JSngry Posted October 16, 2015 Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 Just wondering if anybody here was around to experience this thing and the other things around it in real time, and if so, what were the real-time impressions.I've always had a soft spot for "performance art" as commentary, but as a stand-alone esthetic, maybe not so much. As time goes by, where is your house?OTOH, energy/buzz/disruption/whatever, necessary at any number of junctures, essential, even.Moorman specifically, from what I've been able to actually hear of her, definitely seems like she could play. No "fraud" going on here. The 1964 Judson Hall/WBAI broadcast is for real.But she also seems like she had no interest whatsoever in playing just to be playing, seems like there was always this need for additional, extra-musical context. I don't know that it's accurate to say that she had it and nobody else did, like-minded spirits, more than one, but it also seems as if she was a real mover/shaker type as far as getting things organized, and she got them organized in that general direction. Which, I guess, is one of those "it is what it is" things.Anyway, any of y'all who got a taste (or more) of this in real (enough) time, your impressions and thoughts, then and now, would be most welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhoots Posted October 16, 2015 Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 I just seem to remember nudity & chocolate sauce - or was that someone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 Topless Cellist, TV Cellist, those were the taglines. Perhaps not the whole story, though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted October 16, 2015 Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 nudity was definitely part of Moorman's thing. But she did play music and was heavily involved in contemporary music/dance at the close of the '50s and early '60s. Yoko Ono, Nam Jun Paik, and artists associated with Fluxus (which was in part a contemporary music movement, though most composers split after the mid-60s) were a massive influence. I thought she did something with Bill Dixon but can't remember exactly what/when.Chocolate sauce sounds more like Carolee Schneemann.Sure, performance art is ephemeral. You did have to 'be there' for most of it. Professionally I work as an archivist for a major performance, installation and theater artist (historical, but still active), so I can try to give context if anyone cares. Performance art has enough of a history that there is certainly a stand-alone aesthetic, although most performance of the '60s and '70s also drew from non-performative visual situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 Yeah, by "esthetic", I mean more personal than institutional. Seems that the risk in always being "contemporary" in the topical extreme is in reaching a certain point when having some kind of re-doable repertoire is not a bad thing, just in case. Although, the imperative to always be "now" is quite a compelling one. So I guess it's something every performer has to decide for themselves.and yes, archiving preservation is invaluable in providing context, an ongoing context. Which is why the, as far as I can tell, minimal "moving" documentation of Moorman's work is both disturbing and sad. There are photos, yes, but the amount of fully or partially documented audio and/or video leaves us all at the mercy of the Nude Cellist thing, when clearly there was much more to it than that.Or, is there more stuff around than just what's on the Cello Anthology series/set? I tried in vain to find some kind of "conventional" recording, audio, video, whatever, and came up empty. But I didn't try THAT hard, so...is there more? Because the Judson Hall/WBAI thing is happening, really happening, no pun intended.But, Ornette was intersecting with that Moorman/Ono bunch...how much do we know about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted October 16, 2015 Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 The naked woman in chocolate, allegedly for artistic purposes, was Karen Finley:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Finley  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.D. Posted October 16, 2015 Report Share Posted October 16, 2015 The naked woman in chocolate, allegedly for artistic purposes, was Karen Finley:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Finley  In 1980s NYC, Karen Finley was very well known for yams...I'll say no more, but you could look it up. The act was bizarre and hugely controversial.Weirdly, I went to high school with Finley (Evanston Twp. H.S. fyi, Larry), but it was a huge school and I never met her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rostasi Posted October 17, 2015 Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 (edited) Surprised to see her name mentioned at the O-Board. Wonderful woman who was so utterly and completely devoted to Nam June Paik.Here's a duet (while an assistant holds the cello steady) that we did on Sept. 12, 1982when I was young enough to have a flat butt. I've had the "pleasure" of having Karen Finleyplace my head between her tittys while she slapped me with them for about a minute,but I don't have any pics of that. Edited October 17, 2015 by rostasi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 Â Â Â Â Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted October 17, 2015 Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 Lede of a 1986 LA Times review of a Finley performance:"Yams. They're not just for Thanksgiving anymore." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted October 17, 2015 Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 The naked woman in chocolate, allegedly for artistic purposes, was Karen Finley:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Finley  In 1980s NYC, Karen Finley was very well known for yams...I'll say no more, but you could look it up. The act was bizarre and hugely controversial.Weirdly, I went to high school with Finley (Evanston Twp. H.S. fyi, Larry), but it was a huge school and I never met her.ah right - haven't thought about Finley in ages. Good article on her here:http://www.dallasobserver.com/music/echoes-and-reverberations-karen-finley-and-the-delicate-art-of-disgust-7068255 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B. Clugston Posted October 17, 2015 Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 Surprised to see her name mentioned at the O-Board. Wonderful woman who was so utterly and completely devoted to Nam June Paik.Here's a duet (while an assistant holds the cello steady) that we did on Sept. 12, 1982when I was young enough to have a flat butt. I've had the "pleasure" of having Karen Finleyplace my head between her tittys while she slapped me with them for about a minute,but I don't have any pics of that. Cool photo! Have you read that biography? I've been meaning to pick it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2015 Yeah, I'd like some feedback on that bio as well, if anybody has any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ombudsman Posted October 18, 2015 Report Share Posted October 18, 2015 My late friend Jud Yalkut worked with her on a number of projects; through that and a local gallery that represented Paik for many years among others, I've seen lots of films and videos that are not widely circulated. The most impressive one was a color film of her playing the TV Cello where some really psychedelic video processing comes in right as she starts playing, and the audio is better than the other examples too. I wish I could remember the name of it. There are a couple of videos on youtube that include the TV Cello but they aren't that good.Generally you're better off looking through Paik related videos rather than looking for things under her name.This is some pretty good documentation of the NY Avant Garde Festival which she worked on for yearshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci6eCRQB30QÂ Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homefromtheforest Posted October 18, 2015 Report Share Posted October 18, 2015 Is that Roswell Rudd and Allan Praskin in that video!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ombudsman Posted October 18, 2015 Report Share Posted October 18, 2015 Can't say I recall what Praskin looks like but it's certainly Rudd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2015 Wow, great footage, thanks for that. Sure hope that the not widely circulated documentation has or gets decently archived so that it will be there when wider circulation becomes possible.Larry Coryell @ 5:01? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 (edited) Is that Roswell Rudd and Allan Praskin in that video!?Praskin would've been 18 for most of 1967, so I think it's somebody else. But that's Rudd for sure.Took another look and I'm willing to bet it's the Heckman-Summerlin Improvisational Jazz Workshop, with Lew Gluckin on flugelhorn. Edited October 19, 2015 by clifford_thornton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 That would be Don Heckman, then, correct?Wonder what group that was with Larry Coryell? I don't think it's The Free Sprits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 Right.Not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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