43.5 million LPs sold in US in 2022

[GA Russell]

https://www.zerohedge.com/technology/vinyl-comeback-continues

Apparently this number does not include the sales of used albums.

The article suggests that most of the digital downloading is for songs rather than albums.

And interestingly, only half of the LP buyers own a turntable.

[Chuck Nessa]

No wonder gas prices went up.

 

[Pim]

11 hours ago, GA Russell said:

And interestingly, only half of the LP buyers own a turntable.

They asked them all individually?

[porcy62]

43 minutes ago, Pim said:

They asked them all individually?

My question too,

[medjuck]

To put it in perspective in 1999 nearly 939 million cds were sold. 

[sonnymax]

16 hours ago, GA Russell said:

https://www.zerohedge.com/technology/vinyl-comeback-continues

Zero Hedge is a far-right libertarian financial blog and news aggregator...Over time, Zero Hedge expanded into non-financial political content, including conspiracy theories and fringe rhetoric advancing radical right, alt-right, and pro-Russia positions. Zero Hedge's non-financial commentary has led to multiple site bans by global social media platforms….

Other Zero Hedge headlines today:

FDA Adviser Says Young And Healthy People Shouldn’t Get Latest COVID Boosters

Wind Farms Eyed In Surge Of Dead Whales On NJ, NY Beaches

COVID Vaccines Are "Obviously Dangerous" And Should Be Halted Immediately, Say Senior Swedish Doctors

[Rabshakeh]

4 hours ago, porcy62 said:

My question too,

 

5 hours ago, Pim said:

They asked them all individually?

The article has come in for quite a bit of criticism.

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, sonnymax said:

COVID Vaccines Are "Obviously Dangerous" And Should Be Halted Immediately, Say Senior Swedish Doctors

I couldn't resist to follow this up because of the Swedish connection. Mostly fake news. Some googling for the one named doctor in that article revealed that he is a doctor of... Theology. 🙄

[JSngry]

1 hour ago, sonnymax said:

Zero Hedge is a far-right libertarian financial blog and news aggregator...Over time, Zero Hedge expanded into non-financial political content, including conspiracy theories and fringe rhetoric advancing radical right, alt-right, and pro-Russia positions. Zero Hedge's non-financial commentary has led to multiple site bans by global social media platforms….

Other Zero Hedge headlines today:

FDA Adviser Says Young And Healthy People Shouldn’t Get Latest COVID Boosters

Wind Farms Eyed In Surge Of Dead Whales On NJ, NY Beaches

COVID Vaccines Are "Obviously Dangerous" And Should Be Halted Immediately, Say Senior Swedish Doctors

Yep. 

[Ken Dryden]

Ted Gioia does some excellent analysis of the "record revival" and how the industry managed to screw things up instead of building a customer base.

https://tedgioia.substack.com/p/did-the-music-business-just-kill?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2

[mikeweil]

4 hours ago, Ken Dryden said:

Ted Gioia does some excellent analysis of the "record revival" and how the industry managed to screw things up instead of building a customer base.

https://tedgioia.substack.com/p/did-the-music-business-just-kill?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2

Excellent indeed. 

[porcy62]

17 hours ago, sonnymax said:

16 hours ago, Ken Dryden said:

Ted Gioia does some excellent analysis of the "record revival" and how the industry managed to screw things up instead of building a customer base.

https://tedgioia.substack.com/p/did-the-music-business-just-kill?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2

Enlightening analysis.

Edited January 15 by porcy62

[Brad]

17 hours ago, Daniel A said:

I couldn't resist to follow this up because of the Swedish connection. Mostly fake news. Some googling for the one named doctor in that article revealed that he is a doctor of... Theology. 🙄

I’m a doctor of laws.  Very shortly, I will give you my opinion of nuclear fission 🤠

[Dan Gould]

17 hours ago, Ken Dryden said:

Ted Gioia does some excellent analysis of the "record revival" and how the industry managed to screw things up instead of building a customer base.

https://tedgioia.substack.com/p/did-the-music-business-just-kill?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2

Sorry not feeling most of his analysis.

