Jump to content

Playing Favorites: Reflections on Jazz in the 1970s


Recommended Posts

Moody was an assiduous studier and practice. I think he was really committed to working through the Lydian Chromatic Concept book. That's why/how his "otside" playing always worked logivcally, it was solid math, and most importantly, executed with Moody's soul d always into it. So I can see how he would be irked by Ornette, who seemed to be some country boy sing-songy naïf just playing what he felt as it came to him, no plan, no architecture, no math, just impulse.

Of course, no - that was part of Ornette's vibe, but not really his music. Ornette did his homework and had his math down, solid solid SOLID. But I can see how an overt hard-worker like Moody being turned off by somebody who, in his mind, just got up there and played...whatever, while he was in there busting his ass learning all the maths and permutations and implications and deliberations.

But oh well, don't feel sorry for James Moody. James Moody was a motherfucker, period. And those Muse records are about the best things he ever did.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 973
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

I gotta tell you Hutch, you're really hitting it out of the park with all this -- and your writing is just a joy to read on my subway commutes.

From today's Electric Byrd post, my reading "Another difference: Bitches Brew often seems like a limbless torso, with normal markers removed, an irrational, flowing shape" just put the biggest damn smile on my face. ^_^  I'm sure I could pull other similarly delightful quotes from any number of the previous days entries.  Engaging and thoughtful writing, that's both economical and a bit luxurious at the same time (no small feat).  If I tried something like this, my posts would be 3x as long, and probably say half as much.

If you'd ever want to consider pulling your entire year's worth of writing into a self-published book collecting up everything for posterity -- I'd be delighted to kick in $100 towards that end, like an informal sort of 'kickstarter'.

Sign me up now, matter of fact, I'm already sold on the concept barely halfway through the first month.  Bravo!

Edited by Rooster_Ties
Link to comment
Share on other sites

THANK YOU, Rooster.  I'm glad you're enjoying it.  And your encouragement means a lot too. 

I'm enjoying the writing and the listening that's required to do the writing.  Plus, I'm getting a chance to share some thoughts that have been rattling around in my head for a while.  Getting ideas "out in the open" is always gratifying -- even if it's just through informal writing on a blog.  (Or dialoguing here on the board.)

As far as making a book goes... maybe some day.  For now, though, I should just take it day by day, one bite at a time. 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At some point, maybe the charm of Electric Byrd that some feel will get to me too. I very much like the mood of the record (thank you, Duke Pearson), but the specifics...not so much. Byrd's chops were slowly/irrevocably ebbing away (easier seen in retrospect than in real time), and none of the other soloists are particularly distinctive. I feel the same way about Fancy Free too, but not as much about Kofi (and why the unreleased stuff hits me better than the released stuff, hell if I know). Ethiopian Knights...hmmmm....

Maybe another listen to all of these in the future will get different results. I know enough people whose tastes and mine overlap far more often than not who really dig Electric Byrd, so maybe in time...but for right now, it's a better record for me to have on than to actually listen to, and again, thank you, Duke Pearson! "Mood music" is not at all a disparagement, and is something that is infinitely more easily said than done.

As for the blog itself, hell yeah, I'm making it a point to check it daily.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, JSngry said:

At some point, maybe the charm of Electric Byrd that some feel will get to me too. I very much like the mood of the record (thank you, Duke Pearson), but the specifics...not so much. Byrd's chops were slowly/irrevocably ebbing away (easier seen in retrospect than in real time), and none of the other soloists are particularly distinctive. I feel the same way about Fancy Free too, but not as much about Kofi (and why the unreleased stuff hits me better than the released stuff, hell if I know). Ethiopian Knights...hmmmm....

Maybe another listen to all of these in the future will get different results. I know enough people whose tastes and mine overlap far more often than not who really dig Electric Byrd, so maybe in time...but for right now, it's a better record for me to have on than to actually listen to, and again, thank you, Duke Pearson! "Mood music" is not at all a disparagement, and is something that is infinitely more easily said than done.

