EulaM

We use Zicam, but haven't had anything like a cold or the flu for years, but when we had friends around with small children, we caught every little bug they came up with, and it was miserable. We found Zicam and it worked better than anything we'd ever used, but caused a bit of pain in my nose, it was strange and felt so odd, but it was better to have that happen for about 1/2 an hour than to go through the other cold symptoms and uncomfort. Then this year, I read that Zicam has caused problems, problems such as permanent loss of smell. It seems I remember it saying that along with loss of smell came loss of taste. There may have been other problems associated with Zicam, but can't recall. Sandi

Not for nothin', but we expect you to buy a round or two. Wonder if Bluenote (that's the fellows ID isn't it, the latest one to cause a stink?), will show up over here, as I hear he's been given a "Time Out"? I think that some people thrive on contention and belittling others, and that goes on all around the place, nothing new, but it seems to be a bit more insidious this time around, with more members taking sides and piling on, which is a turn off in itself. Maybe the way it's going isn't as pointed, nor as enveloping as it could be, however it seems to me it's heading into what could turn into a more hateful situation, the kind that make for hard feelings which hang on, lasting ones, the good ones becoming irretrievable. It's already happened with a lot of long standing valued members. Pity.

and a complete bore. No comet.

Read my posts often enough you'll see why I lay claim to being "Queen of the typo's". It's shameful, but with cornet, being coronet, that wasn't one. Just a mistake.

Given Obama's great, great showing Saturday night, that might be a moot point, with any luck. A news bulletin that just came in says Obama has won Louisiana tonight. He's on a roll.

The thing is with reporters; reporters should be just that, giving us "Just the facts ma'am." If it's an OP Ed piece, then the gloves are off. Throw it at us. For a 'straight facts' reporter to go off on a "pimpin" bit of "smart a**@" talk, it's not great judgement on his part, even though those he reports on don't show such great insight either.

An interesting article, but still can't find what I've been looking for other than the instruments coming up on eBay. http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Cornet Here's the eBay page: http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?s...op=1&fsoo=1

Where on earth did you read that? On a google search, there's also a "Coronet" for sale there as well. I may have saved the thing on the one for sale, could be the seller just spelled it incorrectly as well.

Photo of Anthony Braxton playing Contra basss here on the Anthony Braxton thread, just click on it. http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...5&start=405

Do us a favor, once you form an opinion on this matter, get back to us and let us in on it. (Kidding)

Here's a photo of it being played it's post #80: http://forums.allaboutjazz.com/showthread....8766&page=6

The Contra/Bass Saxophone is a huge thing, and it is hard to play and to play with a group is said to be even harder, as it takes a longer time from when the first notes are played for them to be audible, so it is hard for a band to get together and be on time with it, or so they say. Takes a bit of practice and knowhow. Anything in Shorty's hands would look large, he was so diminutive. He drove a big gold Cadillac, him stetching upwards to see over the steering wheel, looking much like a little boy, that is until he got up closer and you could see who it was. We'd all be sitting down at 22nd Street at Ned's Surfboarder cafe out on his benches when here'd come Shorty driving by, we always got a kick out of seeing him in that big ol car. I've read where a Fluegel Horn is a soprano "cornet". Got it finally, ha!

