Billy Taylor

[Larry Kart]

Listening last night to some used LPs I’d bought a while ago, I put on “The Billy Taylor Trio at the London House,” (ABC-Paramount,  rec. 1956) for the first time, never having been much of a Taylor fan but aware, for one thing, that Denny Zeitlin was a great admirer of Taylor of that vintage. Pleasantly surprised by the quality, thoughtfulness, and lucidity of the music making (Earl May and Percy Brice on board), I was also impressed, even through the LP’s no longer perfect surfaces, at the quality of the piano sound, some of the nicest I’ve ever heard and recorded “live” too. Engineer was one Bill Putnam, producer Creed Taylor.

P.S. I see now that Bill Putnam was quite somebody, indeed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Putnam

 

[Scott Dolan]

I love Dr. T! Glad you mentioned him, as I haven't listened to him in years. 

A woefully under-appreciated player, IMO. 

Edited September 14, 2017 by Scott Dolan

[JSngry]

Never a "fan", but I have come to develop a great appreciation of his touch, technique, and overall ability. The man had some serious skills!

Also, he did a quite extended interview with Cadence that ended up taking 4(!) parts. His history went deeper and further back than I had known, and he had some pretty serious stories to tell. Excellent reading.

[Scott Dolan]

Incredibly serious skills. I'd never heard of him until I saw him do an hour long show on a late night show dedicated to Jazz on the BET network, oh, maybe 15 years ago. Jazz Central Station, I think? 

I was blown away what how masterfully he played, and thinking to myself, "how the hell have I never heard of this cat?!" 

[Peter Friedman]

I also was never much of a Billy Taylor fan. But over many years  have discovered that Taylor surprised me by recording some albums that I have enjoyed quite a bit.

[JSngry]

Here's a version that I found a few years ago. Who knew?

 

[mikeweil]

Jusz ordered a copy of this:

[Scott Dolan]

What the fuck is a "chronogical"? 

[Larry Kart]

1 hour ago, Scott Dolan said:

What the fuck is a "chronogical"? 

A typo?

[Chuck Nessa]

3 hours ago, Scott Dolan said:

What the fuck is a "chronogical"? 

it took you 30 years to notice this?

 

[Scott Dolan]

Since I just saw it for the first time about an hour ago, no. 

[Chuck Nessa]

1 hour ago, Scott Dolan said:

Since I just saw it for the first time about an hour ago, no. 

Ah, ok - they issued 400/500 jazz cds with that "typo" since 1990. I understand.

[clifford_thornton]

My god, I never noticed the typo either -- and I should have!

[Scott Dolan]

9 hours ago, Chuck Nessa said:

Ah, ok - they issued 400/500 jazz cds with that "typo" since 1990. I understand.

Hahaha...you say "since 1990". So there were multiple pressings?! 

[Gheorghe]

I don´t know I think he was more a teacher or a keeper of the flame than an important pianist, but maybe I´m wrong.

First saw his name on a strange double LP "Echos of an Era" with Art Tatum on Side A, Erroll Garner on Side B, Bud Powell on Side C and Billy Taylor on Side D. Though maybe i confounded his name with Cecil Taylor because I thought the last one might be the most far out.

But his playing on those tracks (with Mingus !) didn´t sound more advanced than Art Tatum or Bud. Since than I heard some of his solos, but it seems to me more like happy easy listening jazz, very very diatonic.

And there is one album Charlie Parker Memorial 1965 with various artists and the way Billy Taylor playes more like some fugue or counterpoint or something in the classic manner got on my nerves. It sounded like someone who normally plays Bach or other classic and tries to give the blues a chance.....

I saw Billy Taylor on many video comments , really interesting to listen what he says and what he knows about the music, but I think he was more a speaking voice about jazz than a soloist that would thrill me......

[Larry Kart]

4 hours ago, Gheorghe said:

I don´t know I think he was more a teacher or a keeper of the flame than an important pianist, but maybe I´m wrong.

First saw his name on a strange double LP "Echos of an Era" with Art Tatum on Side A, Erroll Garner on Side B, Bud Powell on Side C and Billy Taylor on Side D. Though maybe i confounded his name with Cecil Taylor because I thought the last one might be the most far out.

But his playing on those tracks (with Mingus !) didn´t sound more advanced than Art Tatum or Bud. Since than I heard some of his solos, but it seems to me more like happy easy listening jazz, very very diatonic.

And there is one album Charlie Parker Memorial 1965 with various artists and the way Billy Taylor playes more like some fugue or counterpoint or something in the classic manner got on my nerves. It sounded like someone who normally plays Bach or other classic and tries to give the blues a chance.....

I saw Billy Taylor on many video comments , really interesting to listen what he says and what he knows about the music, but I think he was more a speaking voice about jazz than a soloist that would thrill me......

Didn't say he was important, just a more interesting, individual pianist than I thought he was back in the day. Perhaps as one gets older, one's brain softens a bit and/or one responds not only to the music per se but also to its having been part of the "furniture" of one's youth. For example, right now I'm revisiting my  formerly indifferent opinion of Terry Gibbs. Yes, he definitely has real virtues, but it's also that the music sounds so 1956-7 to me -- when the world was young. Likewise with Taylor. 

