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BFT 41, CD 2

Tom Storer

By Tom Storer
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Tom Storer Newbie

Tom Storer

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OK, folks, here's the thread to discuss BFT 41, CD 2. Tomorrow it will have been one week since I sent out the packages, and the European recipients began to report before the week's end that they had received them. I'm thinking the North American, Russian, and Singaporean residents will have them in hand within the next couple of days if they don't have them already. Better early than late, so here goes!

Roughly 75% of the items on the two discs are from bittorrent boots, so Dimeadozen addicts may have the upper hand. There's no special theme. There are two or three freebies, and a bunch of individual musicians whom I suspect will be quickly spotted; it may not be the most challenging BFT, but I hope you'll like the music and the way it flows.

My only request is that if you know for certain what an item is, you don't spill the beans--link to AMG or something instead.

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king ubu Rookie

king ubu

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#1 Another Monk tune... apeing Monks or monking apes? :g

Some french deconstructivists taking apar... plenty of fun, for sure!

#2 Huh? Corny synth? That's a contemporary take on the corny sax w/singers or strings track we had on the last BFT, I assume... sax is alright, but this is definitely not my cup of tea, sorry. Not that there's anything totally wrong with it, but it's just that I don't like the sound of it. Is that Toots? Hm, as it continues, it grows to me... some radio big band project? Vince Mendonza? The tune is very familiar, but I can't pin it down...

#3 Hm, I guess after the last one I'm sort of prepared for more moody stuf... but I like this one a lot better. Trumpet is nice, and so is what follows! Gil Evans Orchestra in the 80s? Just a very rough guess... guitar sounds a bit like Sco...

#4 Nice! I like the fact that there's so much space between what the pianist is playing.

#5 Delilah! Love that tune! Favourite versions include the Roach/Brown and Lateef's (with the great Richard Williams) from "Live at Pep's Vol. 2". Very nice how organ and flute fit together. Great one!

#6 Old-fashioned ballad playing... but not that old a recording, I think. Nice tenor sound, but probably not one of my favourite players... out of the Hawk tradition, most obviously... the band is alright, giving good support, but noch much more... could this be Houston Person or a similar player?

#7 Brubeck's "In Your Own Sweet Way" - very nice tune! Hm, could this be the Kirk Lightsey/Ricky Ford band? Nice one, very warm music - don't know how to put it better, but this really let's me in... pity it just cuts off!

#8 What's this one again? I'll let Mike pin the tune down. A nice change of pace after the wacky tenor of the preceding track, this is soothing. Very laidback phrasing from the tenor, and then that swaggery vibrato just before the quote of another tune I can't pin (a short moment that reminds me of Dexter, but it's much too mellow for him, soundwise). Nice how the bassist takes up the same quote again.

#9 Lovely closer, but I'm clueless once more...

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The Magnificent Goldberg Newbie

The Magnificent Goldberg

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More live stuff! A good idea. Means we can't cheat and listen to samples on AMG. :D

So here we go!

1 Pianist starts a bit like Ray Charles; vibes player a bit like Milt Jackson. Wow! This is FUNKEEEEE! And great fun! I can’t imagine who these guys are! And I don’t care! What a smiley recording! What a laughing recording! I wish I’d been there! I suspect this performance might not be typical of either musician. Wonder if it’s Milt & Monk live.

2 Electric stuff then big band. Nice pop sound. Sounds like it could have been a hit in the ‘70s or early ‘80s. Sax player reminds me of Grover Washington Jr. Goes on a bit. Oh, it’s live!

3 Another electric piano start. Big band. Flute. Trumpet. Think I can safely make a cup of tea while this is on. Tenor solo, guitar solo. I don’t quite know what motivates people to make this kind of music; it’s clearly not commercial. So how you could get enough people to a gig to pay all these musicians I can’t guess. It’s all rather OTT. Even the effin’ tambourine player’s OTT.

