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I forget that The Ladykillers wasn't Alastair Sim... great film. After the filming, Peter Sellers asked Herbert Lom if he could help him get another job in movies! I love the Lavender Hill Mob too - Sid James' first main feature, and the role in which he was spotted to join Tony Hancock for radio & TV. Writers Galton & Simpson had to wait for a re-run at the pictures and watch through to the credits to discover his name.

My Mac is just a tool, lets me design stuff and doesn't intrude. I run six or seven at work and never have to think about them. I know nothing of their innards. I am their master. I'm not smug about them, just coldly serene.

Perhaps with the most important criticism there’s a risk involved - a reputation is at stake because it isn’t always just a question of subjective taste, but also of recognising the winds of change at those special moments... so a history of cubism or fauvism isn’t complete without either Louis Vauxcelles who panned them (and accidently coined their names), or Apollinaire who recognised, and foresaw instinctively their importance.

That sums up my production! (I can't help it though). But I have to stress it's not at all a question of getting the approval of others. If my mother-in-law likes a picture, I bin it. (just kiddin')

You have my sympathy - being an artist and a critic/historian sounds like a recipe for sleepless nights to me... Warning - waffle ahead:... People who really can create without that antagonism are to be envied - I mean, I think anything you create contains self-criticism. As a comparative outsider, and a non-musician - the lack of time to choose in creating jazz (I mean in the flow of improvisation) - between all the infinite possibilities of what to put down next is something that appeals to me, because in the limited genuinely creative moments I have engaged in - for example painting - I have been paralysed with a dilemma, not a fear of the empty white sheet, but the fear that my marks will falsely represent me because what I choose to put down seems so definitely a decision, like - "THIS is the best and right option for me now"... when really I know the choice could legitimately be any one of a million other things. This ultimately resulted in me only being satisfied with results in which I couldn't recognise myself, kind of automatically painted, as if by someone else (not achieved through drugs, but I'm sure this is a large part of the attraction for some 'experimenters' - not achieving inspiration through narcotics, but instead a deadening of the self criticism at the moment of creativity). So I'm often attracted to things where i can recognise this tension of choice, either when the artist appears to shrug it off - for example, Jimmy Yancey's E flat at the end of each tune - to me he seems to be saying "I did it like this, but it could have been that" (or as someone else once said "the joke's on you"), or again, the Dadaists' attempts at blasé destruction, or negation, which inevitably result in a new creation despite themselves... (or a 36 CD history of blues which still has a question mark on the end? ) This general fear of being misrepresented by the 'signifier' extends to simple things - if someone asks what music I like, I stumble on the words 'blues' or 'jazz' because they might represent in their minds something very different to what is in my mind. Anyway... - (and, emoticons represent my feelings better than my own face)

Rationality finally enters the discussion. sometimes... but there's some pretty bewildering theory written by artists - the trouble comes when it's decided upon before attempting the 'art'

Indeed (like I said ) Noted - thanks, I hadn't heard of it but will go for it...

The Fisk release, for me, is valuable for various reasons - the notes/book are written by Doug Seroff, who I would love also to write something big on quartets after the 1920 period (his current books frustratingly stop just where you can begin to listen - I know that's kinda the point but he's got so much info..). Also the importance of the group for recording, according to Tim Brooks, the first widely distributed 'serious' African American music (is this what is meant by 'Marsalisism'? genuine question!), with spirituals being parodied at the time - though it depends what is meant by serious I suppose - some of Bert Williams seems pretty deep now!. Thirdly, preservation - John Work's group was (I think...?) kind of a protection of a reputation in peril for the original Fisk singers... and today the large corporations are sitting on a lot of early recordings letting them rot because they're not commercially viable (though not especially for this particular group as I believe Document have done them already)... It'd be interesting to know how much of a market there is for this kind of re-issue, what with Yazoo gone (not really their thing anyway) and Document putting out CDRs And, most importantly, I like their sound! judging them only on a few records - including the sample on Really The Blues?... speaking of 'album of the year'...

Thanks for the heads up - it'll be in my Christmas stocking for sure. just received today Document's Bryant's Jubilee Quartet, Biddeville Quintette and Dunham Jazz & Jubilee so I'm revved up for this one

It appears on the Dust To Digital box set - 'How Low Can You Go? - Anthology of the String Bass' Recorded pseudonymously as by 'Joe Turner And His Memphis Men' (contractual shenanigans) "WC Handy's blues immortalized the semi-mythic Joe Turner, who reputedly transported convicts to the Nashville penitentiary in the 1890s. Here his ghost returns to conduct the Ellington orchestra" (notes to the box set) Allen Lowe's set (vol 2) has an Eddie Lang version from 1929 which I like, sort of a raggedy rhythm - finger-snappin' good!

Is this going to stand unpunished?