1.  What were the record companies supposed to do thru R&D of this "70 year old technology"? The whole point was that it was 70 year old technology that some people had started to think wasn't so bad after all.  What were they going to do, reinvent the CD? 

2.  Owning factories - excuse me but did record companies ever own their own pressing plants?  For vinyl or for CDs???

3. 50% don't own a fucking record player.  They are lucky to get money out of them period.   

4. Anyone notice that he speaks of back catalogs as this great source of revenue and having no artist or production costs, but the biggest sellers are current stars with new recordings?

5. He points out consumers who stream "for pennies" dominate, but thinks if they offered prices at $10, and below costs, the industry would convert them to buying vinyl? Beyond the fact that the price is still hugely more expensive at that price point, how would they convert buyers and overcome the great advantage of streaming:  you can hear it thru your PC or your phone or whatever - but if you have vinyl you can only hear it while sitting in front of your non-existent rig.

I don't care if record companies make money, make a ton of money or turn into a single huge conglomerate.  Vinyl was never going to be some huge part of their business again. Ever.

Edited January 15 by Dan Gould

[mjzee]

54 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

2.  Owning factories - excuse me but did record companies ever own their own pressing plants?  For vinyl or for CDs???

Columbia (and subsequent owner Sony) owned pressing plants in at least Terre Haute, IN, and Camden, NJ; the Terre Haute location pressed LPs, CDs and DVDs.  The Camden plant may have been originally owned by RCA.  Capitol owned at least one pressing plant.

[Д.Д.]

54 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

Sorry not feeling most of his analysis.

1.  What were the record companies supposed to do thru R&D of this "70 year old technology"? The whole point was that it was 70 year old technology that some people had started to think wasn't so bad after all.  What were they going to do, reinvent the CD? 

2.  Owning factories - excuse me but did record companies ever own their own pressing plants?  For vinyl or for CDs???

3. 50% don't own a fucking record player.  They are lucky to get money out of them period.   

4. Anyone notice that he speaks of back catalogs as this great source of revenue and having no artist or production costs, but the biggest sellers are current stars with new recordings?

5. He points out consumers who stream "for pennies" dominate, but thinks if they offered prices at $10, and below costs, the industry would convert them to buying vinyl? Beyond the fact that the price is still hugely more expensive at that price point, how would they convert buyers and overcome the great advantage of streaming:  you can hear it thru your PC or your phone or whatever - but if you have vinyl you can only hear it while sitting in front of your non-existent rig.

I don't care if record companies make money, make a ton of money or turn into a single huge conglomerate.  Vinyl was never going to be some huge part of their business again. Ever.

I totally agree, this is a shockingly bad market analysis for somebody who has an MBA and worked in consulting (as per Wikipedia), and actually knows the industry. How about this pearl of wisdom: "they might have easily convinced 40-50 million consumers to buy a dozen vinyl albums per year"? Is it back-to-1968 wishful thinking or what?  

[Д.Д.]

On 1/14/2023 at 5:14 PM, Pim said:

And interestingly, only half of the LP buyers own a turntable.

On 1/14/2023 at 5:14 PM, Pim said:

They asked them all individually?

Asking for data from every market participant individually is not how numbers are derived, whether for turntables or for anything else. There are various ways how you get a good estimate - you can have a survey of a representative sample, you can check the number of turntables sold multiplied by an average lifetime of a turntable, you can trace the spare parts sales and derive the population of "active" devices from it, etc.    

[Pim]

12 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

Asking for data from every market participant individually is not how numbers are derived, whether for turntables or for anything else. There are various ways how you get a good estimate - you can have a survey of a representative sample, you can check the number of turntables sold multiplied by an average lifetime of a turntable, you can trace the spare parts sales and derive the population of "active" devices from it, etc.    

