LouisvillePrez

John Coltrane in 80 minutes?

45 posts in this topic

1. Ascension - Edition II (40:23)

2. Ascension - Edition I (38:31)

:P


banana.gifbananadance.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm surprised nobody has thrown in India. To this day hearing him and Dolphy rip the paint off the walls on that one is still a huge thrill!

I'd also have to find a way to shoehorn Your Lady onto the CD.

Not going to attempt to make a list and by in large I agree with what's been posted but I can't believe no one has mentioned I Want To Talk About You in one of it's incarnations. Pretty definitive Coltrane IMHO.

Yeah, the coda he always put together for that one is like a Coltrane highlight reel in and of itself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have to include a track from Interstellar Space

One would be surprised what a new listener is capable of hearing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Ascension - Edition II (40:23)

2. Ascension - Edition I (38:31)

:P

banana.gifbananadance.gif

hehe. reading this thread at one point I was tempted to post the same.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I connected with A Love Supreme long before Giant Steps and My Favorite Things, despite acquiring all three around the same time.

I would place parts of "A Love Supreme" on my comp along with "My Favorite Things" and leave out "Giant Steps." Not sure what you mean.

I was agreeing with your choices! A collection that focused on Ballads, Giant Steps and pre-Atlantic stuff would have probably bored me as a budding jazz listener.

My first intro to Trane was My Favorite Things and I was hooked. As someone said, it depends on your target audience. If they don't like Favorite Things, they may not like Trane.

Most likelyiIf they don't like the Atlantic "My Favorite Things", they won't like jazz. It's about as universal as you can get.

When I first heard MFT, I was quite indifferent to it. Whereas I was quickly sucked into A Love Supreme. Listeners have different entry points into this music.

Edited by Guy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One would be surprised what a new listener is capable of hearing

Which is exactly why I'd put India in the mix. Up until I heard that for the first time I had been only listening to stuff like 50's Miles and Monk. India was both emotionally and physically shocking, but I knew right away I had to hear it again, and again, and again!

It then set me down a path to find more things like it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My first question would be, How old is the person to whom you are introducing? It as been my experience that while all of us come to jazz from different directions, the younger you are the more likely you are to arrive via the avant garde or outside stuff; while the older folks seem to come to jazz through the more straight ahead stuff. Broad generalization, I know, but it works in my experience.

I personally got into Coltrane through the "Best Of" Atlantic recordings............but I am an old guy!!!!

Worthy cause I might add !!!! :D

Edited by Morganized

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm surprised nobody has thrown in India. To this day hearing him and Dolphy rip the paint off the walls on that one is still a huge thrill!

I'd also have to find a way to shoehorn Your Lady onto the CD.

Not going to attempt to make a list and by in large I agree with what's been posted but I can't believe no one has mentioned I Want To Talk About You in one of it's incarnations. Pretty definitive Coltrane IMHO.

Yeah, the coda he always put together for that one is like a Coltrane highlight reel in and of itself.

Totally agree on India. Also, Spiritual really made an impression on me (no pun intended) the first time I heard it so many years ago. Still routnely come back to it for a bit of "audio comfort" on a pretty regular basis.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My introduction to Coltrane, when I was coming out of rock listening, came as a result of the choices of a kindly and well informed record store clerk. He picked out a beginning jazz collection for me at my request. The collection included two Coltrane compilations:

a 2 LP Atlantic compilation, The Art of John Coltrane, which had on it: Syeeda's Song Flute, Aisha, Countdown, Mr. Knight, My Shining Hour, Blues to Bechet, The Invisible, My Favorite Things, Giant Steps, Central Park West, Like Sonny, Body and Soul,

......

Exactly this 2-lp set made it for me in the late 80s. Within a year or two I purchased all his Atlantic output (80s US LP reissues) and still I think this is my preferred Trane period and it could be a nice introduction for anybody.

John-Coltrane-The-Art-Of-John-C-471559.j

Edited by Alexandros

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to think about it, tough choice if I choose from the over 50 Trane albums in my collection.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Blue Train

Giant Steps

Impressions

Crescent

Edit: Also My Favorite Things, and the Monk stuff.

Edited by psu_13

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again, these are not my favorite Coltrane recordings now, or "the best" of Coltrane. I am thinking of a pop music listener, who wants an introduction to Coltrane.

If I may press a question, do we sell non-jazz listeners short by not wanting to introduce them to the best -- even if we think that the best may be intimidating, difficult, etc.?

At the end of the day, music is people doing things to other things to make sounds - sounds to which other people listen and respond. One thing that I have always appreciated about AG work is how it often drives home just this point -- which makes AG music really accessible. Put another way, I have often found that people one expect to like KOB only, when it comes to jazz, can really enjoy more if pointed in good directions.

I have to admit my own self interestedness in all of this. When I have wanted to introduce people to Coltrane (not sure about whether I intend to "convert," but that is another question), I try to go for some sort of career retrospective thing. My Coltrane collection, however, is really slim in the post-classic quartet department. When I originally wrote this question, I was curious if/what "late period" Coltrane might show up. I have Stellar Regions and Meditations, and that is it (and I like First Meditations better than Meditations).

I do think that all of my selections are very top level Coltrane, and that my list could arguably be a list of some of the best Coltrane ever. It is not a watered down list of sub-par Coltrane, by any means.

