Who Is Gilles Peterson?

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

It's only lost if you can't find it, and there's plenty of other places to find it.

Life is not one-stop shopping...

I know that; you know that; quite probably Gilles Peterson knows it; but it's not clear to me that their customers do. It's well possible that GP, whatever his taste and the breadth of his understanding, has been suborned by the Masters of Business and compelled to focus on what the ruling classes think that the masses should concern themselves with. As such, he becomes part of the problem, not part of the solution.

MG

[JSngry]

Did Fela do love songs for slow dancing?

I mean, yeah, I certainly love romance and ballads and all that good stuff, but "criticizing" the Gilles Peterson trip for being lacking in those things seems to me to be like criticizing a Concorde for not being a train. There's plenty of value in each, and if you want one at any given type, you don't reach for the other. I very much value variety in expression and perspective, and I got plenty of different things to reach for at any given moment, including the exquisite LTB.

As for "the poetry of life". I respectfully submit that said poetry is to be found anywhere and everywhere if one is willing to see/hear/feel/whatever the myriad forms of poetry that exist.

Personal preference is one thing, but extrapolating that into a denial of existence is something else.

[Sundog]

I picked this one up during the Tower liquidation. Have yet to give it a spin.

[JSngry]

It's only lost if you can't find it, and there's plenty of other places to find it.

Life is not one-stop shopping...

I know that; you know that; quite probably Gilles Peterson knows it; but it's not clear to me that their customers do. It's well possible that GP, whatever his taste and the breadth of his understanding, has been suborned by the Masters of Business and compelled to focus on what the ruling classes think that the masses should concern themselves with. As such, he becomes part of the problem, not part of the solution.

MG

You know, I went through that exact same mindet in the 70s, when I was at the height of my militant jazz purist social rebel mindset, and that was exactly what I said about all the soul-jazz and R&B. "Yeah, all these people are so busy dancing that they can't be bothered to fight the revolution." All those early 70s Prestige sides? Tools of The Man, that's what they were. If people were listening to that, there was no room left for the AEC, Ayler, Trane, etc. Dancing was the enemy of progress!

Well, yes. And no. In the end, it's the individual's responsibility to take what's out there and do with it what they will. Sure, The Man has his preferences & interests, and will promote them relentlessly and ruthlessly, but oh well. And sure, "most people" will take it at face value and keep on doing what they always do. But again, oh well.

This notion that "most people" are like they are because they've been manipulated has it backwards, I think. Most people are manipulated because they're like they are, and nothing, not you, not me, not Gilles Peterson suddenly using his role as "tastemaker" to promote avant-garde, or Ben Webster, or anything, is going to change that.

Remember the whole Linda Ronstadt/Nelson Riddle thing? THE RETURN OF ROMANCE!!! shouted the headlines. People were tired of the frenetic superficial life and were ready to re-discover a more substatial lifestyle based on flowers and intimate dinners and romantic phone calls at midnight and all that shit. Yeah, sure they were, and sure they did. But they did it like they do everything else - shallowly and more as "gesture" than actual act of committment. Do we actually live in a more "romantic" world now? Hell no.

The way that I look at is is this - if a cat is hipping me to some good shit, I'm taking it. Period. It's not my fault if he's part of a "bigger picture". That's got Jack Shit to do with the music, and the music is all I care about. What happens to/with the music after I get hipped to it is nobody's responsibility but mine. Once I have it, I can do with it as I see fit, and if I do nothing more than take it at face value and play along with The Man, that's my fuckup. I alos have the option of taking it and running to a different place with it, a place of my own making.

I've seen/experienced the results of this "well, it's fun - hell, it might even be good - but I'll not accept it as such because it's a tool" mindset as played out over a lifetime. I've seen too many people build up a shell around themselves that results in them not being able to enjoy the joys of simplicity, the pleasures of giddiness, the raw fun of...raw fun, just because they've convinced themself that such things are for "those other people".

Bullshit, I say! If you're "smart" enough to go deep, how "smart" are you if you can't go simple? Is it really smart to limit yourself to one end of the spectrum? Isn't that a form of reverse imprisonment? Give me all of it, simple (as opposed to simple-minded, although in rare instances I'll accept that as a quick-fix), complex, easy, difficult, blatant, nuanced, whatever. Why shouldn't I like it all? Who but me should decide what's for me?

Now I gotta be honest - I still don't have any Gilles Peterson comps, and still only know of him by name. But when/if I should check some of his offerings out, and if there's a buttload of stuff on there that I dig, what am I supposed to say - "well, er, ah, this is really nifty, but I'm going to refuse the offering because Gilles Peterson is a tool of The Man"? How fucked up is that?

