Brubeck's "Time Out"

[Larry Kart]

Never before owned a copy. Desmond plays beautifully there.

[Teasing the Korean]

47 minutes ago, Larry Kart said:

Never before owned a copy. Desmond plays beautifully there.

When a younger and more innocent TTK was teaching himself about jazz, he bought this album.  It was a 70s stereo reissue, in which the artwork had been significantly cropped to hype "Take Five."  The tune that really knocked me out was "Strange Meadowlark."

Years later, I found an original mono copy pre-dating the "Take Five" hype, with the full moderne cover art in all it's glory.  The mono version has a better balance between the drums and other instruments.

I haven't spun this album in ages.  Aside from the hit, "Meadowlark" and "Blue Rondo," I don't remember much about it.  

Edited August 8, 2021 by Teasing the Korean

[Rooster_Ties]

1 hour ago, Larry Kart said:

Never before owned a copy. Desmond plays beautifully there.

I’ve never owned a copy either, and I only have a smattering of Brubeck dates, maybe a half-dozen.

My favorite Brubeck is Jazz Impressions of Eurasia — and I’m just now seeing this from the Wikipedia entry entry for Eurasia…

>> Brubeck composed the six pieces for the album—along with "Blue Rondo à la Turk," which appeared on the group's signature album of the following year, Time Out—while on tour across Eurasia.

[JSngry]

I think that "Everybody's Jumpin'" is the secret source of Steely Dan. Not the whole thing, just parts, and I don't know if it was conscious, but there's a part or two where it's, ok, this is damn near almost every Steely Dan song in a nutshell.

 

1 hour ago, Teasing the Korean said:

Years later, I found an original mono copy pre-dating the "Take Five" hype, with the full moderne cover art in all it's glory.  The mono version has a better balance between the drums and other instruments.

Yeah, I jumped on a copy of that just for the cover. The record was beat to hell, but that was beside the point.

[JSngry]

33 minutes ago, Rooster_Ties said:

My favorite Brubeck is Jazz Impressions of Eurasia — and I’m just now seeing this from the Wikipedia entry entry for Eurasia…

Mine too, at least from the Columbia years...the Fantasy records, though...different animal, mostly standards and VERY improvised, but very often WOW.

Eurasia, though, yeah, it's got mojo.

Here's something that is almost as mesmerizing as the 800% slower Perry Mason them.

 

[mjazzg]

I thought this was a intriguing release

 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by mjazzg

[Chuck Nessa]

Because of the cover art, back in the day (high school) I thought of Time Out and Mingus Ah Um as a set.

[clifford_thornton]

Desmond is great on it indeed. Love their pairing in the 50s and 60s.

[Teasing the Korean]

1 minute ago, Chuck Nessa said:

Because of the cover art, back in the day (high school) I thought of Time Out and Mingus Ah Um as a set.

I still think of them that way!

[JSngry]

And The Columbia Jazz Records Of 1959 Alumni Association seconds your thought, and reminds you that your contributions are what keeps their vitally important work going both today and tomorrow. So thank you for your support!

[Teasing the Korean]

On a semi-related topic, Ms. TTK recently went to a record show where they had a bunch of dollar CDs.  She brought home Time Further Out, which we'd had only on LP, and a Paul Desmond RCA CD called Polka Dots and Moonbeams, which we never had.  The latter features lovely playing by both Desmond and Jim Hall.  Wonderful for pairing with cocktails on a lazy Saturday or Sunday.

[jlhoots]

The 5 CD box set, For All Time, works just fine for me.

[Milestones]

I find it be a fine record--good both jazz newbies and for most grizzled veterans hanging out around here.  I used to be one of those who thought Brubeck was a bit square (maybe mostly based just on the appearance of the man), but I have come to appreciate a great deal of his work.

I also like Time Further Out (1961) a good deal.

[JSngry]

He WAS square. Very. But in a totally hip way!

Seriously, check out the early live Quartet stuff on Fantasy. If the later stuff became a bit of a house pet, that stuff was a bit of the wild animal, as unlikely as that sound. Domesticated, yes. House pet, no. 

 

[riddlemay]

Another favorite (of mine). The solos are fine, but what stands out for me is one lovely composition after another.

 

[Rabshakeh]

5 hours ago, JSngry said:

He WAS square. Very. But in a totally hip way!

Seriously, check out the early live Quartet stuff on Fantasy. If the later stuff became a bit of a house pet, that stuff was a bit of the wild animal, as unlikely as that sound. Domesticated, yes. House pet, no. 

 

I recently bought one of the live Fantasys whilst away on a seaside jaunt to Sussex. My wife was in hysterics on the drive home at the idea of me having bought a Dave Brubeck album, and was mockingly humming Blue Rondo. 

I waited two days and then put it on over supper, and quietly went back to feeding the infant. Midway through Desmond's solo on the second track, she said "What is this? It's incredible."

[mikeweil]

3 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

I recently bought one of the live Fantasys whilst away on a seaside jaunt to Sussex. My wife was in hysterics on the drive home at the idea of me having bought a Dave Brubeck album, and was mockingly humming Blue Rondo. 

I waited two days and then put it on over supper, and quietly went back to feeding the infant. Midway through Desmond's solo on the second track, she said "What is this? It's incredible."

What is it she doesn't like about Brubeck?

[Rabshakeh]

I think she just associates him with Time Out. 

[Dub Modal]

Desmond and Morello really make these Brubeck albums for me. 

