The Magnificent Goldberg

BFT109 discussion thread

64 posts in this topic

Well, I am stumped as to the rest of the songs. Is there any chance you could give us some subtle hints, Allan?

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OK, hint #1 - JeffCrom was wrong about how old the leader in #13 was. He was born in 1902 and was working in a well known band at the age of 15.

MG

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#8 - the leader is not playing his usual instrument.

#3 - no clue yet, in case Mike Weil joins in the fun and he's a bit of a specialist in this area :)

#12 - no clue that wouldn't lead you to the singer immediately.

#6 - the leader occupied a similar position to Bartholomew, but in a different geographical region and a different time frame.

#5 & #7 - very obscure, perhaps even very, VERY obscure.

#2 - I don't want to give a clue to this one :D

MG

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OK, hint #1 - JeffCrom was wrong about how old the leader in #13 was. He was born in 1902 and was working in a well known band at the age of 15.

MG

Okay, thanks for the hint. It's Buster Bailey, from his 1958 Felsted album All About Memphis, with Red Richards, Gene Ramey, and Jimmy Crawford. I jumped to some foolish conclusions because the clarinet playing sounds kind of schizophrenic to me - there are flashes of sophistication among passages where Bailey sounds like he's deliberately simplifying his style. That gave me the impression that it was a younger guy trying to play "old." Boy, was I wrong.

After listening to the track again, I'm still not sure what I think about it. It just doesn't sound/feel "right" to me. (I'm talking about the clarinet playing - I love the rhythm section's slow groove.) I really like early Buster Bailey, but the later recordings I've heard by him haven't impressed me much. Maybe I should explore more.

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OK, hint #1 - JeffCrom was wrong about how old the leader in #13 was. He was born in 1902 and was working in a well known band at the age of 15.

MG

Okay, thanks for the hint. It's Buster Bailey, from his 1958 Felsted album All About Memphis, with Red Richards, Gene Ramey, and Jimmy Crawford. I jumped to some foolish conclusions because the clarinet playing sounds kind of schizophrenic to me - there are flashes of sophistication among passages where Bailey sounds like he's deliberately simplifying his style. That gave me the impression that it was a younger guy trying to play "old." Boy, was I wrong.

After listening to the track again, I'm still not sure what I think about it. It just doesn't sound/feel "right" to me. (I'm talking about the clarinet playing - I love the rhythm section's slow groove.) I really like early Buster Bailey, but the later recordings I've heard by him haven't impressed me much. Maybe I should explore more.

Yes, you're right, Jeff, it's Buster Bailey, from the Felsted album. I don't hear a schizophrenic style in this - or the rest of the album - I hear a guy who was never really a leader, now given a chance to be out front, and, on this, pulling it all out and maybe not as disciplined as he always had to be.

MG

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Well, I'm exposed again. I've not heard of Buster Bailey.

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A trivia clue for #6. The tenor player made the barking noises on Willie Mae Thornton's 'Hound dog'.

I hope that's helpful...

MG

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L.A. tenor player in Johnny Otis' orb...Jackie Kelso?

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L.A. tenor player in Johnny Otis' orb...Jackie Kelso?

Good guess. He did work with Otis. But he's not Kelso.

MG

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Sorry to be so damned late. Somehow I got off the list (and off my schedule -- need to make up 106-108, too!) and then damned busy. Lots here for the ear, some resonating more than others. A few must haves that I can't wait to have ID'd. Nailed nothing, to the best of my knowledge.

1 – At first I couldn’t place what I was hearing (instrumentally), then I turned up the laptop. Startdust, not a clue who.

2 – I’m either going to love this or hate it. I’m leaning love, though first impressions of the tenor are that it’s too post-Coltrane influenced. Here’s the groove. I like this. Harmonies remind me of CB3 Sextet. Somebody pretty friggin’ accomplished on trumpet. I was thinking a bit like Oscar Brashear, but it’s not him. Tenor does strike me as too much out of that NEC/Berklee thing. Likes his Sonny Rollins a lot, but too much muscle memory on the licks. Maybe Hilton Ruiz on piano? Or perhaps someone from the next generation after him. Drum solo I could do without – not happening. Electric bass, and we’re done. Just can’t stomach the sound of that instrument. Bone player saves it. Like the Jazz side of Fred Wesley – I like what he has going on.

