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On The Corner and the Critics


Rabshakeh
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On The Corner is not perfect - it can be repetitive and a bit clunky.  BUT, I find it to be a fun, fascinating listen.  Great headphones album.  This was not some poppy sell-out record. I am a huge fan of Remain In Light by the Talking Heads and find some similarities - they both have this dense mix of underbrush that is a blast to listen to.

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5 hours ago, JSngry said:

Not every record of every music is meant for every audience. There are some things that if you don't get them, maybe they are not meant for you.

That should be ok.

Nudge nudge, wink wink, say no more. 

10 hours ago, clifford_thornton said:

people are still coming to terms with Cecil Taylor, Bill Dixon, and Albert Ayler so who cares if Miles' electric band takes them a minute as well. Interestingly, talking with Bill and Stephen Haynes helped me to really appreciate Miles' electric music beyond "jazz-rock fusion" and in terms of sound/orchestration, whatever the instrumentation. 

I think 'people' have come to terms with On The Corner a long time ago. 

"Many outside the jazz community later called it an innovative musical statement and forerunner to subsequent funk, jazz, post-punk, electronica and hip hop".

"Despite remaining outside the purview of the mainstream jazz community, On the Corner underwent a positive critical reassessment in subsequent decades; according to Tingen, many critics outside jazz have characterized it as "a visionary musical statement that was way ahead of its time".[14] In 2014, Stereogum hailed it as "one of the greatest records of the 20th Century, and easily one of Miles Davis' most astonishing achievements," noting the album's mix of "funk guitars, Indian percussiondub production techniques, loops that predict hip hop."[17] According to Alternative Press, the "essential masterpiece" envisioned much of modern popular music, "representing the high water mark of [Davis'] experiments in the fusion of rock, funk, electronica and jazz".[21] Fact characterized the album as "a frenetic and punky record, radical in its use of studio technology," adding that "the debt that the modern dance floor owes the pounding abstractions of On the Corner has yet to be fully understood." [29] Writing for The Vinyl Factory, Anton Spice described it as "the great great grandfather of hip-hop, IDMjunglepost-rock and other styles drawing meaning from repetition".

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1 hour ago, robertoart said:

Nudge nudge, wink wink, say no more. 

I think 'people' have come to terms with On The Corner a long time ago. 

"Many outside the jazz community later called it an innovative musical statement and forerunner to subsequent funk, jazz, post-punk, electronica and hip hop".

"Despite remaining outside the purview of the mainstream jazz community, On the Corner underwent a positive critical reassessment in subsequent decades; according to Tingen, many critics outside jazz have characterized it as "a visionary musical statement that was way ahead of its time".[14] In 2014, Stereogum hailed it as "one of the greatest records of the 20th Century, and easily one of Miles Davis' most astonishing achievements," noting the album's mix of "funk guitars, Indian percussiondub production techniques, loops that predict hip hop."[17] According to Alternative Press, the "essential masterpiece" envisioned much of modern popular music, "representing the high water mark of [Davis'] experiments in the fusion of rock, funk, electronica and jazz".[21] Fact characterized the album as "a frenetic and punky record, radical in its use of studio technology," adding that "the debt that the modern dance floor owes the pounding abstractions of On the Corner has yet to be fully understood." [29] Writing for The Vinyl Factory, Anton Spice described it as "the great great grandfather of hip-hop, IDMjunglepost-rock and other styles drawing meaning from repetition".

When I first listened to this album I had a vision of Miles and Sly Stone going deep into this musical jungle and meeting up with Lee Perry. I never thought of it as controversial, but I never read Crouch either. Seems controversial would be saying that these loops and textures met the Mizell’s and formed a tributary to hip hop. I’m probably wrong though. 

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On The Corner came out shortly after I began to listen to so called "jazz", and that must have been about one year later. "On the Concert" was issued and in the record shops and I liked it, though it still had another element in it that the current late 1973 band. In 1972 there was still that kind of "indian element" in it with electric sitar and Badal Roy on tablas, and one year later it got more the concept that remained until late 1975. 
So I got "On the Corner" later than "In Concert" and "Concert" is a kind of live performance of "Corner", but listening to "Corner" AFTER "Concert" I didn´t get that much out of "Corner", but if I would have heard "On the Corner" before, maybe it would have been else.
I rarely listen to records nowadays, first because I got to play myself and don´t have the time to sit down and listen to records, and second because I have it in my head anyway. 

I remember in 1973 the audience still was very splitted. One half of the audience loved it , others would leave disappointed. We kids, well I must admit the first jazz I fell in love with was the stuff like "Milestones" or "Walking", but I was born to become a musician and even if I couldn´t form it into the right words then, I felt that an artist has to develope and you have to respect this. So, we really listened to it and dumb kids we were we categorized people in "hip" and "square" if you know what I mean.....

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  • 1 month later...
On 10/12/2022 at 10:45 AM, clifford_thornton said:

"talking with Bill and Stephen Haynes helped me to really appreciate Miles' electric music beyond "jazz-rock fusion" and in terms of sound/orchestration, whatever the instrumentation."

After years of not looking at Organissmo, I see this. Thanks for calling my name (and Bill's) Clifford. 

Two thoughts:

We can't discuss On The Corner - the sessions or the edited album - without calling up Paul Buckmaster's name and understanding his role/involvement with the project.  Miles had a gift for gathering together players/arrangers all of his life.  OTC is no different.  Dig this: Paul Buckmaster / 2009 Interview.

And can we please - at the risk of causing agitation in the thread - move away from the subjective when engaging with recorded work? We all get to like or dislike music.  I am a fan of the subjective - particularly when I simply do NOT want to talk about someone's work. Can you dig it?  But engaging with the work - doing the work of the listener on whatever level any of us are able/prepared to do - is something else.  That sort of conversation/thread is something useful.  Ideally, we all learn from each other.

Love to you all where/whoever you are/may be.  Keep listening!

Edited by newparadym
typo
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On 10/12/2022 at 3:37 PM, JSngry said:

Not every record of every music is meant for every audience. There are some things that if you don't get them, maybe they are not meant for you.

That should be ok.

One hundred percent.

And yes, Stephen, good point about Buckmaster -- fascinating individual!

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