GA Russell

Joe Henderson '60s Blue Note

68 posts in this topic

The stuff with the Japanese rhythm section amazed me when I first heard it 40 years ago.

A really hyper-critical listening will reveal the bassist to be just a teence of a weak link, but if you're gonna listen that critically to that much heat, it should probably be because it's your record in some form or fashion.

Otherwise, it wasn't until i got out of East Texas and lat-nite jazz radio that I leaned that not everybody played "Blue Bossa" like Joe did on that album. Talk about a cold water alarm clock...

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More Joe Henderson is always good. Inner Urge is a must. I still need to pick up Our Thing. I've been meaning to get around to it for about 30 years now. I love Joe and Kenny Dorham together, but Una Mas always sounds a bit uninspired whenever I put it on.

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Has "Basra" ever been released as RVG remaster?

Thanks.

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Yes, in Europe (only with copy control technology), and in Japan. The new budget release is most likely the RVG.

I own the Connoisseur, BN Works, and JRVG, and prefer the latter. It's one of the few RVGs I enjoy.

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Yes, in Europe (only with copy control technology), and in Japan. The new budget release is most likely the RVG.

I own the Connoisseur, BN Works, and JRVG, and prefer the latter. It's one of the few RVGs I enjoy.

the japanese RVG TOCJ-9104 is excellent ....

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Yes, in Europe (only with copy control technology), and in Japan. The new budget release is most likely the RVG.

I own the Connoisseur, BN Works, and JRVG, and prefer the latter. It's one of the few RVGs I enjoy.

the japanese RVG TOCJ-9104 is excellent ....

That's the mini-lp?

I have the 2008 jewel case edition, TOCJ-7147.

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Speaking of moods, I'm in one to go ahead and suggest Joe Henderson In Japan on Milestone. Frisky!

IMO this one and the later Blue Note Village Vanguard Twofer are his best live recordings.

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Inner Urge was one of my least favourite sessions until recently. I found the RVG dull and uninvolving. All that changed with the arrival of a NYC mono . Now it's a favourite.....

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Speaking of moods, I'm in one to go ahead and suggest Joe Henderson In Japan on Milestone. Frisky!

IMO this one and the later Blue Note Village Vanguard Twofer are his best live recordings.

I know lots of people love "State of the Tenor," but for me the playing sounds too constrictive -- I'm not convinced Joe is really into all of the material selected for him, the tunes are atypically short compared to Joe's best playing in those days and the sound mix for me doesn't work: not nearly enough Foster in the balance and way too much bass (that's an LP impression; if that's been fixed on CD, somebody tell me...). In any case there were some European live concerts of similar vintage that I prefer, especially "An Evening with Joe Henderson" (Red). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMkkqphwI-k&list=PLF06EF13D310BE710

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It's all a matter of taste, I suppose - I saw Henderson perform several times during his "European touring years", and always found his solos a bit long - that's why liked the more concise approach on those Blue Note sessions. Maybe the producer asked him to keep it compact for the CD release.

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51mO9e7P8UL.jpg

It just occurred to me where this picture might have been taken. Is it the wall that's part of Lincoln Center (the Amsterdam Avenue side)? This would make sense, since BN's office was on W. 61 St. It looks so familiar...

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It's all a matter of taste, I suppose - I saw Henderson perform several times during his "European touring years", and always found his solos a bit long - that's why liked the more concise approach on those Blue Note sessions. Maybe the producer asked him to keep it compact for the CD release.

I hear you and appreciate the sentiment. I think there's no question that the producers (Cuscuna/Crouch) were interested in getting lots of material on the recordings and the understanding was that the performances would be more compact than usual for Joe at the time. In fairness to the producers, it is worth nothing that some of the tunes they selected for Joe ended up being part of is repertoire for the rest of is life -- "Beatrice," "Ask Me Now."

Edited by Mark Stryker

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It seems incredibly petty to me that Blue Note would put "Etc." in place of McCoy's name on the covers of Page One, In 'n Out and Night Dreamer just because (I'm assuming) McCoy was recording as a leader for Impulse at the time.

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Speaking of moods, I'm in one to go ahead and suggest Joe Henderson In Japan on Milestone. Frisky!

IMO this one and the later Blue Note Village Vanguard Twofer are his best live recordings.

I know lots of people love "State of the Tenor," but for me the playing sounds too constrictive -- I'm not convinced Joe is really into all of the material selected for him, the tunes are atypically short compared to Joe's best playing in those days and the sound mix for me doesn't work: not nearly enough Foster in the balance and way too much bass (that's an LP impression; if that's been fixed on CD, somebody tell me...). In any case there were some European live concerts of similar vintage that I prefer, especially "An Evening with Joe Henderson" (Red). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMkkqphwI-k&list=PLF06EF13D310BE710

The recent SHM-CDs reveal much more of Al Foster's playing. See

Best bought at CD Japan:

Vol.1

Vol.2

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It seems incredibly petty to me that Blue Note would put "Etc." in place of McCoy's name on the covers of Page One, In 'n Out and Night Dreamer just because (I'm assuming) McCoy was recording as a leader for Impulse at the time.