I have spent a lot of time socializing with adults ages 30-60 in the past year, from different groups, and different walks of life. I am surprised at how little awareness of ANY jazz exists in much of the general population today. I would not introduce jazz to anyone in 2015 with an avant garde track. There seems to be zero ability to process the avant garde among many adults today. Country and dance pop are immensely popular right now. Blues, jazz, rock--not so popular. I think that if you want to introduce an artist like Coltrane to someone, it is strategically good to focus on accessible, but high quality, tracks first. Many people will not like any jazz no matter what you provide. When I started to like jazz, I needed gateways into different artists. I did not tend to start with the more challenging works by any jazz artist.

It all depends on who you are providing this 80 minute introduction to. If you are providing it to a 19 year old who likes the most extreme death metal or hardcore punk, you would probably focus on excerpts from "Om", and tracks from "Meditations" and "Live from Seattle." If you are providing it to a person who likes a little jazz, but is just getting their feet wet so to speak with the entire jazz genre, and is not sure if they will want to go further into jazz or not, then my list is possibly a good one to go with.

I would think that if the recipient liked the 80 minute introduction, that the recipient would tend to delve deeper, branch out and listen to tracks like "India", songs from "Interstellar Space" and other less obviously accessible works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a fine list, just a bit boring, IMO. Then again, I'm probably far more adventurous than most who would be getting into Jazz.

All I know is that I had to sit and intently listen to Kind Of Blue around 12-14 times before I finally "got" it. And my first two Monk albums (all purchased around the same time) got two listens and then hit the shelf for a rather extended period of time. And while our local PBS "played the hits" during their night time Jazz programming, I was still very lukewarm to the art form.

But that time I put in the first disc from the Village Vanguard box, I went through some kind of weird and wonderful transmigration of my musical soul. I started out aghast and bewildered, wondering how ANYONE could even dare consider this music! After a few minutes I started wondering if there was something here that I was missing. Later, I started thinking that perhaps there IS something going on here. When it finally ended, I had absolutely no idea what the hell I had just listened to, but knew that I had to listen to it again immediately!

10:20 of life, death, and reincarnation.

As Steve said, don't be surprised what one can hear. Sometimes shock and excitement is just what the doctor ordered. It's one of the main reasons I have a harder and harder time getting into something new, musically. Those shocks and surprises are nearly impossible to find anymore.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would choose:

Russian Lullaby

Blue Train

Bahia

Focus on Insanity

Syeeda's Song Flute

Harmonique

India (Complete VV disc 4)

Lonnie's Lament (Afro Blue Impressions)

The Drum Thing (such a great track, IMO)

Peace on Earth (Live in Japan), disc 1-neither version is as out as the other stuff on the set for a new listener, a lot of melodic playing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disc 4 track 4.

Track 1 isn't as impressive, IMO. Plus it doesn't have Bushell playing that excellent oboe opening.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would choose:

Russian Lullaby

Blue Train

Bahia

Focus on Insanity

Syeeda's Song Flute

Harmonique

India (Complete VV disc 4)

Lonnie's Lament (Afro Blue Impressions)

The Drum Thing (such a great track, IMO)

Peace on Earth (Live in Japan), disc 1-neither version is as out as the other stuff on the set for a new listener, a lot of melodic playing

:D Can't decide if I'm more curious to find out

1 - how you fit that on an 80 minute disc

2 - what the response of someone new to jazz was to 26:25 of Peace on Earth, especially to Pharoah Sanders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Assembling & burning CDs are a pain in the butt, especially when they're of the "blind date" variety (and especially if you don't have your entire collection digitized). I'd rather just make burns of Soultrane, Crescent, & Interstellar Space, send along a link to a good discography, and then tell them to move forward and/or backward from any one of those three until they've had enough. There, you've done your part with minimal effort yet maximum service. From there, it's up to them. If they get it, they'll have a lot of somewheres to go, and if they don't, hey, what are you out? Three blanks and about 30 minutes?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Below is the link to an interesting thesis written on the performance evolution of "My Favorite Things" from 1960 to 1966. I've done the listening as the author has suggested a number of times since finding this piece a few years ago. It's not a bad way to be exposed and understand Coltrane's stylistic changes during this period of time.

http://coltrane.room34.com/thesis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lock someone in a chair in front of Tony Malaby, Michael Formanek & Nasheet Waits who has never heard jazz and get back to me.

If you were at the shows last fall @ Cornelia Street, you might understand

They may want to run and hide after a bit but within the hour, I say many would like it or even be blown away.

My wife loves it live. My wife loved Evan Parker live. In duet with Sylvie Courvoisier. No drums, no tunes - pure free improvisation. Loved it.

She is a pop music fan. Don't underestimate the ears of potential listeners and don't underestimate the power of world class improvising musicians.

The idea that no one would get into "jazz" through the avant-garde is presumptuous at best.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Assembling & burning CDs are a pain in the butt, especially when they're of the "blind date" variety (and especially if you don't have your entire collection digitized). I'd rather just make burns of Soultrane, Crescent, & Interstellar Space, send along a link to a good discography, and then tell them to move forward and/or backward from any one of those three until they've had enough. There, you've done your part with minimal effort yet maximum service. From there, it's up to them. If they get it, they'll have a lot of somewheres to go, and if they don't, hey, what are you out? Three blanks and about 30 minutes?

+1,000,000!

*applause*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.