Trying to help out Mosaic by suggesting sets

[JSngry]

I already have a job, thanks. I'm here to be sold to, not to sell 

That part is not complicated. 

[scooter_phx]

12 hours ago, medjuck said:

 Mosaic is obviously pretty much a one man operation without a lot of resources nowadays.  If you think you can do better, do it.  They're not beyond criticism but they don't owe us anything except value for our money which I think I get. If you're not interested in what they're releasing don't buy it.  If there are collections you'd like to see that they don't want to do, do it yourself.   Scott would probably be willing to give advice. 

I was involved in the beginnings of the Criterion Collection (my wife named it).  Bob & Aleen Stein knew about Laser Discs and I  knew about films. We had no money and few connections but we kept at it.  (I can't take any credit for its eventual  success--  by the time it issued its first discs I was busy with other things.). 

I'm serious.   Many of  us have seem to have enough free time to spend it here kvetching about Mosaic.  Log off and get to work. 

 

Wow.  This is a little harsh for my taste.  I hope you have a better day.  Blessings.

[gmonahan]

I'm not a kvetcher. Too hard on the knees. Always been more at home way out in left field.........

[Dub Modal]

At worst it’s kvetching. 
 

At best it’s providing some customer input to a business, basically an aspect of market research. 
 

Truth is probably somewhere in between, but I’d hedge on the positive. 

[Rooster_Ties]

What I’d like, is for someone more knowledgeable than me on the subject (Jim?) to actually contact Scott about there being a real interest around these parts in a Bill Barron set.

Seriously — but I’m not the one to do it (I’m a Bill Barron neophyte, and only know him from a couple Ted Curson dates).

It’s a big running gag around here, but has anyone here actually reached out to them about the idea? I’d pre-order one in a heartbeat, and I’m sure others would too.

[T.D.]

1 hour ago, Rooster_Ties said:

What I’d like, is for someone more knowledgeable than me on the subject (Jim?) to actually contact Scott about there being a real interest around these parts in a Bill Barron set.

Seriously — but I’m not the one to do it (I’m a Bill Barron neophyte, and only know him from a couple Ted Curson dates).

It’s a big running gag around here, but has anyone here actually reached out to them about the idea? I’d pre-order one in a heartbeat, and I’m sure others would too.

IIRC from old posts, Michael Cuscuna was contacted quite a while ago. I'm too lazy to research, but hazily recall the response as being along the lines of "interesting, but...".

That's a Mosaic I'd preorder, but I think the chances of it happening are negligible. My subjective probability of the event {Mosaic issues Bill Barron set}, rounded to two decimal places, is 0.

Edited July 8, 2022 by T.D.

[JSngry]

I believe the response was to the effect of "interesting, but nothing past the Savoy records, and that's not enough...".

But now that they've apparently just rolled the dice on actual copyright holders no longer being alive with the new Black & White set, I think you can add the Dauntless & Audio Fidelity material, and surely a deal can be made for the Muse material.

As far as reaching out to Scott, no. I say this with full respect - it's not in his wheelhouse. If it is, sorry, but I see no indication otherwise.

I would posit that Kenny Barron might be an invaluable asset here, but I don't run a reissue label, nor do I have any intention of doing so. But if I did, or was going to, I would start by making a connection there and establishing good faith before proceeding.

FWIW, there's been a few posthumous/archival releases, a few on recognizable labels, a few not so much. So...I have to think that there's a deal to be made on the right terms. What those terms are, I have no idea. Like I said, I already have a job.

[clifford_thornton]

I'd buy a Barron set in a heartbeat. Never had that Joken CD.

[mjzee]

6 minutes ago, clifford_thornton said:

I'd buy a Barron set in a heartbeat. Never had that Joken CD.

It's not hard to find.  I bought it from Dusty Groove in March.  And it is excellent.

