sidewinder Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 Ha - compulsory flamin' hi-vis jacket ! I've been on the fence about that Bill Birch book. Would you say it is a 'must have'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 Ha - compulsory flamin' hi-vis jacket ! I've been on the fence about that Bill Birch book. Would you say it is a 'must have'? No, I wouldn't say it's a "must have". Of great interest, of course, to someone who has listened to jazz in Manchester over the years, was at the gigs and knew the local musicians - for someone like that it's something of a personal diary. But the book's style is basically a list of names and dates: " On 18th March X was back again at the Free Trade Hall, this time with a quintet", etc. I don't recall any insights, conclusions or revelations from behind the scenes. (Sorry about the put down, Big Beat Steve, as I know you're rather keen on this one. ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidewinder Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 Thanks for that - I'll probably pass then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 (edited) No, I wouldn't say it's a "must have". Of great interest, of course, to someone who has listened to jazz in Manchester over the years, was at the gigs and knew the local musicians - for someone like that it's something of a personal diary. But the book's style is basically a list of names and dates: " On 18th March X was back again at the Free Trade Hall, this time with a quintet", etc. I don't recall any insights, conclusions or revelations from behind the scenes. (Sorry about the put down, Big Beat Steve, as I know you're rather keen on this one. ) In fact I do understand you and in some places throughout the book i have felt that he leans towards working off a diary with dates, etc. too. And although OF COURSE I have not only never been there but also was born much too late to have been able to be there at all if I had just traveled there I approached the book from a totally different angle and like it just for what it is (to me, anyway): 1) It adds to the documentation of post-war jazz in Britain and fills gaps (stretching beyond the regional aspect of the book), including through its illustrations, that I feel won't be filled elsewhere - particularly since it adds to a lot of ground not covered by Jim Godbolt in HIS history (which I feel is nice for lack of a better one but I find it rather unbalanced and often scratching the surface only) 2) It essentially covers a key period of jazz that I am interested in and therefore avoids turning into a "history" book that purports to cover it all but ends up focusing too much on more recent decades because more recent material is easier available and researchable there and likely sales prospects are better if you feature artists still on "everyone's" minds 3) A strictly personal thing: I like those regional histories that IMHO flesh out the overall picture. Anyone can cover New York, London, as the no. 1 focus points and leave it at that, but ... I for one find lots of interest and merit in regional books on Detroit, Chicago, Newark, Boston, etc. I have bought over the years. Highly subjective, of course, and I would not expect too many others to attach the same kind of importance to those criteria. BTW, I would not consider it "essential" overall either but rather a very good "special interest" book. Edited May 16, 2015 by Big Beat Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF Posted May 16, 2015 Report Share Posted May 16, 2015 No, I wouldn't say it's a "must have". Of great interest, of course, to someone who has listened to jazz in Manchester over the years, was at the gigs and knew the local musicians - for someone like that it's something of a personal diary. But the book's style is basically a list of names and dates: " On 18th March X was back again at the Free Trade Hall, this time with a quintet", etc. I don't recall any insights, conclusions or revelations from behind the scenes. (Sorry about the put down, Big Beat Steve, as I know you're rather keen on this one. ) In fact I do understand you and in some places throughout the book i have felt that he leans towards working off a diary with dates, etc. too. And although OF COURSE I have not only never been there but also was born much too late to could have been there at all if I had just traveled there I approached the book from a totally different angle and like it just for what it is (to me, anyway): 1) It adds to the documentation of post-war jazz in Britain and fills gaps (stretching beyond the regional aspect of the book), including in its illustrations, that I feel won't be filled elsewhere - particularly since it adds to a lot of ground not covered by Jim Godbolt in HIS history (which I feel is nice for lack of a better one but I find it rather unbalanced and often scratching the surface only) 2) It essentially covers a key period of jazz that I am interested in and therefore avoids turning into a "history" book that purports to cover it all but ends up focusing too much on more recent decades because more recent material is easier available and researchable there