4 Nice bluesy piano, bass, drums trio. “Melancholy baby”. This sounds like a studio recording. I could listen to this stuff all day. Sometimes I do.

5 Surely it’s Fathead. A Clifford Brown tune; “Delilah”. Who’s on organ? Not a B3, by the sound of it. Best guess here is it could be a pianist who doesn’t normally play organ. If this is late ‘80s, it could be Kirk Lightsey, who was with David at that time.

6 Nice tenor player. Very breathy. But modern, not Ben Webster vintage. Not even Stanley Turrentine vintage. Nice ballad, though I don’t recognise it; perhaps an original. I like this but I really think I’d like it more if I knew the tune. I always think ballads are supposed to mean more than just music.

7 I know this tune. Not remembering the title was annoying me so much, I had to stop the record and go outside for a ciggy. Now I’m back, I think it’s “Central Park West”, but I’ve just played the start of Pharoah’s version and I’m not sure. I’ve got another version of this song which sounds rhythmically much more like this performance, but I can’t think what it is. Oh well, here goes again. In comes the tenor player and it sounds a good bit like Pharoah! But only sometimes. Actually, he’s got a slightly bigger sound than Pharoah. And he doesn’t engage in Pharoah’s flights of sublime lyricism. So I don’t think I know this guy, though I want to. I wonder what was going on at about 9:00 – big cheers from the audience as he leaned back and split his trousers?

OK, I’m going to guess that it IS Pharoah, with John Hicks and possibly Idris. But it may be wishful thinking. Ah, cut off to conceal the announcement.

8 Dex? Another well known tune I can’t remember the title to. A lovely performance. Oh no, that CAN’T be Dex at the end.

9 Singing bass player plus piano & flugelhorn? A very charming performance. Nice flu solo. I can’t hear drums. The trio swings quite well enough thank you. Nice piano solo, too. Something here is saying – this is what jazz is all about. Is the bass player European?

Splendid compilation, Tom. Mucho interest and enjoyment. Thank you very much.

MG

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Nate Dorward Newbie

Nate Dorward

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1. A Monk blues ("Blues Five Spot" I think) for piano & vibes. The Penguin Guide always natters on about how piano/vibes duos inherently don’t work, for reasons that escape me. I often get the feeling that Monk tunes encourage mainstream players to be deliberately “spacy”, & I can’t quite figure out the angle of these musicians on the tune here -- they seem to be deliberately silly/scatterbrained at points (not least the mugging for the audience) -- but I think it’s still relatively “mainstream”, not the Dada hijinks of the Amsterdam guys e.g. I don’t know, there are plenty of nice bits but I just wished it would settle in one place/groove/attitude for more than a chorus.

2. Seven minutes of my life I want back, Tom. :)

3. More time for this one (though I don’t like the heavily Milesian trumpet) but still not doing all that much for me. & it’s twice as long as the previous track! Agh! I just find it really hokey & predictable when this chart reaches for moments of intensity. Hm, could be Billy Harper on tenor. There seems to be a strong effort here to pay homage to the Miles/Evans collabs, though I don’t think it’s latterday Evans. Hm, the chords under the guitar solo are heavily George Russellish. Yeah, bingo! This is definitely latterday Russell. I haven’t heard the stuff in between the Riversides & Deccas and the 1980s Blue Notes, but it presumably fits in there. Truthfully, I think Russell is one of the saddest declines in jazz (the recent 80th b.day concert was painful) & this isn’t making me change my mind. This would also fit in with the links to Miles & Gil as much of Russell’s later work seems to be chewing over their work endlessly (esp. the clunky "So What" chart he keeps digging out). Characteristically long-winded too.

4. Dig that touch and that time. One of the old guys at the piano, surely, with a few nifty little passing chords skating over the surface of the tune. I don’t recognize the tune -- is it a half-tempo "I'm Going to Buy Myself a Paper Doll"? This is one nice way to treat a tune -- like a cobweb you’re spinning but don’t want to break.