[Peter Friedman]

I have gone through a number of up's and down's on Brubeck.  At present I am in an up phase. I agree with Jim that the early Quartet sessions on Fantasy were very special. I rarely play the Take Five album. The title tune has become so widely played on radio, TV, shopping malls, elevators, etc. that it has become overkill for me..

I know this will be a minority opinion, but in some ways the entrance of drummer Joe Morello to the group sometimes got in the way of my enjoyment of the group. Some tunes have lengthy drum solos to show off Morello's talent and were not really to my taste.

[Dub Modal]

1 minute ago, Peter Friedman said:

Some tunes have lengthy drum solos to show off Morello's talent and were not really to my taste.

On the Fantasy albums? Or in general?

[JSngry]

I went on a Total Immersion Desmond Trip a few years ago, so I got into a LOT of Brubeck. Here's some of what I learned:

• Brubeck was much more of a composer before the Quartet got going. Those Octet & Trio records of his...not really fond of them, but they're not bullshit, by any means. Remember, Cecil Taylor openly claimed to have been inspired by those records!
• The early, pre-Columbia Quartets are a totally different bag. Loose improvisations on standards, mostly, and the groups was set up for the bass and drums to set a groove and hold it while Brubeck and Desmond did there things, separately and together. It worked like a charm, and one live record may not be enough, just sayin'...
• When the group signed to Columbia, they kept on recording live and mostly standards still, with a notable exception or two.
• Brubeck also did two solo albums pretty early on that are pretty substantial. Brubeck plays Brubeck, I think it's called, is in particular very worthwhile.
• As the group evolved more into a vehicle for Brubeck's compositions, things changed. The looseness had to be sacrificed, it seemed, as long-familiar material was replaced by new material. Different paradigm. Of course, Desmond, being Desmond, was always there.
• Morello changed everything, imo. Now Brubeck could compose group pieces and not just "songs". To pun it out, there were definite repercussions.
• Time Out, geez, you get a hit LP and a Top 10(?) single, yeah, the game changes.
• Not nearly as many Live albums after that, but the few that there were, were good, especially Carnegie Hall.
• But...studio albums, most of them with "concepts"...some are better than others. The "Jazz Impressions of..." records are excellent. The "Time..." records..an inconsistent bunch, and the rest...I bought that studio albums box, and it seems that once you hit 62 or so, it becomes an inconsistent lot, like they're making the records just to have product. And the Cole Porter record has moments of tru sublimity.
• Brubeck himself...part of what made his interplay with Desmond so special was that it was a true conversation. When that conversation got triangulated with Morello in the mix...I'm not sure Desmond wanted a three-way conversation. so things changed, the dynamic changed. For better or for worse...different records will tell different stories. But it definitely was a change.

Brubeck's image after Time Out seemed to be somebody who appealed to white guys with jackets with elbow patches, pipes and intellectual affectation, which may not be totally incorrect. There's still a lot of that in the air, and I was in there for a pretty long time. But what I have learned is that that's not really the full story, and definitely not the full one.

And not to be too blunt about it, but if they had all disappeared by 1956-57 or so, like gotten jazz raptured or something, they would be legends, these white guys from San Francisco who found a way to do things totally their own way. The piano player was a little poundy, but oh well about that,. Lon pointed out a few decades ago that he heard similarities to Monk in his playing and I poopoo-ed that idea then, but upon further review...yeah, there are points of similarity. And I think they're entirely coincidental. Brubeck...made his own way a s a player, totally.

Of course, that didn't happen, so now you got the whole stereotype/myth/narrative to wade through, so good luck on that. But it's a wade worth making if you don't mind making it. And if you do mind, that's ok, just know that your opinion cannot be considered an informed one, because there's a surprisingly LOT of "there" there to deal with.

28 minutes ago, Dub Modal said:

On the Fantasy albums? Or in general?

Morello was not in the Quartet until 1957, and imo didn't really start to "Joe Morello" the gig until Jazz Impressions Of Eurasia (which is a REALLY good record, check it out). But what sealed the deal was that drum solo on Take Five. Desmond had mixed emotions about all that...I read on thing about him saying "I wrote it to be a drum solo, not a hit records", so...

But pre-Morello Brubeck is a different world!

[medjuck]

41 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Brubeck's image after Time Out seemed to be somebody who appealed to white guys with jackets with elbow patches, pipes and intellectual affectation, which may not be totally incorrect. There's still a lot of that in the air, and I was in there for a pretty long time. But what I have learned is that that's not really the full story, and definitely not the full one.

 

IIRC this was true even before Time Out.  (Isn't there a mention of Brubeck in Jail House Rock.) 

[JSngry]

Probably, the Quartet had become a very popular college attraction. Aren't they credited for creating the "college circuit" for modern jazz?

They were pretty popular before Time Out, but I'm not sure that the fan base noticed the change in the group, although, they still played a lot of standards live. But once you have a hit record...

The stereotype that I came into was those same college fans, only as adults, older and kinda lost about what "modern" was meaning now.

[Dub Modal]

1 hour ago, JSngry said:

Morello was not in the Quartet until 1957, and imo didn't really start to "Joe Morello" the gig until Jazz Impressions Of Eurasia (which is a REALLY good record, check it out). But what sealed the deal was that drum solo on Take Five. Desmond had mixed emotions about all that...I read on thing about him saying "I wrote it to be a drum solo, not a hit records", so...

But pre-Morello Brubeck is a different world!

Got it. Need to check those out....