I know how statistics and surveys work but I think it’s pretty obvious that with common sense alone you could feel that this ‘fact’ isn’t really a reliable one. 

[Daniel A]

2 hours ago, Brad said:

I’m a doctor of laws.  Very shortly, I will give you my opinion of nuclear fission 🤠

Haha!

(BTW, the picture I posted was an actual picture of the Doctor - doesn't fully inspire confidence with me).

 

[Д.Д.]

1 hour ago, Pim said:

I know how statistics and surveys work but I think it’s pretty obvious that with common sense alone you could feel that this ‘fact’ isn’t really a reliable one. 

Well, I don't know. People tend to make a common mistake of assuming that other people think like them. They do not, they have different motivation. I would not be surprised if Taylor Swift fans buy an LP just to pose with it on Instatok. It does not make sense for you or me, but does for them, so our "common sense" is not a good predictor for their behavior.

The article quotes some research by Luminate to support this claim ("50% of the vinyl buyers don't have a turntable"), I am not really interested in investigating it any further (I could not care less about vinyl) - but I am sure this research and its methodology can be found online.       

Edited January 15 by Д.Д.

[Teasing the Korean]

22 hours ago, sonnymax said:

Zero Hedge is a far-right libertarian financial blog and news aggregator...Over time, Zero Hedge expanded into non-financial political content, including conspiracy theories and fringe rhetoric advancing radical right, alt-right, and pro-Russia positions. Zero Hedge's non-financial commentary has led to multiple site bans by global social media platforms….

Other Zero Hedge headlines today:

FDA Adviser Says Young And Healthy People Shouldn’t Get Latest COVID Boosters

Wind Farms Eyed In Surge Of Dead Whales On NJ, NY Beaches

COVID Vaccines Are "Obviously Dangerous" And Should Be Halted Immediately, Say Senior Swedish Doctors

So, in other words, we can't even read an article about the vinyl resurgence that is free of this nonsense?

[bresna]

https://www.billboard.com/pro/vinyl-album-sales-rise-growth-slowing/

It's all in this billboard article.

[Pim]

27 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

Well, I don't know. People tend to make a common mistake of assuming that other people think like them. They do not, they have different motivation. I would not be surprised if Taylor Swift fans buy an LP just to pose with it on Instatok. It does not make sense for you or me, but does for them, so our "common sense" is not a good predictor for their behavior.

 

I agree that in most cases ‘common sense’ doesn’t work. After all: what’s common sense? And I also agree there will be people buying it for the trendy thing. But 50%? Half of all the buyer? 1 out of 2? This is a case where I like to believe my common sense is probably right and this article is wrong.

[Д.Д.]

1 hour ago, bresna said:

https://www.billboard.com/pro/vinyl-album-sales-rise-growth-slowing/

It's all in this billboard article.

 

1 hour ago, Pim said:

This is a case where I like to believe my common sense is probably right and this article is wrong.

Pim, I understand that you like to believe what you like to believe, but the research seems to show that the facts are different:

"While vinyl album sales continue to gain each year in the U.S., only half of those fans buying records actually own a vinyl record player, according to a research survey commissioned by Luminate. Last September, the firm published the statistic as part of its U.S. Music 360 2022 – Wave 2 report. Of those respondents over the age of 13 who had purchased vinyl in the previous 12 months, there was a question asked about which devices they owned, and only 50% said they owned a record player. Total respondents for the Music 360 study: 3,992".

This could be a sloppy research (available for interested parties for $10K here: https://luminatedata.com/studies/music-360-us-2022/ ), but 4K respondents is a good enough sample to be representative. I don't know the methodology, there might be a selection bias here, but assume they know what they are doing, this is not a very complicated thing to do. Unless you have something better to propose, I would prefer the research vs. "common sense".    

[Daniel A]

Of course, that every second buyer does not own a turntable does not mean that every second LP does not get played. Probably, those who have a player buy more releases than the other group.