemble.

Edited April 21, 2013 by J.A.W.

[Carl Baugher]

I find the recordings by Anne-Sophie Mutter with Orkis from 2006 to be very fine for my taste. Her use of dynamics is not for everyone, perhaps, but she's always tasteful and virtuosic, of course. I have the DG ASM35 boxset where they're included but they are available individually, I'm sure.

[king ubu]

DOH! I totally forgot a more recent recording I really like: Frank Peter Zimmermann/Alexander Lonquich - there was a box on EMI, goes for insane prices, too, but a friend made me a copy a few months ago. Very good playing, no-bullshit approach as always with Zimmermann.