Thanks, TtK, appreciate your take on all of this, but I've looked it up and it's said that each spelling and designation is correct. I keep seeing it spelled differently and thought well, I did it wrong again but then there will be the the three ways of telling you what a Coronet, Cornet, or one which is oftentimes called a Fluegel horn is, they say all ways of talking about them is correct. Do I have fluegel horn correct, ha. I just know I saw Shorty and Clark and a few other fellows play this instrument and the sound is wonderful, whatever you choose to call it, whichever is correct. The tone in the right hands is so pure. We took an interest in what was being played, alto, soprano, bass, etc, but we never learned what the mouth pieces were, or who made what, etc. We were fans but not students. It didn't decrease our appreciation of the music, not in the least. We just didn't study theory, brands and such. There wasn't the time or the need in our minds. My biggest mistake on this board is thinking it was Anthony Braxton who was playing the Contra Bass at the Lighthouse, as it couldn't have been as they say he was born in the 1940's, that would have made him about ten. We did see it being played there, but only through the port hole windows on the Dutch doors, as it was an invitation only event as it hadn't been played anywhere in ages, and so it was deep pocket sponsors, musicians and their wives, or best friends, and others in the music business who were invited, not any of us local kids who were so excited about it could go. Like I said earlier, the town was abuzz about it, but none of us, who lived there got to see or hear it happen, at least not from the inside, only from the outside looking in; no one who lived there, other than the in-house musicians could get in. This was in the mid to late 50's. Does anyone know who played it during this time frame? A lanky black musician, was who was entrusted with it during that time, and I'd say he was in his mid to late 20's. Could be wrong, but that's how old he looked to me. The fellow playing, as I understood it after so many years, didn't own it, and he was entrusted with it's care as the owners believed he would promote it in the best way. He had played mostly in the east if I remember correctly. I don't know why I got it in my head that it was Anthony Braxton, perhaps from another article and that implanted that in my mind. But we did get to see it and hear it from the sidewalk. At that time, it was a rare event.

Definitelynot Braxton. No cardigan. I went on Sonny Rollins website to ask him about this and thought it would be nice while there to not just ask questions of him, but to also compliment him on his great career and since he's one of the fellows who was there on a consistant basis and is still sharp as a tack, I thought I would ask him about it, and just as I'd finished telling him about a lot of other things, remembering to him how he introduced his "Way Out West" album at the Lighthouse,, as well at to how it was with he and Max Roach, and a bet about both of them I had with friends, which I had done, then when I had just started asking him about the contra bass appearance, I hit a button on the righthand side of my keyboard, and my whole note disappeared and I couldn't get it pulled back up, so I just gave up on it. I know there has to be a written record of it being played at the Lighthouse somewhere, but where? Maybe even a recording as they did record the greats and the unusual. I'm hoping that a fan or a musician out there will remember it.

I have been looking for the photo of the fellow I remember playing there and can't find a thing and I know it's on the web as I've seen it several times. I've tried to find a listing for the Lighthouse and can't find one for it either, and the only thing I find on Anthony Braxton backs up the age you're saying he is. I know that there were those who say Ron Carter wasn't the fellow I remember from the Lighthouse, but when I wrote to him, he said I brought back lots of memories, so he is the right musician who I talked about remembering, but as far as Anthony Braxton goes, I have to have it all wrong, however who was it who played that huge instrument during the 50's? I remember talking to the fellow who played it a few months later him talking about the difficulties in playing it and it's temperment, and about him playing there for a special select group, but he didn't play as often as the fellows I got to know, or that I remember really well, this due to lots of reasons, like Clifford and Richie, those were two unforgettable nice fellows and the talent, well they were astounding, and joining us at our table every time we walked in, they just made our day. Can't forget something like that. Hope someone comes across who it was they built the special stage and railing for that weekend. It was a big happening and the talk of the town, it was just that none of us who lived there, except for the in-house musicians and their guests, could go to see it all happen.

The fellow we saw play had longer hair than most of the musicians, was wearing a white sweater, a fisherman knit sweater. He had a goatee, he was tall, slight of build; a lanky build. The picture I see of the fellow playing it is the same or his twin and it is said to be Anthony Braxton. Being born in 1945 would make him the same age as my brother, and he wasn't old enough to have been performing at the Lighthouse. Saw some 16 year olds play there,them being brought there by Milt Hinton, Benny Carter and Coleman Hawkins. Other than that, it just didn't happen very often, not even as fans, it wasn't common to have young kids be there to play. Lee Morgan was one of the younger fellows, Ron Carter was another, there were a few more, but I don't recall Anthony Braxton being one of them, not that young. Not ever. Who would have been playing it earlier on that looked like Anthony, I always assumed it was him. Saw the fellow later on and talked to him about that weekend day and night, so really, who was playing the contra in the fiftys who looked like Anthony, as the ages are a mile off. The fellow was young, but in his twenties, not a pre-teen. .

