Lee Konitz & The Art Of Taking Your Time

[JSngry]

I can think of very few "improvising" musicians of this or any other generation or genre who would be this willing to let it get there on its own terms, not when the terms are this clear and the bar so high. Especially not in front of a bigass hall-full of paying customers.

I don't know if this is "great jazz", but it sure as hell is a great example of really improvising.

And check out Alan Dawson, just riding it along leaving that canvas totally open for anything Lee wants to play. And dig how when Dawson kinda lights him up during the fours, Lee lights him back up in return. That's a Sonny Stitt move right there, but Lee Konitz is the anti-Sonny Stitt. Yet and still, warriors gonna warrior, no matter what their battle.

And then, off he schlubs, noun as verb, motion in poetry.

Music is about music up to a point, but after that point, it's about character, period.

[mjzee]

That was interesting. Great commentary on your part, Jim. I don't know if I would've stuck to it past the 2 minute mark, but then, around 3:14, Lee just clicked in to the wave he was waiting for, and it got more absorbing - still Lee, but more substance than before. There's an essential quietness to his sound.

Nice bassist, too - who was it?

[JSngry]

NHOP

[JSngry]

And it's funny/"funny", I've heard some people over the years, when you talk about how Lee, Sonny Rollins, Roscoe, a few other, are willing to take their time to get it to where they really want it to be (if, as was often the case with Sonny, it ever got there a all), they would actually get kinda riled and say some variant of "man, I don't have that kind of time to wait on anything", sometimes it was an issue of marketplace realities, sometimes it was more personal, like, you know, when you hit it, you're supposed to already be where you need to be, that's kind the whole point of it, right? The notion was that sure, people have levels/gears/whatever, but, you know, you're a professional, you're getting paid, you should always have a base to start from, not just in competency, but in zone. WAIT for it to happen? Hell, while you're waiting, somebody else is getting your gig, somebody who is not that patient, in any way.

And I get that. Get that and fully feel what drives it. Making a living is not a luxury. But still, the most radical/subversive/noble thing a human can do, I think, is to not be bullied into being false so as to appear true, especially if it's one's self who is doing the bullying. Sometimes/usually the bullies win, that's why they do it, because it works more often than not, just sayin'...Fear is one helluva a motivator, but it's not always a healthy one over the long term.

[Quasimado]

That was interesting. Great commentary on your part, Jim. I don't know if I would've stuck to it past the 2 minute mark, but then, around 3:14, Lee just clicked in to the wave he was waiting for, and it got more absorbing - still Lee, but more substance than before. There's an essential quietness to his sound.

Very, very nice. It often takes Lee a while to find the wave, but when he does, it's a great ride. This rhythm section certainly gave him great support.

In most of the recordings from about '54 on, there are those times when he gets the flow going, excelling even what can be heard here. It's always beautiful to hear.

Thanks for posting.

Q

Edited June 6, 2015 by Quasimado

[Larry Kart]

It seems to me that almost from the first here Lee's time and swing are very Pres-like (which is hardly news), and that Alan Dawson picks up on that right off, both in his own playing and his "aw yes" facial expression/body language.

[colinmce]

That's an amazing video.

[Steve Reynolds]

From my experiences of listening and experiencing music in a live setting, the greatest improvisors often might not get where they might be going until the second set. The good improvisors often get to where they might be going within ten minutes.

On a great night I heard one of the greats (who often may not hit the spot until very late in the proceedings) hit it ten minutes in and not lose it for the whole 2 hours the band played.

[sgcim]

Lee proves that you can play as free as any of the 'free' players and still stay within the tonal system.

He seems to have made a living out of playing "ATTYA".

Here's more from the same session:

[Clunky]

That's an amazing video.

??

[jazztrain]

Alan Dawson was the first call drummer in Boston for years when visiting artists came to town without a rhythm section. He didn't like the road, so he spent many years in Boston.

He was an exquisitely sensitive and subtle drummer, and I had the distinct pleasure of sitting at arm's length from him on many occasions. He's much missed.

[AllenLowe]

I sometimes love Konitz, sometimes lose patience with him, though that's probably more me than him; however, I will say that I saw him night after night at a place called Gregory's in the middle '70s; it was a tiny bar and seems to me now the best way to hear Lee: up close, 3 feet from the bell of his horn, because his playing is like an intimate conversation. At a distance it's sometimes hard for me to focus my attention, but at close quarters I was astounded by his cleverness and subtlety.

another thing I think he learned from Prez was that uncanny way in which he paraphrases a melody. I used to just be amazed at how obliquely he could suggest the tune while still playing the oddest of harmonic shapes.

Edited June 6, 2015 by AllenLowe

[colinmce]

By coincidence I was listening to The Freedom Book yesterday and Alan Dawson was just smoking. The first cut, "A Lunar Tune" has jaw-dropping playing from everyone, especially Jaki Byard, but just ... holy shit, Alan Dawson. Nobody plays quite like him.