I can understand how you might not dig Electric Byrd, Jim.   Reading your comments, what came to mind immediately is another BIG difference between Bitches Brew and Electric Byrd: Miles' solos are electrifying and Byrd's are not. ... Then again, it's not really a soloist's record; it's a texture record. (Or, like you say, a "mood" record.)  I dig the album's wash of color, its Brazilianisms and arrangements. Airto and Duke P.

And Mickey Roker sounds really good too. Didn't say anything about him in the post, and I should've. 

... Not at all trying to convince.  Just more chatting at the bar over our beers (metaphorically speaking). ;) 

 

Edited by HutchFan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The last Donald Byrd records that sounded to me like he was all in chops wise was Royal Flush and Free Form. We now know that he was slowly putting the horn on more of a back burner due to a combination of tired chops and law studies, but nobody said that at the time. and he still made good records, I mean Mustang is a gas, but that's because it's a good group record, not a good Donald Byrd trumpet record. And for whatever reason, Electric Byrd and others of the time have a lot of Donald Byrd playing trumpet.

No matter - Duke Pearson!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

I can understand how you might not dig Electric Byrd, Jim.   Reading your comments, what came to mind immediately is another BIG difference between Bitches Brew and Electric Byrd: Miles' solos are electrifying and Byrd's are not. ... Then again, it's not really a soloist's record; it's a texture record. (Or, like you say, a "mood" record.)

I like all those pre-Mizell electric leader-dates, but I get what you're saying Jim.  They're not knock-outs, but I still dig 'em a lot.  Also, I'm with you about Kofi maybe being the best of the bunch.  What all those albums lack a little in sparkle from specific soloist, is a vibe and texture that really does work (for me anyway).  I mean, if they were by any other less-well-known musicians, and on some smaller or independent label from around that same time, they'd be lost treasures.  But cuz they're on BN, and by somebody like "Donald Byrd" - they're easier to write off as not quite up to being among his finest.

But, yeah, Kofi:tup

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The title cut of Fancy Free got a lot of airplay on the overnight FM jazz show I heard as a teen. It always sounded good on the radio, a good sound to have on while doing homework or otherwise drifting off and out and back in again (and it wasn't just me drifting in and out, it was the signal out of Fort Worth as well). So I bought the record at some point and sat down to actually listen to it...underwhelmed would be accurate. BUT - it still sounded great, and when I began to drift away due to a lack of engagement in the playing, it started "sounding" better. So, there was definitely something there, if not in the details, then in the mix. And again - thank you Duke Pearson!

In one kind of way, those records are kinda an analogue equivalent of the Yesterday's New Quintet records, they're more about the impressions of the music than the music itself. For some old-schoolers, that might be sacrilege or whatever to even consider that to be legit. But here we are, there it is, and so it goes. If it's a thing, and if that thing grows and takes on a family, hey, welcome to the neighborhood. Just pay your taxes, pick up after you kids and dogs, and don't be getting the police all up in here. If you cover that, glad to have ya'!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I like those Byrd albums for the sound also.  I also like the Grant Green albums from that period for the same reason.  Those Byrd albums were a big step forward from the monstrosities of "I'm Trying to Get Home" and "Up", and way better to me than what came afterwards (both the Mizell etc. commercial stuff and the disheartening ca. 1990 "comeback").  The interlude in between with "Mustang", "Blackjack", "Slow Drag" and "The Creeper" was pleasant, though unremarkable.  "Free Form" will always be THE Donald Byrd album for me, with some others from that very early 60's period not far behind.  BTW, the Elvin Jones version of "Fancy Free" on the Live at the Lighthouse album is great (as is the whole album).  Expecting to see that one pop up during the year of postings, though "Coalition" or "Genesis" would also be fine choices.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, felser said:

BTW, the Elvin Jones version of [Donald Byrd's] "Fancy Free" on the Live at the Lighthouse album is great (as is the whole album).

Gosh, I really need to dig out my Elvin Mosaic again -- which I don't spin nearly enough.  I'd plum forgotten entirely (and have absolutely zero memory) that Byrd's tune "Fancy Free" was on Live at the Lighthouse -- so much so, that I'm scarcely sure I ever realized that (or like maybe 25 years ago, the last time I owned the "Lighthouse" dates on individual CD's (before I got the Mosaic).

