mmilovan Posted March 26, 2005 Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) About a week or so, I've had unusual experience discovering one fantastic alto player named Hilton Jefferson. I listened to some King Oliver's records and I was surprised by Jefferson's playing on Dec. 30, 1929. (the title "New Orleans Shout") so much. His solo on this recording is so well constructed, so cleverly executed, so brilliant - that it simply unbelievable! Only few players from that time can compare Jefferson, and those probably includes Johnny Hodges and Benny Carter. But Jefferson was so fluent and convincing in his playing - it's a pitty people don't recognize him as one of them pioneers on alto. Later (with so much help from you) I traced Jefferson career - he played with all of them greats: Fletcher Henderson in 1934., Cab Calloway (around 1942.), Dizzy, Chick Webb (in 1938-39) Got to hear more Jefferson! Edited March 26, 2005 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted March 26, 2005 Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 Late in his career he played on a couple of "Swingville All Stars" dates for Prestige. One of them is hidden on this cd: Very worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 (edited) Hey Chuck, how does Hilton "sounds" to you, here? (it is interesting to know that Taft Jordan was in same, Chick Webb's band at the same time with Jefferson) Edited March 27, 2005 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 He sounds wonderful. Isn't there a site where you can get samples? I never check samples, but All Music or Fantasy must have some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 there is a very fine version of Round Midnight, featuring Jefferson, on the Fletcher Henderson Allstars CD/Ld (from 1957 or so); he also takes many fine solos with the 1930s Fletcher Henderson band. He was a fine player, played with a more-modern sounding tone than many alto players of the day, les florid than Johnny Hodges, a little more down-to earth than Benny Carter. There's quite a few older alto players who never get enough credit from those days but who were great soloists - Pete Brown, Earl Warren, George Johnson, Rudy Williams - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 Check out Jefferson's solo on the Claude Hopkins Band's "Just As Long As the World Goes Round and Round" from 1935 (available on a HEP CD, "The Transcription Performances"). On the other hand, as lovely a player as Jefferson was, most of what I know of his solo work sounds like it was pretty much worked up in advance -- a common practice of course, especially in the '30s, but hardly what I'd expect from someone who is being mentioned as a precursor of Bird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 (edited) On the other hand, as lovely a player as Jefferson was, most of what I know of his solo work sounds like it was pretty much worked up in advance Well, are there some evidence in alternate takes to prove this - same solos, phrases or something? Of course, my imression was only, should I say, pejorative - but fluid musical thinking, fast triplets and logical structure was real something to hear on alto in 1929. BTW, listened today to Jefferson playing in Chick Webb orchestra (behind Ella). Not so impressive, but good, solid playing. Edited March 27, 2005 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 We all probably have a recording that awoke us to Hilton Jefferson. Mine, the Harry Lim Keynote recording of "Just like a Butterfly" with Jonah Jones. I still think the tone he achieves is the most startlingly beautiful Alto sound ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 the planning of solos was, I think, quite common in the swing era - listen to a lot of Duke's studio stuff and broadcast recordings - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 We all probably have a recording that awoke us to Hilton Jefferson. Mine, the Harry Lim Keynote recording of "Just like a Butterfly" with Jonah Jones. I still think the tone he achieves is the most startlingly beautiful Alto sound ever. Got to check if I have that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 (edited) the planning of solos was, I think, quite common in the swing era - listen to a lot of Duke's studio stuff and broadcast recordings - Yes, and alternates, too! And, for example, Ben Webster on "C Jamm Blues", played the same role over and over again, on broadcasts, live concerts and studio dates... This is not to dismiss Frog, whom I like so much, just to notice one fact. Edited March 27, 2005 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 "Well, are there some evidence in alternate takes to prove this - same solos, phrases or something?" No evidence of that sort, at least none that I have. I'm just going on subjective impressions, plus comparison with other fluent altoists of the time, e.g. Charlie Holmes with Luis Russell on "Doctor Blues," "Saratoga Shout," and lots of other Russell titles and Benny Carter with the Chocolate Dandies ("Six or Seven Times") and McKinney's Cotton Pickers ("I'd Love It") -- all from 1929-30. To me, both Holmes and Carter sound more spontaneous than Jefferson. On the other hand, if Jefferson's approach is more "studied" than than theirs, I think that was Jefferson's choice rather than an aesthetic flaw. BTW, if you want to hear what a really spontaneous, "hot" saxophone soloist sounded like at that time, check out Coleman Hawkins on Fletcher Henderson's "Chinatown, My Chinatown" (1930). My God! Also, don't miss J.C. Higginbotham on the Russell sides. What a band that was! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 HIGGINBOTHAM! A giant and one of my favorites - interesting piece of trivia, courtesy of Roswell Rudd, and something that surprised me a bit - Rudd told me that Higginbotham was extremely well versed in the classical literature, and played transcriptions of classical pieces (Bach, etc) to warm up - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BERIGAN Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 (edited) About a week or so, I've had unusual experience discovering one fantastic alto player named Hilton Jefferson. I listened to some King Oliver's records and I was surprised by Jefferson's playing on Dec. 30, 1929. (the title "New Orleans Shout") so much. His solo on this recording is so well constructed, so cleverly executed, so brilliant - that it simply unbelievable! Only few players from that time can compare Jefferson, and those probably includes Johnny Hodges and Benny Carter. But Jefferson was so fluent and convincing in his playing - it's a pitty people don't recognize him as one of them pioneers on alto. Later (with so much help from you) I traced Jefferson career - he played with all of them greats: Fletcher Henderson in 1934., Cab Calloway (around 1942.), Dizzy, Chick Webb (in 1938-39) Got to hear more Jefferson! Interesting, I don't know the name, but must have some of his work on cd, will have to dig!!!! I think you can toss Jimmy Dorsey in the group you mentioned in that timeframe... Edited March 28, 2005 by BERIGAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BERIGAN Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 HIGGINBOTHAM! A giant and one of my favorites - interesting piece of trivia, courtesy of Roswell Rudd, and something that surprised me a bit - Rudd told me that Higginbotham was extremely well versed in the classical literature, and played transcriptions of classical pieces (Bach, etc) to warm up - I've read that Coleman Hawkins perferred classical music to listen to away from work...who else have you heard was into classical music??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 I am another Jefferson admirer. Believe it or not, he plays some might fine obbligatos on this recording: http://www.bagatellen.com/archives/row/000649.html http://tinyurl.com/548hl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kh1958 Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Didn't he play with Ellington also for at least a little while? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Yes, 1952 ot 1953 or thereabouts I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 I think he's on some of the Capitols - Johnny Hodges had left the band for a while - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 (edited) Didn't he play with Ellington also for at least a little while? This is question for our friend Agustin! Edited March 28, 2005 by mmilovan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmilovan Posted March 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 I've read that Coleman Hawkins perferred classical music to listen to away from work...who else have you heard was into classical music??? Bird, I think... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKE BBB Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Didn't he play with Ellington also for at least a little while? He joined the band on April 1, 1952 as a replacement for Willie Smith and the last date where he appears on is February 25, 1953 (Apollo Theatre). There´s only one solo contribution from Jefferson on the issued recordings by the 1952 Ellington band, on the long version of "The mooche" (Ellington uptown). [sources: Timner & Lambert] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 (edited) I've played with Hilton Jefferson. Really! That's not the original cover, btw. Hear samples here: http://www.musicminusone.com/Main/Details.asp?AlbumID=744#ac Edited March 28, 2005 by JSngry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Yeah but that means you've performed with Bob Wilber too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 George Duvivier, as well. But hell, who hasn't played with George Duvivier? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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