No, "the masses" will always be the masses, and The Man will always be The Man. Neither you nor I nor the gods in the sky can do a damn thing about that. I refuse to let either of them dictate what I shouldn't like just as resolutely I refuse to let either of them dictate what I should like. Because if I do that, if I let anybody or any group of "forces" other than my own mind. body, and soul colour what I should or shouldn't get something out of, then I'm being manipulated just as much as anybody else, and the joke's on me if I think otherwise.

[JSngry]

No, "the masses" will always be the masses, and The Man will always be The Man. Neither you nor I nor the gods in the sky can do a damn thing about that. I refuse to let either of them dictate what I shouldn't like just as resolutely I refuse to let either of them dictate what I should like. Because if I do that, if I let anybody or any group of "forces" other than my own mind. body, and soul colour what I should or shouldn't get something out of, then I'm being manipulated just as much as anybody else, and the joke's on me if I think otherwise.

Don't usually quote myself, but...

Has anybody given consideration to the possibility that it's in The Man's interest to create this illusion that certain things are for certain types of people? And that it's just as much in The Man's interest to convince "smart people" that "simple thiings" are not for them as it is to convince "regular people" that "difficult things" are not relevant ot their lifestyle? Probably even moreso, because it's the "smart people" who are the true threat, since they understand The Man's true game.

Think about it - if all the "smart people" found themselves able to genuinely relate to "everybody else" on a cultural/human level instead of one that scolds and judges? What if all the "smart people" could throw down on the dance floor just as righteously as "everybody else"? What if all the "smart musicians" could approach "the masses" with a presentation not predicated on superiority of one kind or another? In other words, what if "smart people" all of a sudden refused to be ghettoized and just all of a sudden quietly (or otherwise) showed themselves to be not some quaint breed but just regular people like everybody else?

No, "smart people" are being manipulated just as much as "the masses". "Smart people" too often allow themselves to be convinced that they're "above" certain simple pleasures that any fool should be able to see belong to every-damn-body. "Smart people" too often serve as tools of The Man by refusing to play The Man's game instead of (re)claiming that game as rightfully their own just as much as anybody else's. "Smart people" wear their ghettoization as a badge of pride instead a mark of being fooled.

Divide & conquer is the oldest trick in the book. If The Man can divide us with our own acquiesence, whose fault is that?

Edited January 21, 2007 by JSngry

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Thanks Jim, you're right. And I myself say stuff like, "why should a man who can play incredible hard bop guitar be compelled to do so, if what he'd really prefer to do, and what he's always wanted to do, is sing smooth R&B songs? Just 'cos he's making millions instead of hundreds, doesn't mean he's selling out, if he's being true to himself."

And what I don't know with GP (as I do know with GB) is whether he's being true to himself. So, OK; no evidence; no reason to make judgements.

MG

[Simon Weil]

On Poetry thing...

I feel blocked by Peterson's sensibility. Like, when I heard him on the radio (in the mid-80s? At least just after he became "it"), the endless stream of "up" bop, salsa and whatever else just created a sense of no space (at least no space for me). Even though one could like the individual tracks, the lack of a moment to take breath became oppressive.

I think the poetry in life resides in those moments of space - maybe because poetry (in whatever of its forms) is kind of like a space in life. Like the place we have to go when we don't have to wonder about all the bills and whatever else.

But, in life these days, all we seem to wonder about is the bills as we wander round and round in ever tighter circles.

I think Peterson articulates that spirit and is kind of representative.

Simon Weil

[JSngry]

On Poetry thing...

I feel blocked by Peterson's sensibility. Like, when I heard him on the radio (in the mid-80s? At least just after he became "it"), the endless stream of "up" bop, salsa and whatever else just created a sense of no space (at least no space for me). Even though one could like the individual tracks, the lack of a moment to take breath became oppressive.

I think the poetry in life resides in those moments of space - maybe because poetry (in whatever of its forms) is kind of like a space in life. Like the place we have to go when we don't have to wonder about all the bills and whatever else.

But, in life these days, all we seem to wonder about is the bills as we wander round and round in ever tighter circles.

I think Peterson articulates that spirit and is kind of representative.

Simon Weil

Probably so, but there's a whole generation now who knows nothing but that. And it looks like it's going to be that way for a good while to come. For better or worse, that is the "new world", and it's going to be increasingly populated by people for whom what to us seems wholly unnatural is totally natural. I'd be surprised if those among them who are so inclined (and they'd be the same ones who would be so inclined in the world we grew up in) aren't finding there own space/poetry inside those ever tighter cicles.

People don't really change what they do, they just change how they do it.

[Simon Weil]

On Poetry thing...

