Upcoming Dexter bio by Maxine Gordon

[king ubu]

I hope I'll get it for x-mas  

[HutchFan]

I'm about two-thirds of the way through the book. Based on what I've read so far, I'd recommend it wholeheartedly. 

[T.D.]

I leafed through it in a bookshop and consider it well worth reading. But I just bought Paul Combs's Dameronia, so will hold off for a while.

[Brad]

46 minutes ago, T.D. said:

I leafed through it in a bookshop and consider it well worth reading. But I just bought Paul Combs's Dameronia, so will hold off for a while.

How is the Dameron book? Years ago, there was one that was very hard to find and I never did find it; can’t remember the name of the author. The Jazz Times review of the Combs book wasn’t too laudatory on the biographical details but had praise on the musical analysis of his work, which the reviewer said might be too complicated for non musicians to understand. 

[T.D.]

Yes, I also failed to find the Ian MacDonald book. Even contacted Macdonald, but too late, after the book went oop. Don't want to pay the current $86.04 offering at Amazon...

Only about 30 pages in but enjoying Dameronia so far.

I also saw the Jazz Times review, which is pretty accurate. Apparently it's not possible to compile a detailed biography because Dameron was private and left little documentation behind. But there's sufficient material to put together a reasonable biography with some unavoidable holes. Also concur re. the musical analysis, which is somewhat over my head. However, the analysis is blended in with the biographical prose so there aren't lengthy unreadable passages. And I can make a longer-term project out of deciphering the analysis. 

To sum up (prematurely, see above), the book is not everything I as a Dameron fan hoped for (because of the sometimes sketchy details), but I doubt one could do better because of the lack of researchable material (disclaimer: I haven't read MacDonald). One could argue that the musical analysis is essential because of Dameron's reputation as a composer, but it might well intimidate many readers. Still, this is at the front of my reading queue and I expect to finish it over the weekend. And then spend some time researching harmony and musical notation...

[Brad]

Thanks for your impressions. I’m mulling it over even though the musical analysis would be way over my head. 

[Dan Gould]

Words really can't do justice to this book. Get it if you haven't already. 

[T.D.]

I broke down and bought Sophisticated Giant. Just over 100 pages in. Much exceeding expectations, highly recommended!

[mikeweil]

Mine is waiting on the Christmas gifts table .... will take a place on the sofa and start reading as soon as we are done with the ceremony.

[sidewinder]

Got about 10 pages into mine and will resume again tomorrow.

Edited December 23, 2018 by sidewinder

[Bluesnik]

Got it yesterday finally. A signed copy too. And although it is a Christmas present to myself I won't open it until Christmas and probably start reading it still later for I still have a long reading list before.

[Larry Kart]

Hope not to have my throat jumped down for asking this, but does Gordon have much to say in the book about her relationship with Woody Shaw and how her relationship with Dexter evolved while ( I think it was "while") Shaw was the trumpeter in the  group that was put together for Dexter by Cuscuna? Could be I have some facts wrong here, but if not, there would seem to be a story to be told, especially in light of Shaw's eventual demise and the fact that Gordon is the mother of Shaw's son.

[soulpope]

7 minutes ago, Larry Kart said:

Hope not to have my throat jumped down for asking this, but does Gordon have much to say in the book about her relationship with Woody Shaw and how her relationship with Dexter evolved while ( I think it was "while") Shaw was the trumpeter in the  group that was put together for Dexter by Cuscuna? Could be I have some facts wrong here, but if not, there would seem to be a story to be told, especially in light of Shaw's eventual demise and the fact that Gordon is the mother of Shaw's son.

Didn`t know that ....

[Larry Kart]

From Maxine Gordon.com:

"In 1978, Maxine and Woody Shaw became the parents of Woody Louis Armstrong Shaw III. Eventually, Maxine and Woody Shaw (Woody III's father) separated..."

[Brad]

I've only cracked the book but Woody Shaw III does write the afterword. 

[T.D.]

46 minutes ago, Larry Kart said:

Hope not to have my throat jumped down for asking this, but [1] does Gordon have much to say in the book about her relationship with Woody Shaw and how her relationship with Dexter evolved while ( I think it was "while") Shaw was the trumpeter in the  group that was put together for Dexter by Cuscuna? [2] Could be I have some facts wrong here, but if not, there would seem to be a story to be told, especially in light of Shaw's eventual demise and the fact that Gordon is the mother of Shaw's son.

[1] Not that I recall, and I recently completed the book. I'll look again when I get home from work.

[2] Quite possible, but I don't know enough to say more than "that story remains to be written". As mentioned above, Woody III wrote the afterword, which is highly complimentary to Maxine.

Edited December 27, 2018 by T.D.

[Dan Gould]

There is hardly anything about her relationship with Woody nor a lot about whatever transpired that she became intimate with Dex.  

[T.D.]

Larry, it's all vague.

p.10: "...I met ...Woody Shaw and we began a relationship. In 1978...[Woody III] was born...Woody Shaw and I lived together for a short time, but things didn't work out between us and we ended our relationship in 1983. Things had changed for Dexter around his [60th] birthday [2/23/83] that year [1983] when we had a big party at the Village Vanguard. We agreed to end the business relationship, live together, and as he again put it, try to have a 'normal life'."