Somebody else can confirm, but I think BN was contractually prohibited from putting McCoy's name on the cover, because of the contracts he had with Inpulse at the time. I sure they would have, but couldn't - or one would sure think.

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It seems incredibly petty to me that Blue Note would put "Etc." in place of McCoy's name on the covers of Page One, In 'n Out and Night Dreamer just because (I'm assuming) McCoy was recording as a leader for Impulse at the time.

Somebody else can confirm, but I think BN was contractually prohibited from putting McCoy's name on the cover, because of the contracts he had with Inpulse at the time. I sure they would have, but couldn't - or one would sure think.

That is my recollection as well. I thought Reid Miles indicated as much in an interview [?]

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Speaking of moods, I'm in one to go ahead and suggest Joe Henderson In Japan on Milestone. Frisky!

IMO this one and the later Blue Note Village Vanguard Twofer are his best live recordings.

I know lots of people love "State of the Tenor," but for me the playing sounds too constrictive -- I'm not convinced Joe is really into all of the material selected for him, the tunes are atypically short compared to Joe's best playing in those days and the sound mix for me doesn't work: not nearly enough Foster in the balance and way too much bass (that's an LP impression; if that's been fixed on CD, somebody tell me...). In any case there were some European live concerts of similar vintage that I prefer, especially "An Evening with Joe Henderson" (Red). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMkkqphwI-k&list=PLF06EF13D310BE710

The recent SHM-CDs reveal much more of Al Foster's playing. See

Best bought at CD Japan:

Vol.1

Vol.2

Thanks for the reminder of the earlier threat, of which I was a participant! I guess I didn't remember how the earlier discussion resolved itself ...

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51mO9e7P8UL.jpg

It just occurred to me where this picture might have been taken. Is it the wall that's part of Lincoln Center (the Amsterdam Avenue side)? This would make sense, since BN's office was on W. 61 St. It looks so familiar...

does this help?

post-11057-0-56796900-1435100123_thumb.j

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Inner Urge was one of my least favourite sessions until recently. I found the RVG dull and uninvolving. All that changed with the arrival of a NYC mono . Now it's a favourite.....

Listening to the SHM-CD now. :tup I share your dislike of the RVG. I used to prefer the BN Works to the RVG, but the SHM has a more full bodied sax sound. Incidentally, the RVG has a wider stereo image than the 1989 McMaster, which I read somewhere was near mono, but not as wide as the BN Works and SHM.

 

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Any way you can get it, "Inner Urge" is fantastic.

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In n Out (top JH for me)

Our Thing (Andrew Hill, esp.)

Mode for Joe (Sloppy at times but still a blistering record)

 

You can't go wrong with 60's Joe at BN, they're all worth getting, 

Edited by AndrewHill

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I love to hear the connection that Joe had with KD; makes total sense and frankly there is no 60's side project (respectively) they did that was not a success (in my mind). Love KD's records with Joe too. 

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The strong support here for Our Thing is really interesting to me, given that back in the 70s, it was the one JH BN leader date that had gone out of print and had become all obscure and shit. "I got ALL the Joe records." "You got Our Thing?" "Uh....". "Yeah, thought so." Etc. I had to get my copy by trading a readily available Miles LP to the college radio station. Miles Ahead, I think it was. "We'll probably never play this" was their argument against the trade. "But you don't play the Joe record either, and this Miles record is in MUCH better condition, so you could if you ever wanted to" was my counter, and it was counter enough, because I don't know where their Joe side had come from, but it was worn like some student of yore had brought it in one night years ago, left it, and was too high to ever remember where they had left it. It was more than a little "gently" used, but it played. Good enough eats for a hungry man..

I like it when once "cult"-y records become kinda "common wisdom" things. Like it a lot, but still wonder why it wasn't always like that, I mean, geez, Unity used to be like, a Mystical Quest or something, now it's like, hell, EVERYBODY got Unity, everybody KNOWS Unity, Unity is a given for today''s peoples.  But others, like Indestructible never really "take" in the common mind, and that just mystifies the hell out of me. And then there's Gettin' Around..neither mourned nor pondered for it's apparently perpetual audiencial meh-ness? I won't. I mean, I jumped for joy when I found that LP, but other than "Heartaches"...when they say "for collectors only", sometimes there's a reason for that. Not every "obscure" record is great, and not every great record is undiscovered. But sometimes, yes they are.

Shit is funny like that, you just never know.

Edited by JSngry

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Not BN, but this is worthy of adding to any Joe Hen collection

MI0003012518.jpg?partner=allrovi.com

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Oh, if we're gonna do Joe/Freddie CTI, let's break open a case of Straight Life and get goin' with it. That's the "employees only" CTI record, the one that only got played when the civilians had left for the day and it was time for the party to relish the rich and varied fuels and lubricants that both life and money can lavish upon those who go a'lookin' for them in their natural environs with enough of the right bait for it to all be a ritual whose purpose is fulfilled by simply showing and getting going.

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