"Rearin' Back" Sonny Stitt

[sgcim]

I found this in the new releases section of a library, so I don't know if this is the first time this was available on CD, but it features two Stitt

LPs- Rearin' Back(1962) w/ Ronnie Matthews, Lex Humpries and Arthur Harper, and an earlier all Ellington set (1959)w/ Stan Levy and

Lou Levy. I forgot who played bass.

"Rearin' Back" is Stitt at his best, with equally good Matthews. Those of you ready to dismiss SS as just a Bird imitator should be happy

with today's jazz scene- nobody sounds like Bird anymore...

The Ellington set is pretty sad in comparison. Stitt plays tenor on all except three cuts, and doesn't get anywhere near where he was at on Rearin' Back.

[jlhoots]

I have Rearin' Back on CD from Japan (UCCC-9112) - late 2005, I presume long out of print.

[sonnymax]

...The Ellington set is pretty sad in comparison. Stitt plays tenor on all except three cuts, and doesn't get anywhere near where he was at on Rearin' Back.

What's so "sad" about Stitt's Ellington set? I agree it's not among his best, but it's much more than competent and quite enjoyable to my ears. Recorded for Verve in 1960, it features a great rhythm section (the bass player you forgot is none other than Paul Chambers), and you certainly can't fault the quality of the material. Sure, it wasn't released until 1973 under the title Previously Unreleased Recordings (see below), but I think that had more to do with the sheer volume of his recording output at the time rather than the quality of the music. Btw, you had it backwards, Sonny plays tenor on three tracks, alto on the remaining five. Finally, I think you'll find that few, if any, members of this board consider Sonny to be nothing more than a "Bird imitator". That's the kind of ignorant or ill-informed opinion that you may find elsewhere, but not here.

Edited March 18, 2014 by sonnymax

[paul secor]

...The Ellington set is pretty sad in comparison. Stitt plays tenor on all except three cuts, and doesn't get anywhere near where he was at on Rearin' Back.

What's so "sad" about Stitt's Ellington set? I agree it's not among his best, but it's much more than competent and quite enjoyable to my ears. Recorded for Verve in 1960, it features a great rhythm section (the bass player you forgot is none other than Paul Chambers), and you certainly can't fault the quality of the material. Sure, it wasn't released until 1973 under the title Previously Unreleased Recordings (see below), but I think that had more to do with the sheer volume of his recording output at the time rather than the quality of the music. Btw, you had it backwards, Sonny plays tenor on three tracks, alto on the remaining five. Finally, I think you'll find that few, if any, members of this board consider Sonny to be nothing more than a "Bird imitator". That's the kind of ignorant or ill-informed opinion that you may find elsewhere, but not here.

Some worthwhile discussion of Sonny Stitt here:

and here:

You'll find a range of opinions.

[sgcim]

You ain't kidding when you say a 'range of opinions'.

I have to admit that I was turned off to Stitt after working with a Stitt disciple, alto player for many years, who was very competent, but boring as hell.

He told a story about Stitt humiliating some fat, white tenor player who tried to sit in with him by pulling on the fat folds of flesh on his throat (like a turkey) while the guy

was playing!

I had also heard a bunch of Stitt recordings (and caught him live at the first Newport in NY shows) that didn't particularly impress me, but after recently hearing the Dizzy/Rollins/Stitt LP, I realized that when Stitt was 'on', it was something really special.

IMHO, the "Rearin' Back" LP with Ronnie Matthews was one of those 'on' albums, and the Ellington LP was not.

[JSngry]

He told a story about Stitt humiliating some fat, white tenor player who tried to sit in with him by pulling on the fat folds of flesh on his throat (like a turkey) while the guy

was playing!

That's that gunslinger mentality that was essential to survival back in the day but that can get you killed nowadays.

I have mixed emotions about the change, to put it mildly.

Let me put it this way - if the guy didn't fight back in some manner (preferably by playing better) then he deserved the disrespect he got, and should have learned from it for the next time.

Stitt would not have pulled that shit if he really respected they guy (and no matter how good the guy was, was he REALLY up to the job of sitting in with Sonny Stitt? Was Sonny Stitt his idea of a Benevolent Negro Grandfather who was there to share the love and the bandstand and make everybody feel good that Jazz Will Survive, All God's Children Got Rhythm And Can Play Changes!!! ? There's a rather...serious degree of Disrespectful Cluelessness inherent in the notion of sitting in with Sonny Stitt unless you're ready to BRING IT, ya' know?)) and/or if he knew that he couldn't have gotten by with it. Wrong place/wrong time, blood would have been spilled (or at least drawn), and perhaps rightfully so (depending on time/place).

But times have changed, and we make room for everybody these days, because we are such nice and evolved people and everybody's beautiful in their own way. So MANY people play the music now, and it has thrived and improved as a result!

Or something. Sonny Stitt is dead now.

[Larry Kart]

...The Ellington set is pretty sad in comparison. Stitt plays tenor on all except three cuts, and doesn't get anywhere near where he was at on Rearin' Back.

What's so "sad" about Stitt's Ellington set? I agree it's not among his best, but it's much more than competent and quite enjoyable to my ears. Recorded for Verve in 1960, it features a great rhythm section (the bass player you forgot is none other than Paul Chambers), and you certainly can't fault the quality of the material. Sure, it wasn't released until 1973 under the title Previously Unreleased Recordings (see below), but I think that had more to do with the sheer volume of his recording output at the time rather than the quality of the music. Btw, you had it backwards, Sonny plays tenor on three tracks, alto on the remaining five. Finally, I think you'll find that few, if any, members of this board consider Sonny to be nothing more than a "Bird imitator". That's the kind of ignorant or ill-informed opinion that you may find elsewhere, but not here.

