J.A.W. Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 (edited) what about Sal Salvador, what i've heard seems quite close to the Raney school not as fluent as Farlow (but then who is). His session with Costa (on the 10" BN reissue) on board makes a nice comparison with Farlow's. Recently picked up Sal's "Juicy Lucy" on Beehive, a pleasant enough set with Billy Taylor For those interested, Toshiba reissued Sal Salvador's Bethlehem albums on CD in Japan a few years ago. Last time I looked they were still available. Edited April 30, 2004 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 what about Sal Salvador, what i've heard seems quite close to the Raney school not as fluent as Farlow (but then who is). His session with Costa (on the 10" BN reissue) on board makes a nice comparison with Farlow's. Recently picked up Sal's "Juicy Lucy" on Beehive, a pleasant enough set with Billy Taylor Rene Thomas seems pretty hot on Getz'z Dynasty album. Worth a spin or two. Adrian, Salvador was quite a discovery for me when I picked up that 10"-series CD. I hesitated for a long time, as I did not know him before. Then, a few months ago, I found his "A Tribute To The Greats" on vinyl (courtesy of our good friends Freshsound - originally on Bethlehem). Another very nice recording. It's with Eddie Costa, Frank Dallas and Ronnie Free, tunes: Artistry in Rhythm Taps Miller Prelude to a Kiss Walking Shoes Solos for Guitar Four Brothers In your own sweet way Ruby My Dear Manteca Cool Eyes Yardbird Suite Rec. Summer 57, reissued in Japan 1999: TOCJ-62023 (Japan,1999) (http://www.guylj.fsnet.co.uk/JazzGuitarist...totheGreats.htm) ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tooter Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 [quote=Chuck He had friggin' huge hands, so he could play different chords no on else could reach. Having heard about Tal Farlow's huge hands, I noticed them in photographs. I also read that some guitar players have the tendon between thumb and forefinger cut so as to reach further, like Tal - don't know how true it is and if so, who. I remember hearing Joe Pass, interviewed on the BBC a long time ago, saying if memory serves, that he used found strings which gave that rich sound rather than flat stringss for a harsher quality. For pure enjoyment, I would listen to Tal as the first choice guitarist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 That page I linked above is pretty nice: http://www.guylj.fsnet.co.uk/JazzGuitarist...vador/index.htm There's more on other guitar players there, too. Adrian, I have not heard "Dynasty". I think it's not OOP yet. Gourley makes a good appearance on Eddie Louiss' Jazz in Paris disc: Kenny Clarke's on this one, too. Don't miss it! ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKE BBB Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 (edited) HERB ELLIS JOE PASS and DJAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANGO!!! Edited April 30, 2004 by EKE BBB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKE BBB Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 If you are REALLY checking out jazz guitar, don't ignore Tal Farlow and Jimmy Raney. Oh yes! Those guys are amazing. Was the Red Norvo trio with Mingus ever released on CD? AMG They cut five tracks from the original 2 LPs on Savoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I think all the Norvo/Farlow/Mingus sides are on this one: (the rest is the Norvo date with Parker, I think) ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I think all the Norvo/Farlow/Mingus sides are on this one: (the rest is the Norvo date with Parker, I think) ubu According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I got used to the fact that Savoy (besides that very cool 8CD Bird box) has a very strange reissue policy... I read somewhere that all the tracks were on this release, but we know our Keepnews... ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I got used to the fact that Savoy (besides that very cool 8CD Bird box) has a very strange reissue policy... I read somewhere that all the tracks were on this release, but we know our Keepnews... ubu Certainly not my Keepnews! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couw Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. where does it state that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. where does it state that? Oops, I guess I totally misread the review Sorry about that... I'll check my discographies and the tracklists of the various Savoy reissues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. where does it state that? Oops, I guess I totally misread the review Sorry about that... I'll check my discographies and the tracklists of the various Savoy reissues. Please post the results! Those new Savoy packages are too expensive to just order now and think later (even more so in my buying freeze...) ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. where does it state that? Oops, I guess I totally misread the review Sorry about that... I'll check my discographies and the tracklists of the various Savoy reissues. Please post the results! Those new Savoy packages are too expensive to just order now and think later (even more so in my buying freeze...) ubu All the tracks on the Savoy Norvo / Farlow / Mingus compilations Move and The Savoy Sessions do appear on The Modern Red Norvo and more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 According to AMG, this set doesn't have all the tracks either. where does it state that? Oops, I guess I totally misread the review Sorry about that... I'll check my discographies and the tracklists of the various Savoy reissues. Please post the results! Those new Savoy packages are too expensive to just order now and think later (even more so in my buying freeze...) ubu All the tracks on the Savoy Norvo / Farlow / Mingus compilations Move and The Savoy Sessions