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thirdtry

Wynton Kelly & Cecil Payne Live

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Can anyone provide any info (dates, personnel) on this session?  I can't seem to find anything on it.  It's a Collectables CD (COL-5793) and there is no info at all in the packaging.  There seems to be a small Charlie Parker Records logo on the tray card but I don't think this session is in the big 30 CD Charlie Parker Records box set.  Here's the link to what AllMusic provides:

https://www.allmusic.com/album/live-mw0000031914

Any help would be appreciated!

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is it a reissue of a lp?  cecil payne was one of charlie parker records' main artists.so we gotta search the discogrpahy and try to find it  

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I've already looked through Kelly and Payne's online discographies and didn't find anything (although I could have missed it).  Usually I can figure this stuff out with a little work but I had to plead for mercy on this one.

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nothing in Discogs as far as its existence; google isn't coming up with much at all. Weird.

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Yeah, I’m not coming up with anything either... ...except for this nice (unrelated) clip:

 

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i-img640x640-1558684852amjohl1256173.jpg

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It's not in the 30 CD Charlie Parker Records box.  There's a photo of the release on this Ebay page:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Winton-Kelly-Cecile-Pain-Live-Wynton-Kelly-Cecil-Payne-Discontinued-Rare-CD-/284103217658

...and it says "Produced by Aubrey Mayhew."  There's also a barcode, if anyone finds that useful.

(I see that Jim found a similar photo and posted it above.)

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I looked through the Wynton Kelly discography by Claude Slouch and don't see anything at all like this.  

 

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It sounds like a full band and I would guess it was recorded from the audience (or at least on amateur equipment) as the quality is pretty poor.

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Payne recorded two albums for CP Records: in 1961 and 1962.  Kelly was busy with Miles in 1961, but looked to be freelance in 1962 and barely recorded in 1963.  I see no other dodgy-sounding live recordings in the CP Records box set for this time period.

10 minutes ago, thirdtry said:

It sounds like a full band and I would guess it was recorded from the audience (or at least on amateur equipment) as the quality is pretty poor.

Can you aurally identify any of the other musicians?

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Aubrey Mayhew was not the most un-dodgy character...

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My ears aren't good enough to ID anyone but there are sound clips in the AllMusic link in my first post if someone wants to try.

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12 minutes ago, thirdtry said:

My ears aren't good enough to ID anyone but there are sound clips in the AllMusic link in my first post if someone wants to try.

The listed tune titles are useless.  I've added some notations below based on a quick listen to the samples.  Definitely an audience recording.  Some sound like a large band, while the others sound like Cecil with a rhythm section.  The sound varies somewhat from sample to sample.  I wonder if there are multiple sources or sessions that were sampled.  Note that the cd cover says "compiled by" Aubrey Mayhew.

>>>

1.  Cecil's Back Home. 

2. Outta My Head for You [This sounds like "You Go to My Head"]

3. Confirmation

4. Kelly's Rhythm [Night in Tunisia]

5. Sounds of the Soul [The sample is just a woman talking]

6.  52nd Street Theme [No, this is "Goodbye"]

7. Keys of Kelly

8. Layin's Down Cecil [Body and Soul]

>>>

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#1 is "Indiana" changes, not hearing the head, maybe it's "Donna Lee"?

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3 hours ago, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

speakin of rare wynton kelly-- has this been released ever anywhere, on ebay rt now- 

s-l1600.jpg

 

someone should save the audio if u can he linked a huge clip

https://clyp.it/jkhw3lrc

I captured the audio. Does anyone know the date? It's not even in Losin.   Maybe we should all chip in and try to buy it.  

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Probably March 4, 1960, San Francisco Civic Auditorium.

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Posted (edited)

So how "LEGIT" is the Collectables label with this Kelly-/Payne release at all, then?

Edited by Big Beat Steve

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Posted (edited)

On 4.1.2021 at 11:44 AM, Big Beat Steve said:

So how "LEGIT" is the Collectables label with this Kelly-/Payne release at all, then?

Amazing ...

Mention the "Legit" question and the discussion ebbs off in no time at all ...

Considering this seems to have been a first-time release on this 1997 CD this must have violated ANY existing US copyright rules (because there cannot have been any period that had elapsed since the "first" release) unless the recordings had been cleared with the estates of Wynton Kelly and Cecil Payne (or whoever else may have had rights to recordings by these artists during this period). Is there any proof that the royalties to these estates have been paid? Does this appear likely, considering the shady, cheapo presentation of the CD and the lack of data and details on it? Are we that far away from the "bootleg" word?

If such a release had been put out by any European P.D. label the outcries about the (alleged) "Andorran thieves" would have been all over the place by now. So is it good practice to hush over "U.S. thieves", then? Double standards at work?

And don't nobody claim that at least in this case something new has been released and not just preexisting releases reissued. Just remember how the accusations of "shady" practices were worded here even in cases of European releases of concert recordings originally done for European radio stations, claiming that these recordings would not have been cleared at the time for anything but the original broadcasts - without providing substantiated proof that the radio stations did not in fact have rights to release or approve for release well beyond those broadcasts. So ... is it so that Collectables "can do no wrong"? Doubts are permitted.

Edited by Big Beat Steve

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