Mark Stryker Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) Can anybody shed some light on who the bass player is on Gerald Wilson's 1947 masterpiece "Dissonance in Blues"? My "Sounds of Swing" LP lists the bassist here as Robert Budd, but as near as I can figure, there was never any bassist by that name. Tom Lord Discography says its Red Callender, which makes sense from a time/place perspective, but Lord is by no means infallible. So If anyone has another source -- perhaps the personnel on a Chronological Classics? -- or any other helpful conjecture, I'd be grateful. Edited February 17, 2018 by Mark Stryker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 According to this source, it's Red Callender: https://books.google.com/books?id=U7I3DwAAQBAJ&pg=PA93&lpg=PA93&dq=gerald+wilson+dissonance+in+blues&source=bl&ots=_KVc3T-1sL&sig=wXyHcpXPhG6CUpYBawRRLYPzd1c&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwia3vfs3a3ZAhVJbK0KHd5-Bok4HhDoAQguMAI#v=onepage&q=gerald wilson dissonance in blues&f=false And here's a photo of the label of the 78: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stryker Posted February 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 22 minutes ago, mjzee said: According to this source, it's Red Callender: https://books.google.com/books?id=U7I3DwAAQBAJ&pg=PA93&lpg=PA93&dq=gerald+wilson+dissonance+in+blues&source=bl&ots=_KVc3T-1sL&sig=wXyHcpXPhG6CUpYBawRRLYPzd1c&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwia3vfs3a3ZAhVJbK0KHd5-Bok4HhDoAQguMAI#v=onepage&q=gerald wilson dissonance in blues&f=false And here's a photo of the label of the 78: Hey -- very helpful. Much obliged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 excelisor was bought by UA? i have a earlier juat excelisor label gerald 78 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Thanks for bringing this topic up. I corrected the bass player identity on my copy of Sounds of Swing 121 too. And then I went looking .. I knew i had a Gerald Wilson 78 on United Artist (I seriously doubt this was "THE" UA that Chewy alludes to - this label was founded much later). And it turned out to be this "Dissonance in Blues". The line-up given on that LP seems to be way off in other respects too as the flip (or rather "A" side) of that 78 - "My Last Affair" (coming from the same session) - indicates Trummy Young and Willie Smith as featured solists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost of miles Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Chronological Classics 1946-54 and Rhino’s Central Avenue Sounds box-set both list the bassist as Red Callender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 There's United Artist and then there's United Artists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Not to mention Untied Artists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Was that the label The Tubes recorded on after reconsidering things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stryker Posted February 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 1 hour ago, JSngry said: There's United Artist and then there's United Artists. Hey, thanks. Saved me a mistake in the book. I had it "Artists" up until this moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 8 hours ago, Chuck Nessa said: Not to mention Untied Artists. Let's face it - there have ben PLENTY of labels through the years that underwent minor changes of their name (and changed their logo) and YET remained the same unit (so this alone would not be a criterion). But not in this case. The gap between the (probable) demise of the one and the start of the other was too huge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Artists_Records Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 United Artists records was an organic spinoff from the United Artists film studio, which had been going gangbusters since1919, and which also is a living breathing entity today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 (edited) Yes it was (and is) - since 1919 - but not as a RECORD LABEL, by all accounts. And this is what was the subject matter here. Again - trying to make it clear: United Artist and United Artists (as record labels) were not the same. But whether or not there was an "S" at the end of the name was NO factor BY ITSELF that would have determined whether these two entities could have beenc the same. So making a point of this "S" is strictly beside same (the point, that is ). That's that. Edited February 18, 2018 by Big Beat Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 wow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 regarding that other bass player "Robert Budd": A man named "Robert Rudd" is typically listed as the bass player for some of Wilson's earlier Exelsior sessions, see here or here https://www.jazzdiscography.com/Artists/Dotson/hd-disc.php and here for another reference to the guy in another context https://archive.nationaljazzarchive.co.uk/archive/journals/jazz-music/vol4-no4-1950/18684 which (imho) rules out that this is just a pseudonym Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stryker Posted February 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 (edited) Tha 41 minutes ago, Niko said: regarding that other bass player "Robert Budd": A man named "Robert Rudd" is typically listed as the bass player for some of Wilson's earlier Exelsior sessions, see here or here https://www.jazzdiscography.com/Artists/Dotson/hd-disc.php and here for another reference to the guy in another context https://archive.nationaljazzarchive.co.uk/archive/journals/jazz-music/vol4-no4-1950/18684 which (imho) rules out that this is just a pseudonym Ah, thanks for this, and thanks to all who weighed in. MS Edited February 18, 2018 by Mark Stryker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medjuck Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 3 hours ago, JSngry said: United Artists records was an organic spinoff from the United Artists film studio, which had been going gangbusters since1919, and which also is a living breathing entity today. The United Artists film catalogue is owned by MGM. I'm not sure anything new is released under the UA banner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Reading the Wikki article, it seems that "United Artists" remains a brand that keep being revived so MGM can take it back? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Artists Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 53 minutes ago, JSngry said: Reading the Wikki article, it seems that "United Artists" remains a brand that keep being revived so MGM can take it back? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Artists Brands and brand names have a value (generally captured under "intangible assets" on the balance sheet). It can be sold for real money, should a buyer have an interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted February 19, 2018 Report Share Posted February 19, 2018 no dog the tubes went from a&m to capitol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Beat Steve Posted March 11, 2018 Report Share Posted March 11, 2018 FWIW, here is a bit more info on this UNITED ARTIST(without the "S") label: http://www.45worlds.com/78rpm/label/united-artist Evidently not a complete listing at all, but giving a bit more context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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