patrick o'brian novels

[tooter]

I have been reading the Patrick O'Brian "Jack Aubrey" novels since they were first published and am now on my six or seventh time - I've lost count! The thing I like about them is that they guarantee a good belly laugh at least once for each novel and usually more. I visited a site dedicated to the subject but read that the movie "Master and Commander" was thought good even though the character of Stephen Maturin was given little prominence. As the relationship between JA and SM is so fundamental, this seemed nonsense to me. I had in any case already decided not to see the movie as I think it would destroy the pictures I have built up in my mind of the characters. In any case movies are never as good as books in my experience.

Patrick O'Brian's death was a real blow. He was said to have been working on the next instalment, in Ireland I think, when he passed away. But in a way he had brought the series to a kind of close with "Blue at the Mizen".

Are there any other fans among the membership here? Can anyone refute or confirm my impression of the movie, having seen it?

Rodney

[BruceH]

I'm a fan of the books from about, oh, ten years ago. I've seen the movie and liked it. Sure, neither Aubrey or Maturin actually LOOK like I picture them in my mind, but you can't expect them to. I can understand you keeping away from it, but all things considered I think the film-makers did an excellent job. They conflate two books into one story, but even that I can forgive. I enjoyed it hugely and saw it twice on the big screen. Sure, it's not perfect and you can pick nits til the cows come home, but I think it's about the best that could be done by Hollywood. Actually, kind of a miracle for modern Hollywood, in that they actually produced a good historica/adventure movie, something Hollywood just doesn't do anymore. I reread some of the books afterward, and I still have the old (ACCURATE) pictures in my mind of the blond, red-faced Aubrey, and the short, pale Maturin.

Edited June 15, 2004 by BruceH

[tooter]

Bruce. Your experience is reassuring then - perhaps seeing the movie won't destroy the edifice I have built up - the two can be separated.

Did you notice the musical aspects of the novels? The series starts of course with a recital and there are quite a few metions of improvisation too. I can't quite get my head around a reference fairly late in the books of Jack Aubrey playing within Stephen Maturin's hearing but without knowing he is being listened to, and playing much better than was normal when the two of them played together. The supposition is that JA "dumbed-down" his playing to suit the company. I would have thought this virtually impossible, long-term anyway.

So we coincide not only on science fiction, but perhaps you are much more widely read than I. That's about it for me - jazz books, good science fiction when I can find it and O'Brian.

Rodney

[BruceH]

Well, I'm not saying you HAVE to see the movie; that's your call of course. But I thought it was surprisingly good, if viewed with the right attitude.

I must point out that music is one of the best things about the film. They give a lot of play to Aubrey and Maturin's musicmaking, for one thing, and it's the only fiction film I know of that uses a Bach Cello Suite as prominent soundtrack music in one scene.

As for the rest, I for one found it odd that Aubrey, who was fairly bad at math (for a Navy officer), all of a sudden got a lot better at it. It's possible, I suppose, but it sure never happened to me. The characters have their quirks, and you've just got to take some things on faith I guess.

You're an sf fan? What do you think of James H. Schmitz?

[tooter]

You're an sf fan? What do you think of James H. Schmitz?

I am off to the library soon to try to get some James H Schmitz - can't say I recall anything by him at the moment. Just when I want it I can't get the on-line catalog.

Another strange thing was O'Brian's penchant for using the same names for different characters. Oakes was the name of a marine sentry and of course Lieutenant Oakes who married Clarissa, for example. Almost as if he couldn't think of any new name but I can't believe that. The novel I read last, "The Far Side of the World", has persons named Hollar, Hollom and Horner at the same time which can be a little confusing. I wonder if he did it as a joke. I find the majority of his name choices very good, but maybe that's because they were real names of people of the time.

[Pete B]

I'm another fan. I have gone through the cycle about once a year for the last 4 years since a friend introduced me to his writing.

I didn't really care for the movie. The visual aspects were great, from what I saw and have read the recreations were very accurate, but the plot and the dialogue were unworthy of the books.

Bruce, I don't recall Aubrey being bad at math at any time, or are you talking about his youth? He seems to have been a late bloomer. I have assumed that there is a correlation between his mathematical skills and his skill as a musician.

I too was struck by the scene in which Maturin audits Aubrey playing the violin and is impressed with his skill. But isn't that much like real life? I've known and played with many musicians, and certain of them have that divine spark, if you will.

As for the confusion with names, may I recommend "Persons, Animals, Ships and Cannon in the Aubrey-Maturin Sea Novels of Patrick O'Brian" by Anthony Gary Brown. When I read the series, this book and "A Sea of Words" are always at my side.

I see that his unfinished 21st novel is scheduled for publication. Amazon doesn't give a release date yet. I'd at least like to find out if Stephen succeeds in his pursuit of Christine Wood, and see how Jack comports himself as an Admiral.

[tooter]

Hands acroos the sea? I didn't know about the books you mention, Pete - I will try to get them. What is "A Sea of Words" though? It sounds as if it might be just what I've been hoping for - a book that explains all the naughtical terms in detail? I regard myself as salt-blooded even though I get as sick as a dog at the slightest movement on a ship. I habitually tap my biscuits on the plate before I eat them to get the weevils out ! But I still keep coming across many terms that puzzle me, despite having read the articles appended a examined the sail diagrams at the front in detail.

