the bill savory collection-finally

[Dan Gould]

1 hour ago, miles65 said:

Off course other formats than wav can be burned on a cd. But my point was that converting to wav en than burn  it on a cd makes it posible to play it on a standard cd player. 

Anything that is outputting as a CD is playable on a CD player.  If you author an mp3 disc that's another issue.

My burner makes CDs from source files including wav, FLAC and MP3. All playable on standard CD players. If you have to extract or convert to wav then your burner or the software might be a little out of date.

[l p]

1 hour ago, Dan Gould said:

Anything that is outputting as a CD is playable on a CD player.  If you author an mp3 disc that's another issue.

My burner makes CDs from source files including wav, FLAC and MP3. All playable on standard CD players. If you have to extract or convert to wav then your burner or the software might be a little out of date.

 

are you sure that a flac cd plays on your standard stand-alone cd player? 

re: mp3, just make sure to select to burn audio cd instead of data cd, and then it will play on all cd players.

 

[Dan Gould]

1 hour ago, l p said:

 

are you sure that a flac cd plays on your standard stand-alone cd player? 

re: mp3, just make sure to select to burn audio cd instead of data cd, and then it will play on all cd players.

 

Yes, when I choose "burn audio cd" it recognizes FLAC files as acceptable source files.  The software I use is ashampoo which was free and I've found to be very reliable even if you get some sort of pop up at the start for another product of some sort or another.

[l p]

1 hour ago, Dan Gould said:

Yes, when I choose "burn audio cd" it recognizes FLAC files as acceptable source files.  The software I use is ashampoo which was free and I've found to be very reliable even if you get some sort of pop up at the start for another product of some sort or another.

 

so, you can play a flac cd in your car?

[Dan Gould]

2 hours ago, l p said:

 

so, you can play a flac cd in your car?

Yup.

[l p]

i always thought that older cd players (even ones that play cdr's) are unable to play a flac audio cd. i think i once accidentally burned a flac audio cd instead of a wav audio cd, and my stand alone home cd player didn't recognize the format.

[Dan Gould]

1 hour ago, l p said:

i always thought that older cd players (even ones that play cdr's) are unable to play a flac audio cd. i think i once accidentally burned a flac audio cd instead of a wav audio cd, and my stand alone home cd player didn't recognize the format.

I think that's often true. I know I didn't expect to burn an audio CD from FLAC files but I could and I did and it played.

[hbbfam]

1 hour ago, Dan Gould said:

I think that's often true. I know I didn't expect to burn an audio CD from FLAC files but I could and I did and it played.

My guess is that, if you look at the properties of the CD you burned, it will no longer be a flac file.  I know there are CD players that play formats like flac, but I doubt a car stereo is one of them?  Having said that, the sound quality of the Savory collection is substantially poorer (to me) than my Mosaic Coleman, Lester, etc.  Still, the music is great, and well worth having,  Here's to Mosaic doing this collection eventually,

[Dan Gould]

1 hour ago, hbbfam said:

My guess is that, if you look at the properties of the CD you burned, it will no longer be a flac file.  I know there are CD players that play formats like flac, but I doubt a car stereo is one of them?  

Of that I have no doubt. Just as if I used MP3s to populate an audio CD they would no longer be mp3s.

I certainly recall a time when I did have to convert files or discs to wav in order to burn an audio CD. 

[Clunky]

Booklet not available from Apple music in the UK. Not that this was clear until I paid my £7.99 for the download. Very disappointed. The booklet is listed but says it's not available in the UK.  To be completely frank I feel ripped off as I wouldn't have bought any of the tracks had it been made clear that the booklet wasn't available. Perhaps it's a mistake or a brexit phenomena.

Anyone know of a way of getting the booklet.?  Can't see me buying any more from the Savory collection in the future unless booklets are made available.

[hbbfam]

The only "artwork" was a PDF of the "cover".  No notes appeared to be available.

[mjzee]

On 9/23/2016 at 1:59 PM, hbbfam said:

Apple lossless is acceptable but not Flac or wav  quality.  

What is this statement based on?

Also (a general question to the crowd): I thought the licensing issues were so daunting, how were they able to put this out?

[Clunky]

1 hour ago, Clunky said:

Booklet not available from Apple music in the UK. Not that this was clear until I paid my £7.99 for the download. Very disappointed. The booklet is listed but says it's not available in the UK.  To be completely frank I feel ripped off as I wouldn't have bought any of the tracks had it been made clear that the booklet wasn't available. Perhaps it's a mistake or a brexit phenomena.

Anyone know of a way of getting the booklet.?  Can't see me buying any more from the Savory collection in the future unless booklets are made available.

I've had a very quick response from NJMH . They're looking into it. 

1 hour ago, hbbfam said:

The only "artwork" was a PDF of the "cover".  No notes appeared to be available.

 

[mjzee]

1 hour ago, hbbfam said:

The only "artwork" was a PDF of the "cover".  No notes appeared to be available.

My booklet is 22 pages.

[JSngry]

4 hours ago, mjzee said:

 

Also (a general question to the crowd): I thought the licensing issues were so daunting, how were they able to put this out?

The cynic in me thinks that this is the look of the You Gonna Sue Us, You Gonna Have To Sue Apple Too, And Good Luck With That card being played.