[mr jazz]

I saw Billy Taylor several times and enjoyed each one of them thoroughly.  I have several of his many recordings which I also like. One of my favorite artists.

[Peter Friedman]

In some ways, Billy Taylor reminds me of Marian McPartland. Both nice solid jazz piano players, but lacking the musical depth I hear in a number of other pianists from that same time period. The earliest recordings I heard by McPartland left me a bit cold, but she, to my ears, got much deeper into the music over time. I felt a similar way about Taylor's early Prestige recordings, but  found some of his later recordings much more interesting.

Also both played an important role in informing people about jazz through radio and television.

[JSngry]

TWO albums with Oliver Nelson! Neither are in any way "deep", but it's interesting to see how there was a perceived commercial market for this type of thing, and how both principles engaged in the "commercial process" without in any way pandering, Nelson in particular, I can't believe so many people paid him to write all those jagged-ass horn voicing's, I guess they didn't realize what was was going on, or else maybe he hid it really well.

Billy Taylor on these records is easy, facile, non-threatening, but still projecting a sense of social awareness...shallow, perhaps, but wide(r).

Impossible to underestimate the accomplishment of being a successful businessman and artist/"artist", getting to have more than usual control over your own destiny and narrative. The business is not set up to encourage that, especially not in those days...I recall Taylor commenting once about he got shut out of a lot of things because he would not participate in the Birdland heroin pool, guys would get together, pool their funds, cop, and then...whatever. It was a real "in or out" world, and you know the people encouraging the in-ers were looking for every opportunity to hook that fish and all that came with it. Billy Taylor was his own fish and didn't bite any of those hooks.

so....not a really "profound" player, perhaps, but for sure somebody fight the other good fights with certainty and determination. That Jazzmobile thing ran a lot deeper than the "general jazz public" maybe knew, deeper than I knew at the time for sure. Getting ALL kinds of players out into al kinds of communities.

I used to be creeped out by Billy Taylor because of his TV Tube size glasses and projected all that onto him personally and musically, but....my bad for that.

 

[HutchFan]

I'm an Oliver Nelson-ophile, so I've been meaning to get those two Billy Taylor LPs for years.  Never gotten 'round to it yet.

Here's another sampler -- from Midnight Piano:

Nothing earth-shattering soloist-wise -- but I could listen to those Oliver Nelson arrangements all day. 

[clifford_thornton]

7 hours ago, Larry Kart said:

Perhaps as one gets older, one's brain softens a bit and/or one responds not only to the music per se but also to its having been part of the "furniture" of one's youth. 

Totally. I've gotten that way with Brubeck. My dad was a huge fan at one point when I was a kid (his tastes have shifted somewhat) and it took years of other listening to come back to Brubeck's classic music with Desmond and company. Brilliant.

[Scott Dolan]

Even Time Out? I'd have thought that would have stuck right away, based on what I know of your music tastes. 

[JSngry]

I'm sorta/kinda convinced that this here is the Deep Secret DNA of almost every Steely Dan Song:

 

Brubeck - at once less hip and less corny than is easily assumed. In the world of jazz, that takes a real man of his own kind. I've done a complete 360 (sic) about him.

[Mark Stryker]

"Impossible to underestimate the accomplishment of being a successful businessman and artist/"artist", getting to have more than usual control over your own destiny and narrative. The business is not set up to encourage that, especially not in those days."

Jim's point above is seriously on point. The older I get the more I understand how significant this is. It doesn't really fit within the critic's innovator/individualist/journeyman paradigm or the uncompromising artist/sellout paradigm. And it doesn't really relate to one's own personal taste paradigm. It also doesn't mean those paradigms don't exist or have value. They do. But life is a 360 degree proposition. Gotta remember that. Taylor's greatest accomplishment was that he invented Billy Taylor -- that shouldn't be underestimated, regardless of how hip, important or personally meaningful the records are to you.

Coda 1: I've  written about Donald Byrd sort of in the same way. His greatest invention was "Donald Byrd" in an era and world that was mostly hellbent against someone like Donald Byrd from becoming "Donald Byrd." That doesn't exempt his music/choices from criticism; But credit where credit is due. 

Coda 2: I never knew about those Taylor LPs with Oliver Nelson -- thx for the tip. 

Edited September 16, 2017 by Mark Stryker

[mikeweil]

On 14.9.2017 at 11:17 PM, mikeweil said:

Jusz ordered a copy of this:

Received it, and gave it a listen, and was pleasantly surprised. As JSngry stated, the man had chops, and a broad palette of influences. Sometimes his classical training shines through, although he never uses two-part invention techniques like Nina Simone did, there is reference to older pianistical devices, boogie woogie in particular, and some serious bebop, although not as fluent or elegant as Bud Powell. The nicest surprise are the tracks with a conga player (Frankie Colon), which are good examples of early Cubop and make clear why he was allowed to sit in with Machito's orchestra. The tracks here are much better than those cut for Prestige in 1953 (because, IMO, Taylor's drummer Charlie Smith handed the congas in a much less comptetent manner). Recommended.

Edited September 23, 2017 by mikeweil