What I was driving at about JA playing the violin in a superior way when alone was that SM thought that JA had for years been keeping his playing down to SM's level as a kindness. I doubt if any player that has the spark you mention could hide it for so long. But I suppose the real point is that it is the kindness that's important.

Neither did I know about the impending publication of the unfinished novel - thanks for that. I've often thought that someone ought to write a book or books about Tom Pullings, or about JA's earlier life, but it wouldn't work. There's nobody that can write like Patrick O'Brian.

I had my good belly laugh today - quote:-

"These medicoes are a stiff-necked, independent crew, and you must never cross them just before they dose you."

"No, sir," said Jack, "I shall speak to them like a sucking dove."

"Pig, Aubrey: sucking pig. Doves don't suck."

(the Reverse of the Medal p17)

[Pete B]

A Sea of Words

I couldn't do without this book. It is the lexicon most O'Brian readers need.

There's also a lovely book called "Harbors and High Seas" which maps each of the voyages, with period illustrations and plot synopsis. And of course some years ago two ladies published "Lobscouse & Spotted Dog", in which they recreated recipes for such delicacies as soused pig's face and spotted dick.

My Amazon preorder for the unfinished novel states a ship date around August 21.

Thanks for the quote. My favorite, which bubbles up in my consciousness at the most unexpected moments, has to do with why a dog watch is shorter than the other watches. You know the punchline, of course....definitely one of Maturin's finer moments.

Edited June 15, 2004 by Pete B

[tooter]

"finer moments", but not in his view. The faint inward sigh...

I'm looking for all these books now, apart from the recipes, that is. I'm not into cooking!

[tooter]

You're an sf fan? What do you think of James H. Schmitz?

Bruce - any particular recommendation?

Rodney

[Pete B]

Tooter - one other recommendation, and then I'll shut up.

Find yourself a copy of "Dr. Dogbody's Leg" by James Norman Hall. Dr. Dogbody is a retired naval surgeon, an habitue of Will Tunn's Cheerful Tortoise Taproom", and he tells a series of stories about how he lost his leg, each more outlandish than the last. I guarantee you will enjoy it.

Oh, and go to: Patrick O'brian Resouces webpage wherein you will find a load of interesting information and links.

Now - back to the wardroom.

Edited June 15, 2004 by Pete B

[BruceH]

You're an sf fan?  What do you think of James H. Schmitz?

Bruce - any particular recommendation?

Rodney

The Best of James H. Schmitz, published by NESFA Press, or any collection that includes the stories "Grandpa" and "Balanced Ecology."

My take on the multiple-name thing is that it was common to 19th-century novels and he was just immitating that, kind of for fun. Could be wrong, though.

In addition to the fine books already recommended by Pete B, I must recommend a few more to any fan of Aubrey/Maturin:

Harbors and High Seas: An Atlas and Geographical Guide To the Aubrey/Maturin Novels of Patrick O'Brian, by Dean King and John B. Hattendorf (Just what it says, and quite engrossing.)

The Wooden World by N. A. M. Rodger---THE intro and factual guide to the British Navy in the days of sail; a must.

Men-Of-War: Life In Nelson's Navy by someone who calls himself Patrick O'Brian. Written in 1974, it's his brief version of The Wooden World. All the better libraries have it.

Fighting Sail, by A. B. C. Whipple---One volume of a Time-Life series, but don't let that prejudice you; lots of good info here, interwoven with a decent biography of Nelson, Aubrey's hero. Stands on its own quite well. I found it in a used bookstore, but any good library etc.

The Price of Admiralty: The Evolution of Naval Warfare by John Keegan. OK, I'm recommending too many books, but this one is great. Insightful, well-written, riveting.

(In re. SF, what is your opinion of Neal Asher, Greg Egan, and Peter Hamilton?)

[tooter]

Wow! - a lot to get my teeth into. I shall be haunting the London libraries soon, having just discovered a site through which all the catalogs can be searched in one go - very convenient. Thanks for all the info, Bruce and Pete.

I am glad that Patrick O'Brian was always so complimentary about Americans and their sense of honor, particularly now - although of course anyone who was not English had to be pitied . It's the French who got the stick, naturally, but even then there was Christy Palliere, Duhamel and others. A lot is said in the novels about discrimination too. I remember JA's assertion that English possession of any island being the natural state meeting with SM's disapproving frown.

I shall have to take a raincheck on the SF authors you mention, Bruce; apart from Greg Egan they are not familiar to me. I was brought up on Isaac Asimov, Arthur C Clarke, Clifford D Simak, John Wyndham and so many others. I have read some Egan a while back but prefer the earlier material. I have just picked up a collection of stories by Robert Silverberg but I guess I've read it before, many years ago - The Masks of Time.

[tooter]

Oh, and go to: Patrick O'brian Resouces webpage wherein you will find a load of interesting information and links.

Added to my favorites - thanks, Pete.

Rodney

[BruceH]

I was brought up on Isaac Asimov, Arthur C Clarke, Clifford D Simak

Toss in Heinlein, Larry Niven, Pohl, Bester, and a few others and that's me too. I grew up on all those guys. So I can dig where you're coming from.