[John L]

On the subject of FLAC files and CDs, there may some confusion here on what we are talking about.   When a music CD is created, as opposed to a CD that stores files, the burning process essentially transforms everything into WAVE and then puts it on the CD.   So there is no question here about whether the CD player can play MP3 or FLAC.  It is just a ordinary music CD in any case.   On the other hand, it is also possible to use a CD as a place to store files such as MP3, FLAC, or WAVE.   Yes, not all CD players can read those kind of CDs.  Some can, some can't.  Most cannot read FLAC.    

Some programs (iTunes, for example) do not offer to load or burn FLAC files.  So the files first need to be transformed into WAVE or MP3 before they are loaded into iTunes and /or burned.  

[mjzee]

1 hour ago, John L said:

Some programs (iTunes, for example) do not offer to load or burn FLAC files.  So the files first need to be transformed into WAVE or MP3 before they are loaded into iTunes and /or burned.  

Or Apple Lossless (.m4a), which Apple says is a lossless format.  Per the Wikipedia page on Apple Lossless (aka ALAC), "However, Apple Lossless is not a variant of AAC (which is a lossy format), but rather a distinct lossless format that uses linear prediction similar to other lossless codecs. These other lossless codecs, such as FLAC and Shorten, are not natively supported by Apple's iTunes software (either the Mac OS or Windows versions) or by iOS devices, so users of iTunes software who want to use a lossless format which allows the addition of metadata (unlike WAV/AIFF or other PCM-type formats, where metadata is usually ignored) have to use ALAC.^[2] All current iOS devices can play ALAC–encoded files." "According to Apple, audio files compressed with its lossless codec will use up "about half the storage space" that the uncompressed data would require. Testers using a selection of music have found that compressed files are about 40% to 60% the size of the originals depending on the kind of music, which is similar to other lossless formats.^[3][4] Furthermore, compared to some other formats, it is not as difficult to decode, making it practical for a limited-power device, such as older iOS devices."

[lipi]

16 hours ago, miles65 said:

Off course other formats than wav can be burned on a cd. But my point was that converting to wav en than burn  it on a cd makes it posible to play it on a standard cd player. 

I think there's a basic misunderstanding here. This is not a good reason to convert to WAVE. iTunes (and any modern equivalent you care to name) will burn to an audio CD from any source. That is, it will burn a red book audio CD--a CD that can play back in any CD player--by default. You do not need to manually convert to WAVE. (In fact, if you *don't* want to burn an audio CD but rather a data CD you have to jump through some hoops.)

 

On 10/19/2016 at 11:27 PM, John L said:

While there are no advantages of converting from lossy (MP3, AAC) to WAVE files, there can be disadvantages.  When they circulate, people can wrongly get the impression that they are lossless representations of the original source.   They also take up more room and cause iPod batteries to wear down faster.  Therefore, there is no reason ever to do it. 

Most of your points are valid, but the last statement is not. If you want to edit an audio file to remove a spoken introduction, or fade out a long track, or remove noise you will want to use a lossless format--even when your source is lossy.

We appear to be drifting a bit off-topic. Apologies--I fear I've derailed this thread.

[miles65]

13 hours ago, lipi said:

I think there's a basic misunderstanding here. This is not a good reason to convert to WAVE. iTunes (and any modern equivalent you care to name) will burn to an audio CD from any source. That is, it will burn a red book audio CD--a CD that can play back in any CD player--by default. You do not need to manually convert to WAVE. (In fact, if you *don't* want to burn an audio CD but rather a data CD you have to jump through some hoops.

Thank for pointing this out. I didn't realise this. I was satisfied when burning a wav on a CD it played on the CD player.

[Hot Ptah]

I have purchased the download and have it in my ITunes library. I was able to burn it to a CD-R without difficulty and then play it in the car. I was surprised at the amount of surface noise audible on some of the music. I have gone back and read articles about the discovery of the collection. It was noted that Savory's discs were stored where some were damaged by water and had mold accumulation on them. I can believe it.

The music is quite good, but whether or not the very most optimum download format has been utilized does not matter much, when you hear the condition of the source material on some of the tracks.

The 22 page booklet is in full color.

[Clunky]

Liner notes PDF has now been made available to me via iTunes

[mjzee]

The PDF booklet is oddly designed.  At first glance, it appears to be something you could print out and fit in a CD case (along with the disc you've burned).  But because the pages are presented sequentially, you simply cannot do that.  And yet, if it's not meant for printing, why present the pages with these dimensions?  They really should have given two versions: one to view on screen, and one to print out and assemble.

[Dave Garrett]

On 10/24/2016 at 0:53 PM, mjzee said:

The PDF booklet is oddly designed.  At first glance, it appears to be something you could print out and fit in a CD case (along with the disc you've burned).  But because the pages are presented sequentially, you simply cannot do that.  And yet, if it's not meant for printing, why present the pages with these dimensions?  They really should have given two versions: one to view on screen, and one to print out and assemble.

The full version of Acrobat allows you to reorder the pages in a PDF file. There are other online services that can do this as well without requiring you to install any sofware, such as this one:

https://www.sejda.com/visually-combine-reorder-pdf

I haven't used this specific service, but I have had to do this in the past, and the (long forgotten) one that I used got the job done.

[tranemonk]

So it sounds like we don't know if there will ever (much less soon) be a CD release. Is that right? 

[John L]

Right