[ghost of miles]

Someone has probably already mentioned what I’m about to suggest, but has Mosaic ever considered putting out a worthy-but-commercially-risky set underwritten by a wealthy jazz-loving patron, or even a Kickstarter-type fundraiser? God knows I wish I had the money to go to Mosaic and say, “Here’s 50 grand for a Bill Barron set.” I know these sets require a lot of labor as well, and MC and Scott, like the rest of us, ain’t getting any younger. But at least it would remove or alleviate the risk of a set not selling well enough to sustain the company. I’m a big fan of the Library of America book series, and numerous volumes of theirs have been funded in part by patrons. Not suggesting that Mosaic “sell out” or compromise its integrity (“Here’s a gazillion, now gimme a Kenny G Complete Arista Studio Recordings box!” ); they could reject any such offered projects. Just trying to think of how to put in play sets that would fit their mission/brand but would otherwise be considered fiscally untenable.

OTOH all things must pass and all that jazz, and nearly 40 years on it’s amazing to me that Mosaic’s still up and running. I can’t really see it continuing once Michael and/or Scott step away, though, and that day’s surely coming in the next few years. I don’t know either well enough to have any sense of their thinking in that regard, but there doesn’t seem to be anybody in line to pass the torch to—unless Zev Feldman wanted to somehow try to take it on.  Still, if Mosaic suddenly ceased today it would leave behind an incredible legacy. In the meantime, greatly enjoying the Black and White set… and wondering if an “angel” could bring us a Bill Barron box some day!
 

 

Edited July 19, 2022 by ghost of miles

[colinmce]

Really only a matter of "when", no longer "if". I am not seeing a future for older jazz music on CD pretty much across the spectrum. We're a good 95% depleted from 20 years ago, and I think in the next 10 we'll be down another 95 on that remaining 5%. 

[Dub Modal]

Which is a shame because streaming platforms don’t cater to older music like this. Sifting through digital catalogs can be difficult, while physical media is a bit easier to track. 

[JSngry]

All them Boyd Raeburn airshots. 

[ghost of miles]

11 minutes ago, JSngry said:

All them Boyd Raeburn airshots. 

  ... or any kind of Raeburn mid-to-late 1940s box, actually.  I have a lot of that material, scattered across Hep and Savoy and other reissues, but it could definitely stand a nicely-curated box-set treatment.  

[Eric]

On 7/19/2022 at 1:25 PM, colinmce said:

Really only a matter of "when", no longer "if". I am not seeing a future for older jazz music on CD pretty much across the spectrum. We're a good 95% depleted from 20 years ago, and I think in the next 10 we'll be down another 95 on that remaining 5%. 

Hi there - not sure I know what you mean by “95% depleted”?  Thanks

[JSngry]

59 minutes ago, ghost of miles said:

  ... or any kind of Raeburn mid-to-late 1940s box, actually.  I have a lot of that material, scattered across Hep and Savoy and other reissues, but it could definitely stand a nicely-curated box-set treatment.  

I like all that, but there's even more, supposedly.  And that band was together, and they swung. Of the white bands who were interested in "modern", Kenton never came close, and Woody was not there until later. 

If Raeburn's son is still alive, hey. 

[medjuck]

On 7/8/2022 at 0:20 PM, JSngry said:

.But now that they've apparently just rolled the dice on actual copyright holders no longer being alive with the new Black & White set, 

They tracked the ownership to a large corporation who denied ownership and was willing to write a letter saying so. 

2 hours ago, JSngry said:

 If Raeburn's son is still alive, hey. 

I believe he is. 

[JSngry]

39 minutes ago, medjuck said:

They tracked the ownership to a large corporation who denied ownership and was willing to write a letter saying so. 

Pickwick? 

[medjuck]

This goes against the trend here but how about a remastered collection of Pops's Okeh material?  To make it manageable they might leave out the Hot 5s and 7s as well as his work as an accompanist.  In the meantime: what is the best sounding source for this material on cd?