Some worthwhile discussion of Sonny Stitt here:

and here:

You'll find a range of opinions.

Just for fun, compare what Moms said on the second thread above -- " All Stitt is very good Stitt and more than enough is much better than that. Just cuz certain yokels-- not thinking of anyone in particular, rather the general condescension towards Stitt-- couldn't keep up, that shouldn't be our problem, nor should we accept less esp. when there aren't any better ideas attached to the erstwhile 'alternatives'" -- to what he said at length about Stitt on the first one.

[paul secor]

...The Ellington set is pretty sad in comparison. Stitt plays tenor on all except three cuts, and doesn't get anywhere near where he was at on Rearin' Back.

What's so "sad" about Stitt's Ellington set? I agree it's not among his best, but it's much more than competent and quite enjoyable to my ears. Recorded for Verve in 1960, it features a great rhythm section (the bass player you forgot is none other than Paul Chambers), and you certainly can't fault the quality of the material. Sure, it wasn't released until 1973 under the title Previously Unreleased Recordings (see below), but I think that had more to do with the sheer volume of his recording output at the time rather than the quality of the music. Btw, you had it backwards, Sonny plays tenor on three tracks, alto on the remaining five. Finally, I think you'll find that few, if any, members of this board consider Sonny to be nothing more than a "Bird imitator". That's the kind of ignorant or ill-informed opinion that you may find elsewhere, but not here.

Some worthwhile discussion of Sonny Stitt here:

and here:

You'll find a range of opinions.

Just for fun, compare what Moms said on the second thread above -- " All Stitt is very good Stitt and more than enough is much better than that. Just cuz certain yokels-- not thinking of anyone in particular, rather the general condescension towards Stitt-- couldn't keep up, that shouldn't be our problem, nor should we accept less esp. when there aren't any better ideas attached to the erstwhile 'alternatives'" -- to what he said at length about Stitt on the first one.

Reading through the threads, I noticed that. I guess that's what makes Moms Moms - for better and for worse.

Edited March 20, 2014 by paul secor

[Joe]

He told a story about Stitt humiliating some fat, white tenor player who tried to sit in with him by pulling on the fat folds of flesh on his throat (like a turkey) while the guy

was playing!

That's that gunslinger mentality that was essential to survival back in the day but that can get you killed nowadays.

I have mixed emotions about the change, to put it mildly.

Let me put it this way - if the guy didn't fight back in some manner (preferably by playing better) then he deserved the disrespect he got, and should have learned from it for the next time.

Stitt would not have pulled that shit if he really respected they guy (and no matter how good the guy was, was he REALLY up to the job of sitting in with Sonny Stitt? Was Sonny Stitt his idea of a Benevolent Negro Grandfather who was there to share the love and the bandstand and make everybody feel good that Jazz Will Survive, All God's Children Got Rhythm And Can Play Changes!!! ? There's a rather...serious degree of Disrespectful Cluelessness inherent in the notion of sitting in with Sonny Stitt unless you're ready to BRING IT, ya' know?)) and/or if he knew that he couldn't have gotten by with it. Wrong place/wrong time, blood would have been spilled (or at least drawn), and perhaps rightfully so (depending on time/place).

But times have changed, and we make room for everybody these days, because we are such nice and evolved people and everybody's beautiful in their own way. So MANY people play the music now, and it has thrived and improved as a result!

Or something. Sonny Stitt is dead now.

Funny how hip-hop has followed a rather similar trajectory.

[sgcim]

He told a story about Stitt humiliating some fat, white tenor player who tried to sit in with him by pulling on the fat folds of flesh on his throat (like a turkey) while the guy

was playing!

That's that gunslinger mentality that was essential to survival back in the day but that can get you killed nowadays.

I have mixed emotions about the change, to put it mildly.

Let me put it this way - if the guy didn't fight back in some manner (preferably by playing better) then he deserved the disrespect he got, and should have learned from it for the next time.

Stitt would not have pulled that shit if he really respected they guy (and no matter how good the guy was, was he REALLY up to the job of sitting in with Sonny Stitt? Was Sonny Stitt his idea of a Benevolent Negro Grandfather who was there to share the love and the bandstand and make everybody feel good that Jazz Will Survive, All God's Children Got Rhythm And Can Play Changes!!! ? There's a rather...serious degree of Disrespectful Cluelessness inherent in the notion of sitting in with Sonny Stitt unless you're ready to BRING IT, ya' know?)) and/or if he knew that he couldn't have gotten by with it. Wrong place/wrong time, blood would have been spilled (or at least drawn), and perhaps rightfully so (depending on time/place).

But times have changed, and we make room for everybody these days, because we are such nice and evolved people and everybody's beautiful in their own way. So MANY people play the music now, and it has thrived and improved as a result!

Or something. Sonny Stitt is dead now.

I guess you've got a point there. Where would music be today if that drummer (Jo jones?) hadn't flung that cymbal at Bird when he tried to sit in at a session and didn't have his shit together?

That made Bird woodshed like a maniac, and look what he came up with...

Max Roach tried to pull something similar with Ornette at the Five Spot, but I don't think it took...

Roland Kirk got his ass kicked by Stitt, and then RRK went on to kick ass whenever he could- ask Dave Liebman, George Adams, and many others about it.