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clifford_thornton

Buell Neidlinger RIP

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Just got the news from my editor (via Buell's family) that the bassist died today at age 82. He was a force of nature and will be missed. One of the first musicians I interviewed, and though I didn't keep in touch as much as I should have, I really got a kick out of talking with him early on. At one point he trying to write his autobiography though his eyesight had gone and I believe that project had to be scuttled. It would have been something to read, from the stories I'd heard...

RIP sir, and thank you.

 

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Very sorry to read this. I heard Buell Neidlinger playing with Andrew White several times in Buffalo in the mid-sixties, in addition to hearing him on records. He was a helluva bassist. Also enjoyed reading his liner notes in the Cecil Taylor/Buell Neidlinger Mosaic set and his interview in Cadence some years ago. He didn't pull any punches with his opinions.

Thanks, Mr. Neidlinger.  RIP.

 

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I met him because he played on the scores of some films I helped produce.  (Harold Ramis was a friend of his and would alway recommend him.)  Bought my Mosaic set directly from him. (Got it autographed too.) 

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Posted (edited)

Sorry to hear this. The Cecil Taylor and Buell Neidlinger Candid Mosaic will be spun today. Thanks for the music and RIP.

Edited by sidewinder

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Always enjoyed his musical contributions but also his pithy, informative and often humorous comments on a variety of posts on Richard Cook's Bluemoment blog. He was commenting there until fairly recently

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Neidlinger produced Leo Kottke’s best post-Capitol album, “Regards From Chuck Pink.”  It has an aural soundscape very different from any other Kottke album, and must be considered as a collaborative effort.

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Has anyone here heard this one?  Curious if it’s just more of the same from Braxton, or whether Neidlinger turned it into something different:

MI0003311878.jpg?partner=allrovi.com

RIP.

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1 hour ago, mjazzg said:

Always enjoyed his musical contributions but also his pithy, informative and often humorous comments on a variety of posts on Richard Cook's Bluemoment blog. He was commenting there until fairly recently

Richard Williams?

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1 hour ago, sidewinder said:

Richard Williams?

Yes, of course (Sunday morning syndrome). Apologies to Mr Williams

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Yeah, come to think of it I remember seeing Buell N. posting on that blog too. 

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Very sad .... an uncompromising and inventive musician .... R.I.P ....

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1 hour ago, soulpope said:

Very sad .... an uncompromising and inventive musician .... R.I.P ....

I have a lot of respect for Buell Neidlinger, but "uncompromising" isn't a word I'd use to describe him. He recorded a lot of commercial studio music to support himself and his family. Cecil is "uncompromising". Buell, not so much.

 

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5 minutes ago, paul secor said:

I have a lot of respect for Buell Neidlinger, but "uncompromising" isn't a word I'd use to describe him. He recorded a lot of commercial studio music to support himself and his family. Cecil is "uncompromising". Buell, not so much.

 

You`re right Paul about him also having made sacrifices for a living - his jazz related efforts strike me as uncompromising though .....

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4 hours ago, soulpope said:

You`re right Paul about him also having made sacrifices for a living - his jazz related efforts strike me as uncompromising though .....

I agree with your last statement.

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4 hours ago, paul secor said:

I have a lot of respect for Buell Neidlinger, but "uncompromising" isn't a word I'd use to describe him. He recorded a lot of commercial studio music to support himself and his family. Cecil is "uncompromising". Buell, not so much.

 

At least Buell was capable of playing with other "compromising" musicians, such as the Jimmy Giuffre Quartet on 'Live at the Five-Spot LP I have him on; if you read Bob Cranshaw's interview in Iverson's blog, Cranshaw said Cecil was incapable of playing their "compromising' music. 

A friend of mine wanted to study with Buell, and Buell gave him his business card so my friend could reach him. I don't remember what his business card said, but it was very unusual. Does anyone know what it said?

RIP, to a great bass player.

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Sad news. Great player.

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2 hours ago, sgcim said:

At least Buell was capable of playing with other "compromising" musicians, such as the Jimmy Giuffre Quartet on 'Live at the Five-Spot LP I have him on; if you read Bob Cranshaw's interview in Iverson's blog, Cranshaw said Cecil was incapable of playing their "compromising' music. 

A friend of mine wanted to study with Buell, and Buell gave him his business card so my friend could reach him. I don't remember what his business card said, but it was very unusual. Does anyone know what it said?

RIP, to a great bass player.

I wasn't referring to Jimmy Giuffre. Buell Neidlinger did a lot of studio work in L.A. to make a living. His choice.