Then he would have been about ten or 11.

He is older as I remember us kids not being able to go see him play the contra sax the time he performed on it at the Lighthouse. It was an invitation only, music critics and backers as well as other musicians were the only ones allowed that afternoon and night. We were probably around 16 at the time back in the mid 50's, so he's older. He had to have been in his mid to late 20's at least. Seems they were saying he was 27. That was way back when. We watched them build the special setup for him to play it in, them closing down the bar while they worked on it, and then they kept the doors closed when he played. Someone was saying this was due to the fact that they wanted a more controlled atmosphere, not wanting the damp ocean air in the bar, as it might cause a different tone or damage I believe. Besides they weren't wanting people photographing or recording him playing it from the doorway, so we just watched him play for a bit through the porthole windows on the Dutch doors, able to hear him pretty well, as well as see him, as he was on the end nearest the door on the West side of the bar. They usually kept both tops of the Dutch doors open when it was warm, but they didn't the night he played there. I saw him play later on, but never saw the contra sax being played by him again, he didn't even play it very often as it was such an endevor to work out the shipping and other logistics to make it possible to play. When he played it at the Lighthouse, they build a fence, a railing around the stage which was made for it, this to keep it from falling and to keep people from reaching out and handling it. I believe that was being said at that time.

Thanks for the kind words, they're appreciated. I know nothing about the horns other than what I see written about them, that is, other than it was always called a coronet, cornet or flugelhorn (the later being the soprano version of the cornet they' say and it's said either is acceptable, where I see on google, and in other searches, they're said to not be). When Shorty would be introduced, if that nicety was even done, usually they just played, so introductions were rare, but if he had his cornet with him someone from the bandstand would would usually talk to the audience to let us know we were in for a treat as he was carrying in his cornet that day or night. That was a truism for sure, as we really were, and at that time Shorty was thought to be the very best at playing it. I do see it being called a flugelhorn quite often, maybe it's a regional thing. One is different? Most of us don't know what that difference would be, we non musicians, we're just the casual, just out to enjoy the music fan, we aren't into dissecting what was being played as a true student of jazz, and it's instruments would be.

Sandi, have you forgotten Princess Diana? No, not at all, and what a tragic turn of events that was, however, I was meaning here in the states. I think to a point these kids are cultivating the press, using them much as Diana did, but they, the papparazzi aren't as easy to get rid of as they are to egg on. It can get old and then they want rid of them and it isn't so easy to do. I remember driving down Sunset to the Pacific one night during "Rush Hours", and it was a mad house. So can you even begin to imagine it with a celebrity being hounded by the papparazzi on that crowded, narrow dangerous stretch of curved hilly roadway? With cars being driven at breakneck speed? It happens anyway, but doing the dangerous other things the papparazzi will do to get a photo, whoa, I'd wouldn't want to be within a quarter mile of them.

I hear that the courts are considering imposing a safe buffer zone between those being stalked by them and themselves. It will make all of our lives a bit safer don't you think? How would it be to be on the road and have that errupt in front of or behind you? Speeding vehicles, running people, flash bulbs everywhere, which at night could blind you. We've seen on the news, all of the people driving like fools in cars and on motorcycles, making illegal U-Turns all about you, how would that be to get in the middle of all of that even by accident? It's a wonder no one has been injured seriously or even killed. It's bound to happen don't you think?