do appear on The Modern Red Norvo and more. Thanks, Hans. So that's one to get after my buying freeze is over... ubu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJ Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I'm glad Farlow got mentioned, he's one of my top 3 modern jazz guys on guitar, with Grant Green and Jim Hall. Funny how DIFFERENT from each other these guys are, yet I love 'em all so much. No slight meant to all the other fantastic jazz guitarists, especially Wes Montgomery and Kenny Burrell who are real close to these for me, but something about the styles of these "big 3" just slays me. Farlow is a perfect example of an exception to one rule for me - as Jim mentioned so eloquently earlier, he plays such long lines that they are really NOT horn like, although he does borrow some horn phrasing. But overall, his lines are more "guitaristic" than many other jazz guitarists. Normally I prefer the latter school, but Farlow is just so musical in his own way that it's irrelevant. I will say, though, that for me Farlow is kind of the "Tatum of the guitar," meaning that if I'm really serious about listening then I have to put all distractions aside and FOCUS on what he's doing and take it in relatively small doses...in other words, although it's certainly gorgeous music, it isn't good background music for me, it just whizzes by that way, whereas someone like Grant Green I can enjoy in either type of listening (and in fact it's probably better to not focus too much on things like trying to deconstruct his approach to harmony, as he's not nearly as adventurous and tends to fall back on licks, admittedly hip and smart as they are). Hall is a whole other ballgame - I seldom hear ANY "licks-based" playing in his mature work, not that it's not there I'm sure but he's a pro at hiding it! Just so urbane, yet quietly adventurous, and more so as he ages. And after being fortunate enough to see him live (trio at the Vanguard) I'm even more impressed than before with the fantastic tone he gets...the dynamics and subtleties are literally endless. A master. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim R Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 I agree about Tal requiring close attention. WOW, is it refreshing every time I go back and listen to his work. He played some "impossible" (and I don't just mean in terms of his hands/reach) chords... where you go "whaaaat was THAT?" and hit rewind! Kessel makes me do that a lot too. The way those guys just pulled those chords out of a hat... on the fly... all I can say is they must have taken there guitars EVERYWHERE when they were young (and I've read some stories that would support that idea). I'm also glad that Rene' Thomas was mentioned. GUITAR GROOVE is a must have, IMO. I'm practically a Thomas completeist, and for me that album is one of his very best. I never really warmed up to Getz's DYNASTY, which is late-period R.T. (1971?), and less straight ahead than most of his work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjobbe Posted April 30, 2004 Report Share Posted April 30, 2004 (edited) I'm glad Farlow got mentioned couldn't agree more here....while reading your posting I just noted that Jazzmatazz lists a Mosaic The complete Verve 7CD box for June 04 !!!! maybe that will be my first Mosaic, as I currently do only have some of his OJC and Concords... Cheers, Tjobbe Edited April 30, 2004 by tjobbe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Upright Bill Posted May 1, 2004 Report Share Posted May 1, 2004 Howard Roberts. If you play I highly recommend his book "The Accelerator." Most of what I teach comes as a result of my time in that book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 Amazingly, Joe Pass had short and stubby fingers. I shook hands with him in New York once. A very nice man who encouraged me when he heard I played guitar. Of course I went home after seeing him feeling like I could never play again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJ Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 Upright Bill Posted on Apr 30 2004, 07:17 PM Howard Roberts. If you play I highly recommend his book "The Accelerator." Most of what I teach comes as a result of my time in that book. I need to check out more Howard Roberts for sure, I don't know enough of his work. I do have a little gem called GOOD PICKINS (Verve, 1956) which I picked up on a Japanese import reissue CD a while back. Outstanding stuff, and a lot more hard driving than I would have predicted. Come to think of it I see a few Roberts Verve albums listed on All Music Guide, would perhaps make a very nice Mosaic Select?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim R Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 GOOD PICKIN'S is probably my favorite Roberts recording. That was out of print for SO long, it's ridiculous. For years and years (while scouring the earth for guitar recordings to sustain my habit) I wasn't even aware of its existence. MR. ROBERTS PLAYS GUITAR always seemed to be available on reissue vinyl, but GOOD PICKIN'S was something you had to really do a lot of networking to get your hands on (a cassette copy, in my case). The one thing that's always been frustrating about trying to appreciate H.R.