[JSngry]

The case for a Boston Drum Thing that runs straight through Roy Haynes to Alan Dawson to Tony Williams is there to be made, for those who want to make it, particularly when it comes to snare drum tuning.

I was so wanting this to be Alan Dawson, but no, it's Roy, and yes, of course, but not as dissimilar as foreknowledge might have to hear.

[sgcim]

The case for a Boston Drum Thing that runs straight through Roy Haynes to Alan Dawson to Tony Williams is there to be made, for those who want to make it, particularly when it comes to snare drum tuning.

I was so wanting this to be Alan Dawson, but no, it's Roy, and yes, of course, but not as dissimilar as foreknowledge might have to hear.

Yeah, that worked out much better than I thought it would.

[lubbee]

Could someone please repost the first Konitz trio above? Since it disappeared on this thread, I've been unable to find it anywhere else. Fascinating performance.

 

[Gheorghe]

Really, for those listening more to the mainstream of sax playing, it´s possible for some he is not first choice, but you have to listen between the lines. As early as his 1948 encounter with Miles (when he obviously replaced Bird for a night, since it was Miles with Bird´s rhyhthm section and Lee on alto, he has his thing and there are some tricky things in his solos that nobody else did until then.

[Quasimado]

Which session/ recording are you referring to, Gheorghe?

Q

[Big Beat Steve]

This one??

 

 

[Gheorghe]

yes, this one. Lee´s really good, doing his thing.

[JSngry]

19 hours ago, lubbee said:

Could someone please repost the first Konitz trio above? Since it disappeared on this thread, I've been unable to find it anywhere else. Fascinating performance.

 

No luck here, either, sorry. But have this as a consolation?

 

[lubbee]

Thanks. I have a nice memory of Lee from 1977.  I was 18, a freshman studying philosophy at Temple University in Philadelphia. One night I want to a club called Just Jazz to hear Lee, Jimmy Merritt, Philly Joe (who played all the time in town), and Barry Harris, There were about 8 people in the club and Lee came and sat down with my friend and I and chatted for 10 minutes or so. My friend asked him how it was to play with Philly Joe and Lee held his hand out and mimicked Philly's light finger action on the ride cymbal saying he loved his time. I've seen Lee a few times since then, mostly in St. Paul Minnesota at a defunct, musician owned club, the Artist's Quarter. Ran the gamut from utter boredom to inspired sublimity. Once Lew Tabackin was telling a story about playing in Barcelona and going out to listen to some flamenco music late at night. He and the party kept waiting and waiting for the music to start. Lew said "You know, it's like a Lee Konitz show. You wait around long enough and something interesting might happen."

[Gheorghe]

Great memories ! Lee with Barry Harris, Jimmy Merritt and Philly Joe Jones together , something like that might be on record. On my God, that must have been great. And it´s really interesting sometimes to hear a more laid back and subtle hornplayer with a so called strong rhythm section. If the vibrations are right, something fantastic might happen.....

[lubbee]

Actually, when Lew made that remark, which everyone laughed about, he was sort of on the fence about whether it was worth hanging around to see if anything would, in fact, happen. Maybe, maybe not.  Like with Sonny Rollins. Sometimes Sonny might play the head of a song 30 times in a row and fail to find a way out into a variation and then another night he might play 40 minutes on Four (Live in Denmark, 1968). The mixture of tedium and enlightenment is the true melody line. Sometimes you stare in utterly soul crushing boredom at the scribblings of a master (to move in visual territory) or listen to Lee Konitz using every ounce of his strength and ability to avoid playing faster. He doesn't want to play faster. He wants to listen to the musicians behind him and avoid "schmaltz" (still bugs me how a nice Jewish kid turns into a fucking devote of Scientology, sheesh Lee) and avoid the kind of cliches he thinks are inevitable when you play faster than you can think. Even though the most exciting moments in his playing are just when that desire for a kind of deliberate abandon gives way to letting his fingers free. Anyway, I still remember that evening with Lee and his peers from the same generation. I remember our seats, the view, Philly Joe's cool licks, and the feeling that I was being let in on a great secret.

At the time, I was working at the Temple University full time jazz radio station WRTI, the freedom sounds, as was said on the air at the time (the station is no longer either full time jazz or really any good) and getting a good view of how few people actually came out to listen to jazz. It's true that Dexter, in his return to the US was packing them in at that time (at a club called Stars, if I remember correctly), but most shows, even with well known musicians, were very sparsely attended. 

[Coda]

I see that Lee Konitz is scheduled to play at the Regattabar for this 90th birthday celebration, late January 2018.   I just found my xmas present to me.  There's no mention of a band so I have no idea what to expect.