3 – Interesting take on the organ trio. Don’t know who it is, though.

4 – I’m liking this right off the bat. Understated head. Very clean alto sound, almost classical with the vibrato. Almost sounds like T on tenor at first, but too understated. My guess is these are not guys I know, but I like this a lot.

5 – I like the front line of tenor and flute. Those 70s drums are killing me, though (and whatever that guitarish sounding thing is). Very much digging this tune, though. [Hey Tim Webb, we should cover this!] Bizarre guess – is that George Adams on flute? Choppy like he sometimes plays it. Makes me wonder if this is Roy Haynes band from one of those Mainstream recordings. Seems like Roy would be more in my grill than this. And if George is on flute, who would be on tenor? (Unless it’s overdubbed) Or, option B, this is a South African band – that’s what the sax solo makes me think of (kind of Fela-ish). Now, I’m hearing a tenor in the head, but both sax solo sections sound like an alto to me. Is it just me? Definitely an out of tune alto there on the outchorus. Sort of like Byard Lancaster but with an Island/South African vibe to it.

6 – Misty, played a lot by someone with a shaky hand placing the needle! Something has me leaning Plas Johnson – very smoky, big sound. An old school pro, whomever it is.

7 – Don’t know, but not resonating. Misfire.

8 – Liking the bass line a lot. Having the bass and the piano in unison is a nice touch for this feel. Overall a very Crusaders feel on the head. Some homage to Benny Bailey in that trumpet. Lots of keys. There seems to be a slew of this sort of stuff out there I’ve only scratched the surface (or the subsurface) of.

9 – I like the vocalist’s voice, but man, the band is not supportive (on the head, anyway). I want to say I know the vocalist, but damn if I can place him. Tenor is another one of those guys I’m not real familiar with – maybe Red Holloway?

10 – Not a clue.

11 – Nice beginnings. I’m a fool to want this (no I’m not). Tenor playing it like a vocalist – perfect for a tune like this. Only guy I hear doing this now is James Carter. I’m digging this guys tone a LOT. Maybe Buddy Tate? Perhaps a bit more modern than Buddy. Can’t be Billy Mitchell – I don’t know of any Mitch I’m missing. He’s a bad man! Huh… not Houston Person? There’s shades of Jug, but it’s got more of that ballad stuff in the tone, but some modern licks, too. Jesus, what IS this!?!? Illinois Jacquet?

12 – Ooo! I like this right away. So, we know the song. A nice, understated voice. Not royalty, but very pleasing. Nice flute tone; solid. I’d guess a doubler, sax as the main instrument. Someone very versed in Bebop 101. Piano gets a little busy when the vocals return (almost like it was a different take). No guesses, but overall a very nice take on the tune. Possibly an instrumentalist doing the vocals?

13 – I just have a predilection against clarinet. This is by no means bad, I just can’t get beyond the instrument.

14 – Now this is a tune that just… eh… bugs me. But Gene Ammons killed the hell out of it. Vocalist seems like someone going for that Nat King Cole style in a du-wop setting. Ugh… the vocals, just… no.

15 – BWAHAHHAHA!!!! What a great intro!!! NICE! More electric bass. Grrr! Can’t put my ear to the tenor – she doesn’t let him breath at all.

16 – Dunno, but the sax in the beginning could be Louis Jordan.

17 – No idea.

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Apologies for not responding. It's been a ridiculously busy month, and the few days when I had time to listen, I was on the road and unable to post.

That Cab Calloway track made the road trip much better, though. Thank you!

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Sorry to be so damned late. Somehow I got off the list (and off my schedule -- need to make up 106-108, too!) and then damned busy. Lots here for the ear, some resonating more than others. A few must haves that I can't wait to have ID'd. Nailed nothing, to the best of my knowledge.

1 – At first I couldn’t place what I was hearing (instrumentally), then I turned up the laptop. Startdust, not a clue who.

2 – I’m either going to love this or hate it. I’m leaning love, though first impressions of the tenor are that it’s too post-Coltrane influenced. Here’s the groove. I like this. Harmonies remind me of CB3 Sextet. Somebody pretty friggin’ accomplished on trumpet. I was thinking a bit like Oscar Brashear, but it’s not him. Tenor does strike me as too much out of that NEC/Berklee thing. Likes his Sonny Rollins a lot, but too much muscle memory on the licks. Maybe Hilton Ruiz on piano? Or perhaps someone from the next generation after him. Drum solo I could do without – not happening. Electric bass, and we’re done. Just can’t stomach the sound of that instrument. Bone player saves it. Like the Jazz side of Fred Wesley – I like what he has going on.