[John L]

On 7/25/2022 at 0:42 PM, medjuck said:

This goes against the trend here but how about a remastered collection of Pops's Okeh material?  To make it manageable they might leave out the Hot 5s and 7s as well as his work as an accompanist.  In the meantime: what is the best sounding source for this material on cd?

That would make a very nice Mosaic:  The Louis Armstrong Okeh recordings: 1929-1932.  The 3 discs on JSP remastered by J.R. Davies are the best sounding current source on CD.  But there are some missing alternates and other tracks that can be found on the various Columbia releases.  The whole thing would fit nicely on 4 CDs.  If they could include the RCA recordings from 1932-1933, it would be 6 discs.  One disc could also have the historic 1933-1934 European concerts.  Such a 7 disc set would be the perfect complete interval between the Hot 5s and the Decca recordings already packaged by Mosaic.  It would also include consistently great music, some of the best ever recorded. 

Edited July 26, 2022 by John L

[Late]

On 3/14/2019 at 8:18 PM, John L said:

We discussed this before, but I think that the ultimate Mosaic set at this point would be Warne Marsh: The Revelation Recordings. This would be Non Plus Ultra plus about 6 more CDs of still unissued professional recordings made around the same time.

Listening to Ne Plus Ultra as I type. A Marsh Revelation Mosaic somehow seems more do-able than a Bill Barron. I'd buy both.

If Mosaic is going to release Blue Note sets for Hank Mobley, Joe Henderson, and Freddie Hubbard ... why not put out a Wayne Shorter Blue Note set? That one would actually have some previously unissued material.

[romualdo]

7 hours ago, Late said:

Listening to Ne Plus Ultra as I type. A Marsh Revelation Mosaic somehow seems more do-able than a Bill Barron. I'd buy both.

Definitely second that (and the Barron)

[Rooster_Ties]

1 hour ago, romualdo said:

Definitely second that (and the Barron)

I’d buy both too!!

[clifford_thornton]

On 7/26/2022 at 10:15 PM, John L said:

That would make a very nice Mosaic:  The Louis Armstrong Okeh recordings: 1929-1932.  The 3 discs on JSP remastered by J.R. Davies are the best sounding current source on CD.  But there are some missing alternates and other tracks that can be found on the various Columbia releases.  The whole thing would fit nicely on 4 CDs.  If they could include the RCA recordings from 1932-1933, it would be 6 discs.  One disc could also have the historic 1933-1934 European concerts.  Such a 7 disc set would be the perfect complete interval between the Hot 5s and the Decca recordings already packaged by Mosaic.  It would also include consistently great music, some of the best ever recorded. 

I would buy this in a heartbeat. There's so much music there that I have only passing familiarity with.

[Dan Gould]

On 7/19/2022 at 11:53 AM, ghost of miles said:

Someone has probably already mentioned what I’m about to suggest, but has Mosaic ever considered putting out a worthy-but-commercially-risky set underwritten by a wealthy jazz-loving patron, or even a Kickstarter-type fundraiser? God knows I wish I had the money to go to Mosaic and say, “Here’s 50 grand for a Bill Barron set.” I know these sets require a lot of labor as well, and MC and Scott, like the rest of us, ain’t getting any younger. But at least it would remove or alleviate the risk of a set not selling well enough to sustain the company. I’m a big fan of the Library of America book series, and numerous volumes of theirs have been funded in part by patrons. Not suggesting that Mosaic “sell out” or compromise its integrity (“Here’s a gazillion, now gimme a Kenny G Complete Arista Studio Recordings box!” ); they could reject any such offered projects. Just trying to think of how to put in play sets that would fit their mission/brand but would otherwise be considered fiscally untenable.

 

 

Were we to win a substantial lottery award, I have daydreamed about underwriting, in this order:

Some sort of Percy France set - Complete Allen Lowe Sessions or ideally the Allen Lowe-Town Crier recordings all of which are in excellent sound and showcase Percy with the added bonus of Buddy Tate on one of the Town Crier recordings.

Complete Unissued Blue Note Recordings by the Three Sounds

Bill Barron