- he didn't record enough as a leader. And even when he did, he was often poorly produced (and he probably should take some of the blame, what with his reputation for being a "wacky" kind of cat). There are bits and pieces of good solid jazz on some of his Capitol albums (compiled on 3 CD's by the Euphoria label in 2001), but many of those tracks are way too short, and some of the material is pretty weak (which goes for many of his later recordings as well, IMO). His Concord album was very good, but there was only just that one. Bottom line- I wish he had been more prolific as a leader. He really had a fantastic sound in the earlier part of his career, and was a gifted player. Joe Pass was simply one of the most fluent and masterful guitarists in the music's history. There are aspects of his style and sound that prevent me from choosing him as a personal favorite, but observing what he did with a guitar in his hands (no matter the setting, from solo performance to ensemble playing) is enough to make anyone think twice about continuing to play (or take up) the guitar. Speaking of personal favorites, these guitar threads always seem to give me the impression that Barney Kessel (though obviously one of the most important and accomplished players of all time) is not all that popular with a lot of people. IMO, he ranks very very high in terms of achievement and influence. He also happens to be one of my favorites, but I think the quality of his work declined as years went on (unlike Burrell, Pass, Farlow, Raney, and others). At his best, I think he may inspire me more than any other player (his instructional video is very inspiring and enjoyable too). To think how many years he has been silent now due to his stroke... it's very sad. What a great career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.:.impossible Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 Jim, Are you a fan of Barry Galbraith? He also didn't do as much as a leader, but his playing is often fascinating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Upright Bill Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 GOOD PICKIN'S is probably my favorite Roberts recording. That was out of print for SO long, it's ridiculous. For years and years (while scouring the earth for guitar recordings to sustain my habit) I wasn't even aware of its existence. MR. ROBERTS PLAYS GUITAR always seemed to be available on reissue vinyl, but GOOD PICKIN'S was something you had to really do a lot of networking to get your hands on (a cassette copy, in my case). The one thing that's always been frustrating about trying to appreciate H.R.- he didn't record enough as a leader. And even when he did, he was often poorly produced (and he probably should take some of the blame, what with his reputation for being a "wacky" kind of cat). There are bits and pieces of good solid jazz on some of his Capitol albums (compiled on 3 CD's by the Euphoria label in 2001), but many of those tracks are way too short, and some of the material is pretty weak (which goes for many of his later recordings as well, IMO). His Concord album was very good, but there was only just that one. Bottom line- I wish he had been more prolific as a leader. He really had a fantastic sound in the earlier part of his career, and was a gifted player. Joe Pass was simply one of the most fluent and masterful guitarists in the music's history. There are aspects of his style and sound that prevent me from choosing him as a personal favorite, but observing what he did with a guitar in his hands (no matter the setting, from solo performance to ensemble playing) is enough to make anyone think twice about continuing to play (or take up) the guitar. Speaking of personal favorites, these guitar threads always seem to give me the impression that Barney Kessel (though obviously one of the most important and accomplished players of all time) is not all that popular with a lot of people. IMO, he ranks very very high in terms of achievement and influence. He also happens to be one of my favorites, but I think the quality of his work declined as years went on (unlike Burrell, Pass, Farlow, Raney, and others). At his best, I think he may inspire me more than any other player (his instructional video is very inspiring and enjoyable too). To think how many years he has been silent now due to his stroke... it's very sad. What a great career. I'm listening to "The Real Howard Roberts" right now. He and Ray Brown should have done more stuff together. This may be my favorite version of "Darn That Dream". When I was a kid, playing Led Zeppelin and MC5 covers, I was also listening to Herb Ellis, Barney Kessel and Howard Roberts. However, my playing was probably more influenced by Wayne Kramer and Jimmy Page. I've always prided (fooled) myself about having a style that was totally my own. About 10- 12 years ago I did a studio gig where I was to record three songs. One classical guitar piece, one "rock flavored blues" and one heavy metal. All but the classical piece were totally improvised and it was just me, a strat, a borrowed p-bass and a drum machine. After recording the blues piece the engineer commented that I "really got that Carlos Santana thing down." I was devistated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim R Posted May 2, 2004 Report Share Posted May 2, 2004 Jim, Are you a fan of Barry Galbraith? He also didn't do as much as a leader, but his playing is often fascinating. Yeah, although like Roberts, I wish there had been more recordings that really featured his playing. Galbraith has a great reputation among his fellow-guitarists, and it's hard not to respect somebody like that from all the glowing reports you read, but so often his work was part of a large ensemble or orchestra and difficult to really appreciate (kind of the way I've always felt about Freddie Green). Anyway, he was pretty prolific as a session player, and appears on quite a few recordings in my collection- from vocalists (Billie Holiday, Sarah Vaughan, Anita O'day, Carmen McRae, Dinah Washington, Helen Merrill, Johnny Hartman, Eddie Jefferson and Joe Williams) to orchestras/large ensembles with Claude Thornhill, Jimmy Cleveland, Cannonball, Art Farmer, J.J., Michel Legrand, Johnny Griffin, Curtis Fuller, Stanley T; to smaller groups (Tal Farlow, Coleman Hawkins, Kenny Burrell, Hank Jones, Milt Jackson, John Lewis...). Pretty impressive list of credits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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