There's so many discographical details like that I used to know like the back of my hand, and I care barely remember 1/4th of them any more.  Guess that was a lot easier when (20-25 years ago), I was pouring over my BN liners a lot more often, and not just thinking "been there, done that" with so much of the BN catalog, as I do now (which I still love, but don't spin anywhere near as much as I did 15-25 years ago).  Then again, I don't spin as much music in general now, these days, it seems -- life just getting busier and busier sometimes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, jazzbo said:

Monstrosity? I like "I'm Trying to Get Home" a lot. We're all different.

I've tried and tried, really want to like it, do like "A New Perspective", but it doesn't work for me.  As you say, we're all different.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/17/2020 at 2:02 PM, JSngry said:

At some point, maybe the charm of Electric Byrd that some feel will get to me too. I very much like the mood of the record (thank you, Duke Pearson), but the specifics...not so much. Byrd's chops were slowly/irrevocably ebbing away (easier seen in retrospect than in real time), and none of the other soloists are particularly distinctive. I feel the same way about Fancy Free too, but not as much about Kofi (and why the unreleased stuff hits me better than the released stuff, hell if I know). Ethiopian Knights...hmmmm....

Maybe another listen to all of these in the future will get different results. I know enough people whose tastes and mine overlap far more often than not who really dig Electric Byrd, so maybe in time...but for right now, it's a better record for me to have on than to actually listen to, and again, thank you, Duke Pearson! "Mood music" is not at all a disparagement, and is something that is infinitely more easily said than done.

As for the blog itself, hell yeah, I'm making it a point to check it daily.

Mark Stryker wasn't too excited about the commercial part of Byrd's career in "Jazz From Detroit".  He generally treats most of it as sell-out, after a very successful jazz career.

His career change received a much 'softer' treatment in  the "Hard Bop" book. I confess to being completely oblivious to the fact that i was playing anything that had to do with Byrd when i was playing :Walkin' In Rhythm" on the many gigs that they called it on. Groovy little flute solo there!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Though I´m a product of the 70´s and sure did listen a lot to the Electric Miles stuff, my entry in the Donald Byrd discopgraphy was an acoustic one. On the Radio Show "Jazz Shop" the Disc Jockey played two items from the 1955 Savoy Album "Long Green" and as I liked what I heard, I purchased the Album (with a red cover). 

and on the liner notes there was "a warning: this Music has Nothing to do with the Kind of Music that made Donald Byrd so popluar during the last few years….." 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Weekly Recap - PLAYING FAVORITES: Reflections on Jazz in the 1970s

01/21/20 - Bobby Hutcherson featuring Harold Land – San Francisco (Blue Note, 1971)

01/20/20 - Lee Morgan – Live at the Lighthouse (Blue Note, 1971)

01/19/20 - Dexter Gordon with Junior Mance – At Montreux (Prestige, 1985)

01/18/20 - Rusty Bryant – Soul Liberation (Prestige, 1970)

01/17/20 - Charlie [Charles] Earland – Black Drops (Prestige, 1970)

01/16/20 - Donald Byrd – Electric Byrd (Blue Note, 1970)

01/15/20 - Music Inc. [Charles Tolliver] – Live at Slugs', Vol. 1 (Strata-East, 1972) and Live at Slugs', Vol. 2 (Strata-East, 1973)

 

Who said Blue Note didn't make any worthwhile records in the 1970s?!?!?  THREE this week!  ;) 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, felser said:

That's certainly a good Hutch album, but I would have gone with the Montreux album with Woody Shaw, which is amazing.

Much as a I love Woody Shaw (and Bobby Hutcherson), I've never thought that Bobby's live at Montreux album was AS good as it should have been.  It's pretty darn good, definitely, but I still have always felt like it could/should have been better.  Haven't listened to it in years, so I should see if I still feel the same way.

THAT SAID, San Francisco never hit me right, and I've always chalked that up to Joe Sample's inclusion on the date.  I always wanted to like San Francisco better, but try as I might, I just never connected with it anywhere near as well as every single Hutcherson leader-date that preceded it, and more than half the Hutch dates in his 70's Mosaic Select too (I think that had 4 albums).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Rooster_Ties said:

Much as a I love Woody Shaw (and Bobby Hutcherson), I've never thought that Bobby's live at Montreux album was AS good as it should have been.  It's pretty darn good, definitely, but I still have always felt like it could/should have been better.  Haven't listened to it in years, so I should see if I still feel the same way.