5: “Delilah” for flute & organ. The flute's fine, but the organ solo's the bit I liked.

6: Great stuff, & I probably should know these guys. I initially thought it might be Getz but it’s a little too robust for him I think.

7: “In Your Own Sweet Way”, with a quirky little piano intro. I think someone’s maybe having too MUCH fun here – I kept wishing for a more straightforward approach, less cat and mouse. Anyway, once it hits the bridge of the tune it goes into a Herbie Hancock modal thing instead. I like the tenor though for the openly rhapsodic approach. I wonder how these guys hooked up – just seems such an unlikely combo of saxophonist with this pianist, do they really regularly play together? Hm, could actually be Hancock on the piano I suppose, in a very strange mood though. Pity the whole thing just stops in midstream.

8: “Darn that Dream” with a really odd pianist there who grabs the ear with those twisted harmonies much more than the OK Lestorian tenor. Maybe if I knew what the tenor guy sounded like in his prime I’d be able to appreciate more what he’s doing now with his evidently very diminished resources.

9: Red Mitchell on bass & vocals? Probably Roger Kellaway on piano. Well, the words at the end are a giveaway! Here ya go: http://www.answers.com/topic/that-was-that

Edited by Nate Dorward
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Durium Newbie

Durium

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Some thoughts about the second CD:

1. Jean-Michel Pilc?

2. I don't like this kind of stuff. It's from the 1980s. It remembers me to music like Joe Zawinul and Miles Davis in his experimental period.

5. Flute. I don't like flute played this way.

I like most of the other tracks, but I find it difficult to label the artist. I'm anxious to read the comments from my fellow listmates.

Keep swinging

Durium

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JSngry Grand Master

JSngry

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Posted

Been up all night & am beginning to fade, so replies will likely be brief. Let's go!

TRACK ONE - Cute. I'm not too much of a fan of cute, but I guess this is ok. We all need to goof every once in a while. And this is a quite intelligent goof, so hey. Go for it! The less cute it gets, the better I like it. And the pianist is a really good straight man/woman. A lost art, that's becoming. Oh hell - I like it! But in spite of, not because of, the cute.

TRACK TWO - Well, Zawinul's said that he wrote this as a throwback to the big-band ballad features, and indeed, I'd like to throw this one back. :g

Seriously, it's a great tune (really, it is), but part of the beauty of the original was the orchestration, the colors & textures that Joe got out of his synths. Thos are colors & textures that you can't get out of accoustic instruments, so if you're going to do something like this, you better think long and hard about that. Or not. But I would.

And there's no Wayne here. There is an alto. I'd really think long and hard about that. Or, again, not. But...

No knocks against the sincerity of intent or of execution. None whatsoever. I feel it in abundance. It just doesn't stir any empathy in me. But it's a beautiful tune anyway, so points for that. I will say this though - I think Joe mentioned his days in Maynard's band as a specific inspiration for the composition, and this definitely has a Maynard feel to it in a lot of the ensembles. So maybe it's all good that way. Or not.

TRACK THREE - This is good, this has flavor. And color. What it doesn't have is a pacing that insinuates itself into my mental emotional rhytms. But that's not their problem. That tenor solo, otoh, just might be... And that guitar solo definitely is (and so's the backing to it).

They could've had me. But no. Oh well. But that trumpet player is inviting me back. Maybe. some day. But not now.

TRACK FOUR - C....o....m....e......t.....o....m.........e.....m.........y...... None too shabby. Don't know why, but I'm thinking Oscar Peterson, or somebody of that school. If so, hey - it's good, period. Do it more often! :g

TRACK FIVE - Fathead. he recorded this (on flute) for Atlantic (Head's Up), but this is not that. But hey - Fathead. Always a pleasure. Tasty drummer too.