It IS Fred Wesley, Thom! Ta dahhhh! And the trumpet player is a guy you probably know quite well in a different context.

3 – Interesting take on the organ trio. Don’t know who it is, though.

4 – I’m liking this right off the bat. Understated head. Very clean alto sound, almost classical with the vibrato. Almost sounds like T on tenor at first, but too understated. My guess is these are not guys I know, but I like this a lot.

5 – I like the front line of tenor and flute. Those 70s drums are killing me, though (and whatever that guitarish sounding thing is). Very much digging this tune, though. [Hey Tim Webb, we should cover this!] Bizarre guess – is that George Adams on flute? Choppy like he sometimes plays it. Makes me wonder if this is Roy Haynes band from one of those Mainstream recordings. Seems like Roy would be more in my grill than this. And if George is on flute, who would be on tenor? (Unless it’s overdubbed) Or, option B, this is a South African band – that’s what the sax solo makes me think of (kind of Fela-ish). Now, I’m hearing a tenor in the head, but both sax solo sections sound like an alto to me. Is it just me? Definitely an out of tune alto there on the outchorus. Sort of like Byard Lancaster but with an Island/South African vibe to it.

Yes, it's South African. Option B rules.

6 – Misty, played a lot by someone with a shaky hand placing the needle! Something has me leaning Plas Johnson – very smoky, big sound. An old school pro, whomever it is.

Yes, old school pro, but not Plas.

7 – Don’t know, but not resonating. Misfire.

8 – Liking the bass line a lot. Having the bass and the piano in unison is a nice touch for this feel. Overall a very Crusaders feel on the head. Some homage to Benny Bailey in that trumpet. Lots of keys. There seems to be a slew of this sort of stuff out there I’ve only scratched the surface (or the subsurface) of.

Jim Sangrey has identified the trumpet player as Jimmy Owens.

9 – I like the vocalist’s voice, but man, the band is not supportive (on the head, anyway). I want to say I know the vocalist, but damn if I can place him. Tenor is another one of those guys I’m not real familiar with – maybe Red Holloway?

Not Red Holloway, but not unlike Red.

10 – Not a clue.

11 – Nice beginnings. I’m a fool to want this (no I’m not). Tenor playing it like a vocalist – perfect for a tune like this. Only guy I hear doing this now is James Carter. I’m digging this guys tone a LOT. Maybe Buddy Tate? Perhaps a bit more modern than Buddy. Can’t be Billy Mitchell – I don’t know of any Mitch I’m missing. He’s a bad man! Huh… not Houston Person? There’s shades of Jug, but it’s got more of that ballad stuff in the tone, but some modern licks, too. Jesus, what IS this!?!? Illinois Jacquet?

Yes, it's Illinois.

12 – Ooo! I like this right away. So, we know the song. A nice, understated voice. Not royalty, but very pleasing. Nice flute tone; solid. I’d guess a doubler, sax as the main instrument. Someone very versed in Bebop 101. Piano gets a little busy when the vocals return (almost like it was a different take). No guesses, but overall a very nice take on the tune. Possibly an instrumentalist doing the vocals?

Yes, it's an instrumentalist singing. Good one.

13 – I just have a predilection against clarinet. This is by no means bad, I just can’t get beyond the instrument.

14 – Now this is a tune that just… eh… bugs me. But Gene Ammons killed the hell out of it. Vocalist seems like someone going for that Nat King Cole style in a du-wop setting. Ugh… the vocals, just… no.

15 – BWAHAHHAHA!!!! What a great intro!!! NICE! More electric bass. Grrr! Can’t put my ear to the tenor – she doesn’t let him breath at all.

16 – Dunno, but the sax in the beginning could be Louis Jordan.

It isn't Jordan.

17 – No idea.

Much better late than never! I didn't think anyone would guess Fred Wesley :) Thanks for that!

MG

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Apologies for not responding. It's been a ridiculously busy month, and the few days when I had time to listen, I was on the road and unable to post.

That Cab Calloway track made the road trip much better, though. Thank you!

Really glad you liked the Cab.

MG

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