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Jimmy Giuffre 3-Live in Graz 1961

47 posts in this topic

18 hours ago, king ubu said:

 

Plus, I do wonder wtf this is supposed to be:

9666287-ezz_thetics_1102_cov_600x540px-d

I have no idea but I'm very keen to find out. Any Brown from that time will have me investigating. Another live release like the Giuffre perhaps

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After one complete listen...WOW.Outstanding music.Paul Bley is crazy, magically brilliant here.Steve Swallow is recorded very well on this session,you hear him under every minute of the music.A couple of tracks, the shortcomings of the tape come through but generally, the sound is acceptable.

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On 5/12/2019 at 11:46 AM, JSngry said:

How many photos of Carla Bley exist from that time?

FWIW, Juanita Giuffre was the first wife of George Russell.

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1 hour ago, Chuck Nessa said:

FWIW, Juanita Giuffre was the first wife of George Russell.

Originally Juanita Odejnar. Russell gave her last name to a piece from the "Ezzthetic" date.

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12 minutes ago, Larry Kart said:

Originally Juanita Odejnar. Russell gave her last name to a piece from the "Ezzthetic" date.

Odejnar or Odjenar?

The tune is commonly listed as "Odjenar". And the liner notes to the Prestige reissue LP indicate her name with this spelling too.

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On 5/16/2019 at 6:32 PM, king ubu said:

I know ... but 125 for that CT box, for just a DL? Does it at least include high quality scans of the book? (I guess I'm really old-fashioned in that respect ...)

Unfortunately, it does not include either of the two books that came with the CD box. 

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On 19.5.2019 at 4:00 AM, Dave Garrett said:

Unfortunately, it does not include either of the two books that came with the CD box. 

The book is available separately at bandcamp: https://destination-out.bandcamp.com/album/in-berlin-88-book

Albeit the PDF costs almost 50$.

On 16.5.2019 at 11:00 PM, king ubu said:

- Either way, it does seem that not like FMP which was just shut down, without anyone being allowed to market the great legacy of recordings (what a shame!)...

Actually it is possible to contact Jost Gebers. I know 'cause I did contact him and asked about the possibility of releasing some stuff from the archives. Not everything would be available, though. It - obviously - depends on wether the owners of the rights, which are the musicians, are inclined to do so and on what conditions.

I don't say it would be easy to release the unreleased but if someone has a bit surplus change it probably could be done.

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1 hour ago, Onxidlib said:

Actually it is possible to contact Jost Gebers. I know 'cause I did contact him and asked about the possibility of releasing some stuff from the archives. Not everything would be available, though. It - obviously - depends on wether the owners of the rights, which are the musicians, are inclined to do so and on what conditions.

I don't say it would be easy to release the unreleased but if someone has a bit surplus change it probably could be done.

Thanks for the correction/addition -- so generally, FMP never owned the recordings, but kind of licensed them from the musicians?

Alas I'm not that person with that surplus change ... too bad the Trumpster isn't a free jazz fan, as that would be a terrific deal, greatest deal of all times ;) 

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FMP im Rückblick box booklet has an extensive live gigs list - there is some tasty stuff there, for sure. Not all was recorded, of course -  but a quite lot actually could be, either by FMP or by the public broadcasters. Maybe Jazzwerkstatt people would work something out in terms of releases, most likely not.  

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Re. the Brown and Ayler with the from...to... titles, those sound more like anthologies than archival  issues to me. Either way, the titles are perplexing...

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On 22.5.2019 at 11:39 AM, king ubu said:

Thanks for the correction/addition -- so generally, FMP never owned the recordings, but kind of licensed them from the musicians?

Alas I'm not that person with that surplus change ... too bad the Trumpster isn't a free jazz fan, as that would be a terrific deal, greatest deal of all times ;) 

It seems to be a bit more complicated. See (only in German) http://www.fmp-label.de/fmplabel/archivhaupttext.html

But also this on the FMP website: " The person responsible for productions on this label remains Jost Gebers. It is he who is exclusively responsible for productions and carries them out in accordance with agreements made with the musicians involved. Third party intervention is ruled out. Planning, selection, realization and financing of production are the exclusive responsibility of FMP-Publishing. "

Maybe I will sell all my rare vinyl and start a FMP reissue label :P

23 hours ago, Д.Д. said:

FMP im Rückblick box booklet has an extensive live gigs list - there is some tasty stuff there, for sure. Not all was recorded, of course -  but a quite lot actually could be, either by FMP or by the public broadcasters. Maybe Jazzwerkstatt people would work something out in terms of releases, most likely not.  

According Jost Gebers (and if memory serves me right) almost everything from 1970 or so onward has been recorded and is available in the label's archive.

About two years ago Jost Gebers has refurbished (is this the English word?) all recording and playback devices which were used throughout all those years by FMP.

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4 minutes ago, Onxidlib said:

About two years ago Jost Gebers has refurbished (is this the English word?) all recording and playback devices which were used throughout all those years by FMP.

It might, depending on what you actually want to say ... ;)

"Rebuilt"?

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18 minutes ago, Onxidlib said:

It seems to be a bit more complicated. See (only in German) http://www.fmp-label.de/fmplabel/archivhaupttext.html

But also this on the FMP website: " The person responsible for productions on this label remains Jost Gebers. It is he who is exclusively responsible for productions and carries them out in accordance with agreements made with the musicians involved. Third party intervention is ruled out. Planning, selection, realization and financing of production are the exclusive responsibility of FMP-Publishing. "

Maybe I will sell all my rare vinyl and start a FMP reissue label :P

According Jost Gebers (and if memory serves me right) almost everything from 1970 or so onward has been recorded and is available in the label's archive.