TRACK SIX - Somebody Ben-ish. Good tune, good playing. Touching without being moving, or vice-versa. You know what I mean. Somebody else who understands the tenor really well. Some of those tonal manipulations and fingerings are not for kids. And that subtone note - perfect. I can feel this one. Maybe not too deeply, but I'm feeling it. Always a good thing, that. Pretty masterful, all things considered.

TRACK SEVEN - In Your Own Sweet Maiden Voyage (One Way), it appears... Just a touch of Jamal, but just a touch...And now, it's time for that crazyass Ricky Ford, that's ho it's time for. Yep, that's Ricky Ford and his crazy ass. If you only knew him as a Dexter clone from back in the day, forget about it. That shit's over and has been. Now he's got a lot of latter-day Sonny in him, as you can hear here. You gotta be crazy to play like that and not go crazy. Tiring after a while, but so what?

TRACK EIGHT - Shepp on his best behavior? No, wait - it's Griff! The upper register tone & the eighth note swing gives it away, as do some/many other idyosyncracies. This sounds pretty latter-day, and Griff sounds aged. No matter. Johnny Griffin is a beautiful soul, and that's what I hear here.

TRACK NINE - Cute again. Once is enough. :g

Thanks again. Much fun!

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JSngry Grand Master

JSngry

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So it's not Griff on #8?

Hmmmm....

Nope.

Are you sure? :g

Seriously, that one's kinda tripping me out, becasue I hear a very strong personality at work, and it's Johnny Griffin's! The beginning sounds like Shepp's articulations, but not for long. Plus, there's a few moments where the lines threaten to go off into Warne-land, but again, not for long. The whole thing sounds like a really mellow (and/or old) Johnny Griffin, and I'm at a loss to think of who else's personality I'm hearing.

The thing is, the guy sounds really well-seasoned (the whole band does, really, the pianist's voice leadings are exquisite), and the vibrato is that of a Chicago player (as is the sound of the upper register). The tone's not Von Freeman's (nor is the phraseology), and if it's not Griff, well...

That note at 2:38... the phrasing from 3:08-3:13...and 3:37-3:40...6:46-6:54...

Are you sure that's not Griff? :g:g:g

I'm perplexed!

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fent99 Newbie

fent99

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1. More vibes and this I quite like. I think I've overdone Monk at the moment but vibes are always good and this is playful enough to be kinda fun

2. Not for me, Like the tune and its not awful but a bit sappy...

3. Interesting textures and pretty likeable, Gil Evans ish?

4. Really nice can't identify though, Great after hours feeling

5. More flute and I quite like this, great organ too

6. Like this too, I like them slow

7. Know the tune but can't recall. (I'm not the oldest on the board I'm sure but my memory is rubbish)

8. Nice and I like this, my kind of thing

9. Lovely too again no idea...

Edited to finish

Great couple of discs with plenty to enjoy (and a couple to not enjoy) and again make me realise that I don't know the music (and musicians) that I have on my shelves already. I'll look forward to the results and the realisation that I have loads of these folks already and much to learn.

Cheers Tom

Edited by fent99
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gnhrtg Newbie

gnhrtg

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Far fewer guesses here. I feel some are musicians I should listen to, at least be able to identify, and the rest, mostly the (near) contemporary guys here, do not play the sort of jazz I listen to much.

DISC 2

-------

1) Blues Five Spot. Would've enjoyed this more had I been in the audience. The pianist is the more interesting musician but I cannot say who they are. Monk's versions, unfair comparison? so be it, are at least as much fun without doing so much to flag it or supposedly being clever. I'm taking the piss out of the guys for being clueless about who they are, sorry.

2) Don't know and not bothered not to.

3) I like the chart more than the solos - the guitar solo 'cause I'm allergic to them so unless they're

remarkably good I'll pass and the trumpet solo because it's a little to derivative (of Miles). I would not

mind listening to this again with two soloists of my choice.