THAT SAID, San Francisco never hit me right, and I've always chalked that up to Joe Sample's inclusion on the date.  I always wanted to like San Francisco better, but try as I might, I just never connected with it anywhere near as well as every single Hutcherson leader-date that preceded it, and more than half the Hutch dates in his 70's Mosaic Select too (I think that had 4 albums).

All of those early 70's Hutch dates seemed to have caveats.  "Head On" is one I've never warmed to as much as I would expect, as the Bayette Todd Cochran comps leave me kind of cold (I like his own albums from that period on Prestige better).   And I agree on Sample.  But I love that Montreux album.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The album opens with Joe Sample's "Goin' Down South," a groover that you could've heard on a Jazz Crusaders LP...

Well, you COULD have, except they had literally just changed the name of the band...

R-830797-1247245088.jpeg.jpg

 

Also, count me as one who has never been fully bitten by the San Francisco bug. If we're talking first part of the 70s, make mine Cirrus (1974). The recording is a little echo-y for my taste, but the playing is top shelf.

I think Montreux is amazing, but that's a really stealth record. Head On is fine with me, but...Iapetus shows that core band to better advantage, imo.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, felser said:

That's certainly a good Hutch album, but I would have gone with the Montreux album with Woody Shaw, which is amazing.

This is Hutcherson's and Land's "co-led" album.  So I still get to choose one more from each of them.

Montreux and Cirrus and Head On all of Hutch's other 70s "sole leader" albums are still in play. 

Same with the records under Land's leadership -- Choma (Burn), A New Shade of Blue, Damisi, Mapenzi, etc.

 

14 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Well, you COULD have, except they had literally just changed the name of the band...

R-830797-1247245088.jpeg.jpg

 

Oh.  I didn't realize that they actually had recorded that song!  

I'm familiar with the first two "non-Jazz" Crusader records -- 1 and Second Crusade -- but I've never heard Pass the Plate

Gonna give that a listen. Thanks for the heads up!  ;) 

Edited by HutchFan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pass The Plate was the first "Crusaders" record. It followed on the heel of Old Socks, New Shoes..., which was the last "Jazz Crusaders" record. The latter has a version of "Jazz!", also recorded by Hutcherson on San Francisco.

 

Both of those first two Chisa albums have cult appeal today (and the Socks/Shoes record has the immortal "Way Down Home"), but imo neither capture the band at its best of either their earlier or their later forms. "Transitional" indeed!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, felser said:

All of those early 70's Hutch dates seemed to have caveats.  "Head On" is one I've never warmed to as much as I would expect, as the Bayette Todd Cochran comps leave me kind of cold (I like his own albums from that period on Prestige better).   And I agree on Sample.  But I love that Montreux album.

I'm sorta surprised that you gents don't enjoy San Francisco more.  Again, not try to convince anyone to hear things otherwise.  Just talkin'.   

I think Sample was the perfect player for the record.  To me, San Fran is a funky minimalism record, as if African abstraction could meet soul-jazz in mellow Northern California.  The equation works for me.

Just curious:  Do you guys like Montara?

 

5 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Pass The Plate was the first "Crusaders" record. It followed on the heel of Old Socks, New Shoes..., which was the last "Jazz crusaders" record. The latter has a version of "Jazz!", also recorded by Hutcherson on San Francisco.

O.K.  Gotcha.

So I guess the album titled 1 represented a second "re-set" after the name change from Jazz Crusaders to Crusaders.  Didn't realize that. 

 

Edited by HutchFan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Montara...yes, I "like" it, but more as "concept executed" than as music I really engage in.

I like Dale Ohler's work elsewhere, but here it sounds like he was bringing hutch into his world rather than the other way around, and no harm/no foul, of course, but still, I'd like to have heard the premise executed with a different concept, say...Clare Fischer's. But this was George Butler Time, so...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...