About the only things I hear complaining of the recordings which were done back in Shorty's day was the quality of the recordings, and mainly this is due to many of them having been recorded live. At the Lighthouse, there was the sound of traffic and the surf, then too there was the cash register and the crowd. The thing with Shorty, perhaps I'm a bit prejudiced, him being a hometown guy and all, but I didn't know a soul who wasn't impressed by his talent, and I myself thought he was quite grand. I know when one of his recordings was supposed to come out, I usually knew about it in advance, and if I had the money I would rush down to our local record/music shop to buy one, however in less than a half a day his albums were usually gone. He was the hot ticket in our town at the time. I missed out all but one time, there was a record by him the last of the shipment, and so picked one up without even knowing what was on it. At that time, they had listening booths, but I knew his work so well, I didn't even consider going in a booth to hear it. I was so surprised that I managed to get to the shop before they were all gone. Worst record I've heard, and that's because it's a funeral dirge, or close to it, what's the name of the song, Black Sunday or Black Sabbath or something like that. It's about death and suicide. The most depressing music I've ever heard, and the first time I ever heard anything by him that I just couldn't stand. I still have it, one of the ones no one else liked either so no one took it like they did my other albums. It's mint. There are some terrific songs on that set, the one your're asking about, so if you like Shorty and the quality of the recordings are good, I don't see how you could go wrong. We were all so disappointed when he left Hermosa Beach to become a studio musician. Shorty like so many of the guys were all so tired of the road and all of it's hardships, besides at the studio's the pay was better for a lot of them. Shorty would come back and play now and then, but it became rarer and rarer to have him make an appearance. He was good, I mean really. If anything I would think that this set would help fill and round out a collection, especially with such an important musican being pretty well represented.

Other than photo's of times past, ones which Stan Levey took, at least they're the ones I know about, and was there watching him take them, I hear there is little left of how it used to be. It's been remodeled, probably for the better, but I would have liked it to stay the same. Of course John Levine isn't at his perch at the end of the bar in face to face serious talks with Miles, nor is he playing chess with him at their spot which was fun to watch. I don't recall who would win, as they were long drawn out affairs as Miles would play between practice, sets, etc. I think the only one left alive, of all of the fellows who made the Lighthouse what it was, is Howard Rumsey. He must be close to 97 now. Hard to believe that after playing for so many years in such an environment that he's been the picture of health. After John Levine died, his son took over. He was good friends with one of my best friends, and Jack told me that John's son, Scott (I think that was his name), just didn't know how to handle bookings, he didn't know what people wanted to hear and see, nor did he understand the in's and out's of running a jazz club, particularly one that was so famous, one which had been such an international draw. Then Howard moved to a club in Redondo Beach, and that pretty much was the end of the Lighhouse as the club everyone enjoyed playing, it ended being a club for the best jazz around. Scott began to bring in Rock and Roll bands, heavy metal and such. One time when down there to go to a high school reunion, we were stopped in traffic and I listened to what was coming out, it was a latin themed jazz group and it sounded pretty awful. Broke my heart to hear what had happened to the place. The times that the Lighthouse was in it's hay day can never be again, and for all sorts of reasons, many of them being financial. Imagine hearing Miles, Charlie, John Coltrane, and just about anyone else without a cover charge on any given day or night, and even when patrons were asked to pay, I was never charged, they wouldn't hear of taking my money. It was such an unusual place, a local neighborhood bar more or less. Not many places around like that any longer. The Lighthouse does have some special times where they do bring in the well known jazz musicians, and some special happenings, like memorials for Conte Condoli, and such, but those are rare and far between. I wish they would do a bronze statue of John and Miles playing chess at the end of the bar, John perched on his barstool at the end, with Miles just around the corner, him always standing leaning on one elbow into John's space, the two of them in some serious and fun discussions. This is how I remember them together, it was great to see and hear, John with his gravely voice, which sounded so gruff, but he was a sweetheart, and ran the best place around.

Thank you, Sandi 'Winkler' Hummer ....from Hermosa Beach.

We drove back to Texas when I was eight years old, and the Burma Shave signs were posted out in the deserts, on long desolate stretches of straight road. My dad loved them as they were humorous and they helped keep him awake, that was their purpose he told us, not that they were just for advertisement he said, but they were a good way to implant their brand name in your head. Brilliant really.