4)

5) Delilah. Not something I would listen to much (with flute and organ) but I duge the groove and it was fun and done well enough not to annoy me.

6) Good tenor player and the pianist provides apt backing. I'm pretty sure I would know the tenor player, at

least, but ye again I do not hear anything that would allow me to identify him (good for him, I suppose). I

like it that they have the maturity (for the sort of music they are playing) to sustain the mood throughout

and not rush things or show off or get clever.

7) In Your OWn Sweet Way. The tenorman works hard at generating heat all right. Not my favorite sort of player, based on his playing here, I sort of go for either more robust or even freer (midway's fine too but then I want to feel he could do either if he so chose). So the piano solo takes a while to get going and never really does even then, actually. Just one more tune and I could tell more firmly whether I'm interested in their music.

8) Darn That Dream. Now these guys are in no hurry either but he must be old-school. I did not mind the bass solo, which does not happen often (and the sax player a short while after he comes in has a go at the bass-players hint-quote at It Might as Well be Spring, in what I thought was an unforced gesture, nice). Pleasant enough.

9) R.Mitchell/J.Allan/R.Kellaway "That Was That" from a late 80's (was it?) concert in Stockholm. I listened to it enough and then deleted it without transferring to discs. Apart from duo/trio tracks the concert includes some solo pieces as well and Red Mitchell had planned to play a solo after R.Kelleway's first solo and but when the tune's over he says something like "Wow...I was going to play a solo piece now but I don't know if I want to anymore...Well, the only song I can think of is 'Mean to Me'".

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paul secor Newbie

paul secor

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Finally had some time to listen to disc 2 - still have to get through disc 1.

Anyway:

1. Monk's "Blues Five Spot" - Have to admit I cheated a little and checked a couple of Monk recordings to come up with the title. I'm the worst when it comes to tune titles.

Clever and it sounded like they were having a good time. I just didn't hear all that much depth to what they were doing.

2. Not my kind of thing at all. The only track I hated to listen to.

3. Again -not my thing. Didn't like the rock influenced rhythm, among other things.

4. Nothing special, at least to my ears. Sounded a bit like the kind of slow groove that Red Garland used to get into on his recordings from the 50's. This sounded later than that. The pianist didn't have the rhythmic feel to make this work completely, at least to my ears. The bassist seemed to be featured and recorded up front. Was it the bassist's date?

5. Liked the flute - strong player. Liked some of the organist's lines and voicings. Wasn't taken by the organist's rhythmic sense.

6. Liked the sax. Sounded so familiar, but I couldn't place him. I'm sure that when I read who it is, I'll feel like a dummy for not recognizing him. This was my favorite track.

7. The saxophonist and the piano can play their instruments, but this was pretty much a waste, to my ears. There are too many late Trane clones out there, and to no purpose. I'll guess Pharoah and John Hicks, but I don't listen to this kind of thing at all, so it could be other people.

8. Another track I liked, but no idea who the saxophonist was. Sounded like an older player influenced by Ben Webster - that breathy tone.

When the track began I thought maybe a subdued Archie Shepp, but I'm sure it's not he. My second favorite track on CD 2.

9. Sounds like some musicians fooling around. The vocalist is one of the worst I've ever heard - is it an instrumentalist goofing? The trumpet just sounded like someone running some lines without being emotionally involved - tho I guess that emotional involvement was not the purpose here. Not one I'll listen to again.

Tom - thanks for tracks 5,6,& 8 - When I find out who was playing, I'm sure I'll want to hear more of them.

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Tom Storer Newbie

Tom Storer

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OK, let me try to get you guessing before I post the answers...

The pianist on CD2, number 1 once recorded with the vibraphonist on CD1, no. 1. And say, have you seen his piano? Neither has he.

The pianist on number 4 is noted for accompanying singers. The bassist has too. In fact, listen to number 4, particularly the bass but also the piano, and free associate to see what singer comes to mind. Sangry ought to get this...

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