Mine will have to be the latter! I love this - though I only have one version from 1926... It sounds to me like something that could only have been created during prohibition - with everybody dipping their toe in the forbidden, the constant exchange between major and minor. Like a chic party is going on upstairs, but all the patrons know who's supplying the liquor. I think there's a certain comic weirdness in it too, that Cab Calloway took to extremes - and like those early cartoons (Bimbo and Betty Boop and so on), fun but menacing like a pursuit of some sort (maybe a bear and a duck taking a stroll ). I reckon it's that floating 'ghosty' tuba sound against the muted trumpet - he certainly had those timbral colours going on anyway. Is this kind of Tiny Parham-ish? - this minor key, prowling feel. there must be loads more similar things I need to find...

That would be pretty useful! It seems that it's well known that Ellington was a synesthete, but I'll post this anyway: Duke Ellington (1899-1974), composer and pianist. Class of synesthesia: Timbre → color. "I hear a note by one of the fellows in the band and it’s one color. I hear the same note played by someone else and it’s a different color. When I hear sustained musical tones, I see just about the same colors that you do, but I see them in textures. If Harry Carney is playing, D is dark blue burlap. If Johnny Hodges is playing, G becomes light blue satin." – Ellington, as quoted in Don George, p. 226. According to another pianist on a piano forum with the same thing, this Timbre → color function is perhaps not very useful: Although, as a synesthete myself, I have to point out that not all of us associate key->colour. Some people have note-> colour (eg C# is always yellow), and then there are people like me who have timbre->colour (eg violins sound green). Mine is obviously less useful than the other two, but still an interesting experience But more useful for a bandleader presumably

Not very scary sounding, but scarily titled - and HAUNTINGLY beautiful tunes... Nightmare - Alphonso Trent Phantomesque - Coleman Hawkins Creepy Feeling - Jelly Roll Morton And 'scary' sounding not scarily titled Jungle Crawl - Tiny Parham East St. Louis Toodle-oo - Duke Ellington

Reading one or two things about synesthesia (the condition, not the band..) in connection with artistic endeavours - Kandinsky for example.. Duke Ellington is cited as a famous musician who 'used synesthesia' in his works. Does this mean he actually had a neurological condition?, or that he simply attempted some kind of musical impression of colours? His music certainly conjures up 'images' in quite a vivid way - (eg Air Conditioned Jungle and others that I can't remember the names of - but you can almost see the skyscrapers, busy streets in some of it) - but this is a different matter I suppose.

That reminds me... The Rap Guide to Evolution - Darwinian Hip Hop The lights go down. The room fills with music — a pulsating hip-hop rhythm. And then, over the music, you hear the voice of Richard Dawkins reading a passage from “On the Origin of Species” by Charles Darwin: “Whoever is led to believe that species are mutable will do good service by conscientiously expressing his conviction. For only thus can the load of prejudice by which this subject is overwhelmed be removed.” So begins one of the most astonishing, and brilliant, lectures on evolution I’ve ever seen: “The Rap Guide to Evolution,” by Baba Brinkman.

Anyway, what's wrong with a "bunch of interior designers analyzing contemporary architecture"? - what about Le Corbusier, Theo Van Doesburg, Marcel Breuer, or any of that stuff that went on at the Bauhaus? Where does one thing stop and another start... What's wrong about discussing the creative process, as it applies to any genre - nobody's claiming to be an expert. Wouldn't it be interesting to see what a Hip Hop forum would have to say about jazz - as long as the question was considered carefully, like some people here are doing? Marcel Breuer Le Corbusier (But... if there are some incorrect statements of 'fact' here you should point them out)

Definitely - and also originally a manipulation of the current (early seventies) trend for providing music for dancing at discos and parties - re-introducing some element of 'live' creativity to the DJ... just as with the Jamaican sound systems, which had earlier replaced live bands because they were much cheaper, as were the 'versions' or mixes on the records of already existing rhythm tracks. It was the proletariat taking control of the means of re-production. ho ho

This short essay (by an 'insider') talks about the underground v commercial Hip Hop - also indicating the scope of the genre beyond just rap (and also mentions the devaluing of rap itself in favour of R&B singers)... b-boys.com Since the early to mid 90’s, hip-hop has undergone changes that purists would consider degenerating to its culture. At the root of these changes is what has been called “commercial hip-hop". Commercial hip-hop has deteriorated what so many emcees in the 80’s tried to build- a culture of music, dance, creativity, and artistry that would give people not only something to bob their head to, but also an avenue to express themselves and deliver a positive message to their surroundings.. What does the term “commercial” mean? It can take on various meanings, but in essence that term is used to label artists who have alienated parts of the hip-hop culture in their work. The High and Mighty, a duo from Philadelphia signed to Rawkus Records, summed up what commercial hip-hop is in their 1999 single release “The Meaning”. Mr. Eon says: “…they’re tryin’ to turn hip-hop to just plain rappin’/let the poppers pop/and the breakers break…” But the disenchantment with artists who don’t appreciate hip-hop as consisting of emceeing, breaking, graffiti art, beat boxing and dj-ing is not new. Underground artists, predominately hip-hop purists, have lashed out at biters and perpetrators for many years. For example, in 1989 3rd Bass released their first album, The Cactus Cee/D. Throughout the album, MC Serch and Prime Minister Pete Nice scold the commercialized booty shakers like MC Hammer for corrupting hip-hop, particularly on the track “The Gasface” they specifically call out Hammer for his antics...