and likely sales propsects are better if you mention artists still on "everyone's" minds 3) A strictly personal thing: I like those regional histories that IMHO flesh out the overall picture. Anyone can cover New York, London, as the no. 1 focus points and leave it at that, but ... I for one find lots of interest and merit in regional books on Detroit, Chicago, Newark, Boston, etc. I have bought over the years. Highly subjective, of course, and I would not expect too many others to attache the same kind of importance to those criteria. BTW, I would not consider it "essential" overall either but rather a very good "special interest" book. OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted May 18, 2015 Report Share Posted May 18, 2015 Received my copy of the biography today. Agree with the other forumists - briefly thumbing through the pages, the contents look very impressive and in-depth. I'll be looking forward to devouring it in the sun at the beach! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Just finished the Tubby biography and, yes, great! Simon has unique qualifications as a jazz biography author. He plays the same instrument as his subject in very much the same style, he is also a writer by profession and he is an inveterate researcher and walking encyclopedia on the history of British jazz. I realised the last a few years ago when I told him that in my youth I'd seen Victor Feldman at Ronnie's on a triumphant Christmas visit, but that I couldn't recall the year. "1959, just before he joined Cannonball Adderley," he instantly replied. As others have remarked, a labour of love and a compelling and often moving read. Simon's writing style is certainly distinctive, ranging from the very formal, "the author considers ..." to the epithet, "tear-arse". And what is this word "sundered" that he keeps using? In considering the legacy of Tubby in British jazz at the end of the book, Simon shows laughable modesty, never once mentioning himself. His final footnote even suggests Alan Barnes as the inheritor of the Hayes mantle! Recommended! Edited June 14, 2015 by BillF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidewinder Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Foyles in London has a whole stack of this book on display in the Jazz section. Good to see ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Simon's writing style is certainly distinctive, ranging from the very formal, "the author considers ..." to the epithet, "tear-arse". And what is this word "sundered" that he keeps using? That's what struck me too. Must be a sort of watermark of his. Can't recall having read this word before, except in expressions such as "rent asunder" (which no doubt has the same linguistic roots). Otherwise - a compelling read, yes ... Have progressed to 1966 and so far I found it hard to put down (though I do not have much leisure to continue with the rest right now). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Lark Ascending Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Foyles in London has a whole stack of this book on display in the Jazz section. Good to see ! Yet it was nowhere to be seen in Bath or Salisbury a couple of weeks back. Have ordered from Amazon - saving it for the summer hols to read, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Simon's writing style is certainly distinctive, ranging from the very formal, "the author considers ..." to the epithet, "tear-arse". And what is this word "sundered" that he keeps using? That's what struck me too. Must be a sort of watermark of his. Can't recall having read this word before, except in expressions such as "rent asunder" (which no doubt has the same linguistic roots). Yes, a very strange one. I'd be unfazed if I met "sundered" in traditional English poetry from Milton to Tennyson, but not in writing like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillF Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Otherwise - a compelling read, yes ... Have progressed to 1966 and so far I found it hard to put down (though I do not have much leisure to continue with the rest right now). Fortunately, as I'm retired I had time not just to read the book, but to read along with the music too. (Spotify has just about everything by Hayes.) As a saxophonist who's clearly had a full musical education as well as knowing the work of other relevant hornmen, Simon's analyses of what's happening in Tubby's solos are in a class of their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Man Posted June 16, 2015 Report Share Posted June 16, 2015 Yes, I finished reading my copy recently... enjoyed it. Definitely better than most musical biographies I've read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Amazon.ca - today's price in Canadian dollars $34.28 + 6.49 shipping from Great Britain . Still a bit pricey but a definite buy at some point. Will keep my eye on it. Seriously, I believe this book is worth double the asking price - it was researched for over 10 years and it shows. Fascinating facts on every page. agreed .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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