About two years ago Jost Gebers has refurbished (is this the English word?) all recording and playback devices which were used throughout all those years by FMP.

Well, not sure about physical releases, but they could be digitized and made available at bandcamp or Spotify or something. This could be crowdfunded, and the costs should be manageable. If somebody has contract to Gebers, perhaps this could be brought up. 

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1 hour ago, Big Beat Steve said:

It might, depending on what you actually want to say ... ;)

"Rebuilt"?

Thanks - I meant rebuilt!

57 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

Well, not sure about physical releases, but they could be digitized and made available at bandcamp or Spotify or something. This could be crowdfunded, and the costs should be manageable. If somebody has contract to Gebers, perhaps this could be brought up. 

A download only release would be less expensive, for sure. But for me a physical release is still the preferred medium, although I've bought dozens of downloads over the years. But this is mostly due to high shipping rates from the US to Europe. From Japan the shipping rates are sometimes even less than from Europe to Germany and occaisonally the delivery time is even faster.

On the other hand a download only release is better than none.

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Finally picked up a copy of this disc (Giuffre 3, Graz 1961).

Wow. The recording quality is excellent, and the playing is intense — particularly the version of "Suite for Germany." And the track "Trance"? Bley manages to swing the hell out of just one (prepared/altered) note, making it sound like a banjo player gone mad. It's hilarious and groovy at the same time.

This was one of the tightest trios of all time. Giuffre's 60's work has been monstrously neglected. Elemental put out that wonderful set a few years back, but after this new release, will that be it? I hope not.

Giuffre had a trio with Don Friedman and Barre Phillips after the Bley/Swallow unit (at least one boot exists), and later a trio with Don Pullen and Cecil McBee. I wonder if any tapes exist of that trio.

Edited by Late
Corrected some errors.

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On 5/16/2019 at 3:37 PM, Д.Д. said:

As a reminder, Giuffre 3 Bremen and Stuttgart 1961 recordings together with some unreleased tracks were reissued a few years ago on EMANEM.

I have the original hatART discs, which don't contain the extra tracks that Emanem issued. Any way to hear those tracks online?

And then there's this intriguing 2016 quote from Martin Davidson:

 

Three LPs from [the 1961] tour were issued in Italy in the 1980s, two from Graz and one from somewhere else, but their sound is atrocious. There also is a well-recorded concert from Tübingen, but the piano is so far out of tune that it cannot be considered usable, especially as there are these two superlative concerts from Bremen and Stuttgart.
 

I don't care if the piano's out of tune! (How many dates did Monk record on out-of-tune pianos?) Now I really want to hear the Tübingen concert. Anyone here heard it? (And, per this new release, it turns out that the Graz concerts don't have "atrocious" sound after all.)

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18 hours ago, Late said:

I have the original hatART discs, which don't contain the extra tracks that Emanem issued. Any way to hear those tracks online?

Statement from the EMANEM website:

Downloads

A downloading agreement is currently being negotiated.

Emanem & psi are currently NOT licensed for downloading.
However, there are outfits on the web who are offering Emanem & psi downloads.
Please do not pay them anything, as they are not paying anything for them, and are therefore acting illegally and immorally.
Even the ones that claim to be "legal" do not have any permission, and are not paying either the labels or the musicians.
It is difficult enough to survive financially on the money that does come in from legitimate sales,
so please continue to pay for genuine CDs and downloads.

There are also outfits on the internet offering complete Emanem and psi downloads for free.
I am all for giving things away for free, however, in this imperfect world, it costs money to produce CDs, and as we have limited funds we need to get money back.
In this situation Emanem & psi have been forced to put a virtual freeze on accepting new material.
You may gain in the short term by getting our music for free, but in the longer term, there may not be anything new for you to get.

Many thanks to all our loyal and responsible customers.

Martin Davidson

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On 12/9/2019 at 7:58 PM, Late said:

...a well-recorded concert from Tübingen, but the piano is so far out of tune that it cannot be considered usable, especially as there are these two superlative concerts from Bremen and Stuttgart.
 

I don't care if the piano's out of tune! (How many dates did Monk record on out-of-tune pianos?) Now I really want to hear the Tübingen concert. Anyone here heard it? (And, per this new release, it turns out that the Graz concerts don't have "atrocious" sound after all.)

Perhaps the piano was out of tune intentionally.

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23 hours ago, gvopedz said:

Perhaps the piano was out of tune intentionally.

I'm down with that.

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I was yesterday in the only remaining record shop in Viena (EMI on Kärtnerstraße) together with my wife and while I was Browsing though the records she picked this up and said "is this something for you? it´s written it´s "live".

I said well yes this is something I never heard. So she bought it and I´ll get it for Chrismas or my Birthday. 

It means very much to me and moved me, that my wife, who is not necessarly a jazz Lover, became involved in my brousing through the CDs and I must admit until now I didn´t pay much Attention to drum-less chamber Music, but now I´m really Looking forward to "dig" into this stuff, anyway I got older and have more musical insight to understand also music which until now was not really my "bag". 

 

Edited by Gheorghe

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