I am sorry but the scene has appeared to be the most powerful thing, NOT the underground thing, for a LONG time, which is in part why I mock it. Consider my position, hoping to keep alive French in Louisiana, when the young people there want to honor rap, the traditional music of Bronx and Brooklyn, instead of Louisiana's French music and language. It is Goliath, not David. Clear. I do appreciate your point - which is why I used the word 'appear' - the underground thing is often an illusion - as with gangsta rap What you say about language just affirms what I said earlier - that 'Hip Hop' (which represents much more than just the music, at least as much as 'jazz') has had an enormous cultural impact, and I still think that the word 'rap' is not like the word 'jazz' as it is much more specific.

Gets good reviews everywhere... Excerpt from allaboutjazz.com: "Various documentaries have been made about jazz over the years with mixed results. While the 1993 DVD Masters of American Music: The Story of Jazz is only 98 minutes long, it ends up being far more wide-ranging, less repetitious and better written than the much longer and somewhat controversial Ken Burns' Jazz released the following decade. The Story of Jazz covers the early cross-cultural roots of jazz then every major style by blending focused writing, plus careful choice of photos, music, film, video and interview subjects...."

Fair enough – I was being mischievous really – and changed my mind but Christiern already saw my post before I deleted it… I watched the first part again yesterday – the sickly sweet mix of pre-destination, nostalgia and sentimentality (it’s the absence of these things that I like in blues music particularly – unless you count tongue-in-cheek pessimism) made me curious about Ken Burns’ ideas so I was just looking at various stuff about him as I knew nothing… I didn't mean to piss anyone off with that post - I genuinely thought those interviews explained quite a bit about his motives, and misdemeanours :blush2: I thought Wynton Marsalis was very photogenic on camera, and oddly old fashioned (intended of course) and all that slightly prudish way of putting things (about Storyville – “people gambling, showing their behinds in different various ways…”!) was quite funny – you can see why a film maker would want him quite prominent from a presentation angle – like somebody transported from the good ol’ days. Then all that stuff about the blues arriving in New Orleans in 1890ish, fully formed, with backing music from 30 odd years later… Erm... just to be clear, I naively thought that Burns' words were so daft it was unecessary to comment - and everyone knows Utah Smith had the biggest wings anyway

ironic that my purely objective presentation of an interview should be seen as an endorsement of the opinions contained therein...

Ok - so you saw it already... to be honest I didn't know what the etiquette here was on commenting on such things As none of this makes sense now I'll repost my original post, even if it is already obvious anyway: (something like...) I read an illuminating interview on www.religion-online.org which seem to explain somewhat Ken Burns' agenda and seemed relevant to the Jazz film: "interested less in the organized forms of religion than in spiritual pursuit as a way toward the perfectibility of an imperfectible species called human beings. I would hope that spirituality does not succumb to the logic of reason and empiricism. We are all faced daily with mysteries beyond our comprehension. Part of what we do in literature and in art, as well as in religion, is attempt to superimpose some order, some meaning, on what seems to be the randomness of the cosmos. In that superimposition are often the most beautiful things that human beings do--not just in the production of art and literature or the glory of cathedrals but in human relations. I would hope with every fiber of my being that that would not leave us. My mission--and I'm happy to say that there is a huge evangelical dimension to what I'm doing--is preaching the gospel of Americanism, but one that is mindful of the fact that it is not separated from questions of the spirit and the soul's survival." and also on the PBS site: "Each time we did an interview for the film, whether it was with musicians who played with him years ago or musicians struggling today to come to terms with his legacy; whether it was critics, writers or historians, friends, hangers-on or people in management, each would in the end shake their head and say that Louis Armstrong was a "gift from God" or "an Angel." Near the end of the editing process, I happened to be out on the road and came across a women who for lack of a better word is a psychic, a medium familiar with things not of this world. When I told her of the interviews and how each person had called Armstrong an angel, she closed her eyes and smiled and said softly, "biggest wings I've ever seen." But maybe Wynton Marsalis, a great trumpet player in his own right, said it best when I asked him about Louis. He had already insisted that Armstrong was chosen by God "to bring the feeling and message and the identity of jazz to everybody." I left no opinion on my original post because I didn't think it necessary, and still don't.

Ok - so you saw it already... to be honest I didn't know what the etiquette here was on commenting on such things