And I think that if you listen to Cecil's early work, you'll find that he was quite capable of playing with musicians like Giuffre (or Cranshaw). I imagine that Cranshaw's comment resulted from the CecilTaylor/Mary Lou Williams concert. According to an interview with Cecil, there was a lot going on behind the scenes there. Mary Lou brought in Bob Cranshaw and Mickey Roker at the last minute. Cecil was annoyed, especially with the presence of Roker.  (Cecil felt that if Mary Lou wanted a drummer, she could have brought in Andrew Cyrille, who had played with her.)  And that was the end of any collaboration. She played her thing and Cecil played his.

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Besides, I don't think that Cranshaw could hang with Cecil either. Why should he, or he with him, that's some Disney-esque Small World After All fantasy bullshit. Those were two guys of the same time, but different time, same places but different places, yeahyeahyeah it's all the same, but only after it's not. It wasn't on any of those people to be able to cross across the lines, hell, they were too busy making their mark on their own lines.

But Max had NO problem with Cecil, gave as good as he got in that one, so, Bob Cranshaw, yeah, sure, whatever, but that does not account for Max Roach, does it now.

As for Buell Neidlinger, RIP. We need line crossers as well as line makers, otherwise a line might as well be  a fence instead of a point of reference.

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Thank you for the music, Mr. Neidlinger, and rest in peace.

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12 hours ago, soulpope said:

You`re right Paul about him also having made sacrifices for a living - his jazz related efforts strike me as uncompromising though .....

IIRC he played in symphony orchestras too.  I don't think he ever thought he was compromising. He was a professional musician. 

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4 hours ago, paul secor said:

I wasn't referring to Jimmy Giuffre. Buell Neidlinger did a lot of studio work in L.A. to make a living. His choice.

And I think that if you listen to Cecil's early work, you'll find that he was quite capable of playing with musicians like Giuffre (or Cranshaw). I imagine that Cranshaw's comment resulted from the CecilTaylor/Mary Lou Williams concert. According to an interview with Cecil, there was a lot going on behind the scenes there. Mary Lou brought in Bob Cranshaw and Mickey Roker at the last minute. Cecil was annoyed, especially with the presence of Roker.  (Cecil felt that if Mary Lou wanted a drummer, she could have brought in Andrew Cyrille, who had played with her.)  And that was the end of any collaboration. She played her thing and Cecil played his.

I've heard Cecil's early stuff, and like Andrew Hill's and Sun Ra's early stuff, it was nothing to write home about. Just a lot of nebulous poking around in a minor key.

When Eric Dolphy did the gig with Chico Hamilton, he played other people's music fine; Fred Katz', the Duke album, etc..., He could've played his outside stuff, and 'made his mark', but he acted like a real musician and played some beautiful stuff within the framework of the tunes. 

But Cecil is upset that MLW used Mickey Roker instead of Andrew Cyrille? So that gives him an excuse to 'make his mark' while lesser mortals like Mickey Roker and Bob Cranshaw are subjected to a bunch of noise that has nothing to with what they're laying down? Oh, but he's been called a genius innovator by the jazz history books, and even some respectable classical music people, while Cranshaw and Roker were only called to play with jazz musicians like Sonny Rollins and his ilk.

Which leaders called Cecil to play with them? Oh, I forgot, he's Cecil Taylor; he's above all of that... 

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Very sad news.  He graces some of my favourite records.

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4 hours ago, sgcim said:

I've heard Cecil's early stuff, and like Andrew Hill's and Sun Ra's early stuff, it was nothing to write home about. Just a lot of nebulous poking around in a minor key.

When Eric Dolphy did the gig with Chico Hamilton, he played other people's music fine; Fred Katz', the Duke album, etc..., He could've played his outside stuff, and 'made his mark', but he acted like a real musician and played some beautiful stuff within the framework of the tunes. 

But Cecil is upset that MLW used Mickey Roker instead of Andrew Cyrille? So that gives him an excuse to 'make his mark' while lesser mortals like Mickey Roker and Bob Cranshaw are subjected to a bunch of noise that has nothing to with what they're laying down? Oh, but he's been called a genius innovator by the jazz history books, and even some respectable classical music people, while Cranshaw and Roker were only called to play with jazz musicians like Sonny Rollins and his ilk.

Which leaders called Cecil to play with them? Oh, I forgot, he's Cecil Taylor; he's above all of that... 

The problem is with Cecil’s insistence that what he plays is “jazz.”  It isn’t.  Call it what you will: art music, energy music, whatever.  It clearly isn’t the same type of music as what Cranshaw, Roker, or even MLW played, and it’s silly to pretend otherwise.  I think a large contributor to jazz’s demise in the late 60’s was with people associating jazz with out music, and thereby dismissing the whole genre, when they could have been listening to a lot more enjoyable music.

Sorry to be reopening debates that have been around for a long time, but I think this has become even clearer with the passage of time.

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You will be missed, Buell Neidlinger.

 

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