The later chapter Homecoming is promised to elaborate on "...how I met Dexter and how we planned his return together, opened an office, and began a life together", but furnishes few personal details. There is ample evidence that Dexter and Shaw had a good relationship at least through 1980: "Woody Shaw was the one who got the interest in Dexter's return going" (1975? 1976? p.170); "That was when Woody Shaw stepped in. He told Dexter not to worry; he would get a band for him...Woody and I started a relationship...and were living together by the time Dexter came back in 1976" (p.173); account of Dexter recording Sophisticated Giant with Shaw (1977; p. 183); Woody III born (10/12/78; p. 185); account of Dexter recording Gotham City with Shaw (1980; p. 186); reprise of the 2/23/83 birthday party decision (p. 188).

Basically nothing on how/why the Shaw relationship ended and how the Dexter relationship moved from business to personal. Maxine must have moved in with Dexter very shortly after ending the relationship with Shaw, so I am inclined to agree with you that there's a story to be told. But Sophisticated Giant doesn't tell that particular story...I still like the book, though.

Edited December 28, 2018 by T.D.

[Larry Kart]

4 hours ago, Dan Gould said:

There is hardly anything about her relationship with Woody nor a lot about whatever transpired that she became intimate with Dex.  

Thanks for the reports, Dan and T.D.

 

[Gheorghe]

I had the same thoughts about the relationships, that I couldn´t find no answer.

Besides that, she tells that Dexter stopped playing right after his 60th Birthday. There is a record of the music Dexter played on his birthday party and though he had lost some of his power, he still has some to play. But I must admit the Dexter we saw in Europe early in 1983 left us a bit embarrassed and wondering how long he will go on, mostly because he was evidently almost destroyed by booze. He had difficulties even to make stage announcements.......

And another book about Dexter, written by Stan Britt tells another story, that Dexter still played until in 1984 when he became ill in Finland where he played with a radio orchestra. And that after that the quartet together with Maxine Gordon made a trip to Marocco, where the didn´t get paid and had to fly home on own expenses. This might be important first hand infos from Maxine but in her book it seems that Dexter just retired because he wanted to retire.....

[jcam_44]

I'm a little more than 100 pages in. The timeline jumps around and there is an ample amount of repeating in all chapters thus far. Still a worthy read. Maxine interjects personal proclamations that I could live without but it is a fascinating read regardless. Crazy how much of the scene Dexter lived in overlapped with the scene Horace Tapscott fostered in. Connected by a band director in high school.

 

[Brad]

On 12/9/2018 at 6:49 AM, Dan Gould said:

Toward the end of the chapter on the 1950s now - about 40% of the way thru I'd say.  Writing is workmanlike/functional but info/insight is indispensable.  If I had more time for reading I'd be thru the book a couple of weeks ago.

I’ve read the first few chapters and “workmanlike” is probably the best word for describing her writing.  She throws in a lot of detail, some of which are unnecessary and detract from the story.  The writing sometimes seems to read as a recitation of facts but without insight; and there seems to be a lack of cohesion. The more interesting parts are what Dexter wrote. In the hands of a professional writer, this could have been a far better book. 

[Dan Gould]

I'd say there's much more insight as it goes on ...

[jcam_44]

7 hours ago, Dan Gould said:

I'd say there's much more insight as it goes on ...

I finished it this morning. More insightful as you go... a little I suppose. There is a lot of “I believe” or “in my opinion” which I personally don’t consider insight. And per this book Dexter loved every drummer he played with. Haha. It was a good read, the last couple chapters the best which makes sense since Maxine was present. Worth picking up, but will pass on instead of keeping for a reread. 

[Gheorghe]

14 hours ago, Brad said:

I’ve read the first few chapters and “workmanlike” is probably the best word for describing her writing.  She throws in a lot of detail, some of which are unnecessary and detract from the story.  The writing sometimes seems to read as a recitation of facts but without insight; and there seems to be a lack of cohesion. The more interesting parts are what Dexter wrote. In the hands of a professional writer, this could have been a far better book. 

I didn´t know until now what is "workmanlike" writing, but I can imagine what you mean. Somehow very often the writing lacks emotion. I hoped there will be told much more from the personal way of it, since it´s supposed she was his last wife. No word about this, how the professional relation changed into a personal relation, how it was to change husbands, from an erratic Woody Shaw to a super erratic Dexter Gordon plus raising Woody´s child . She mentiones that Dexter took antabuse before returning to the States to keep off drinking, but I don´t think that it helped for much time.
By the way, I saw both Woody and Dexter on the same schedule about a month before Dexter´s 60´s birthday, and Woody was really takin care of business and played an exiting set with his great group and was very articulate, while Dexter was late, played only three tunes, sounded weak  and was stone drunk. I heard about other incidents from that early 1983 tour from other countries too (Germany, Netherlands).

Nothing mentioned in the book about that tour.