I feel blocked by Peterson's sensibility. Like, when I heard him on the radio (in the mid-80s? At least just after he became "it"), the endless stream of "up" bop, salsa and whatever else just created a sense of no space (at least no space for me). Even though one could like the individual tracks, the lack of a moment to take breath became oppressive.

I think the poetry in life resides in those moments of space - maybe because poetry (in whatever of its forms) is kind of like a space in life. Like the place we have to go when we don't have to wonder about all the bills and whatever else.

But, in life these days, all we seem to wonder about is the bills as we wander round and round in ever tighter circles.

I think Peterson articulates that spirit and is kind of representative.

Simon Weil

Probably so, but there's a whole generation now who knows nothing but that. And it looks like it's going to be that way for a good while to come. For better or worse, that is the "new world", and it's going to be increasingly populated by people for whom what to us seems wholly unnatural is totally natural.

No, I don't think it's ever going to be natural. There's a reason all those religions have a day of rest. It may be that people won't be able to see a way to get to that, but that's a different thing.

I'd be surprised if those among them who are so inclined (and they'd be the same ones who would be so inclined in the world we grew up in) aren't finding there own space/poetry inside those ever tighter cicles.

People don't really change what they do, they just change how they do it.

No, I don't believe that either. I think the environment can become so oppressive it crushes the life out of people. Not everyone but some. But I think if people begin to speak out, that breaks the circle.

And if the poets have new ideas.

Simon Weil

[JSngry]

Well, ok, I guess we differ on that.

I wouldn't, however, rule out the notion of taking on circumstances on their own terms in order to turn them into a triumph rather than a defeat. There's a long & deep history of that throughout the history of humankind (including our beloved blues & jazz), and I see no reason for it to stop now. Some things never stop happening.

And I do have to wonder what's "natural" about living in a post-Industrial Age world. That's all any of us (here, any way) know, & we've done quite well at defining what is and isn't "natural", and if you presented it to the people of a pre-Industrial age, they'd look at you like you had sold your soul to the devil. And then some.

Times change people, and people change times. But the more things change...

[.:.impossible]

Well, ok, I guess we differ on that.

I wouldn't, however, rule out the notion of taking on circumstances on their own terms in order to turn them into a triumph rather than a defeat. There's a long & deep history of that throughout the history of humankind (including our beloved blues & jazz), and I see no reason for it to stop now. Some things never stop happening.

And I do have to wonder what's "natural" about living in a post-Industrial Age world. That's all any of us (here, any way) know, & we've done quite well at defining what is and isn't "natural", and if you presented it to the people of a pre-Industrial age, they'd look at you like you had sold your soul to the devil. And then some.

Times change people, and people change times. But the more things change...

Man, I was looking at a magazine last month that did a feature on 'green' mattresses. It was a slap in the f'ing face when I saw the price tag of a natural mattress. Where did humankind get so far off track that a mattress containing no artificial products cost 10x the price of the a mattress composed of mostly petroleum-based products? And when did that become the socially acceptable object to sleep on?

Try explaining the mattress of 2007 to your counterpart of a pre-Industrial era. It seems farcical.

[JSngry]

Try explaining the mattress of 2007 to your counterpart of a pre-Industrial era. It seems farcical.

For that matter, try explaining the notion of recorded music that you can hear at any place at any time as often as you like...

[.:.impossible]

I wonder, really really wonder, how we (the human race) got so far off track in such a short amount of time. Think about how complex the manufacture of a mattress has become.

My county has an award program for developers that build using sustainable, energy efficient and ecologically friendly techniques. Hopefully, your county does too, but what the hell???

We have to provide an incentive for people to be intelligent.

Good dog.

As a friend of mine sings, "Technology is in its terrible twos!"

[Man with the Golden Arm]

now if one could only harness the sustainable energy that at times is the byproduct of a good mattress.

[Man with the Golden Arm]

Fania Dj Series

Disco Uno

1 Vente Conmigo - Fania All Stars

2 Wata Wasuri - Tito Puente

3 Chinito Boogaloo - Rafael Cortijo Y Su Bonche

4 Rush Hour In Hong Kong - Louie Ramirez

5 Shades Of Time - Roberto Roena

6 Coco Seco - Bobby Valentin

7 Mi Mambo Conga - Eddie Palmieri

8 Ya Yi Ki - Johnny Colon

9 Mambo Jazz - Richie Ray And Bobby Cruz

10 Mambo De Bataan - Joe Bataan

11 Latin Soul Drive Is Here (Progreso Del Alma Latina) - Chollo Rivera

12 Tighten Up - Al Escobar

13 Freak Off - Orchestra Harlow

14 Acid - Ray Barretto

Disco Dos

1 Saona - Noro Morales Quintet

2 Lluvia Con Nieve - Mon Rivera

3 Sandstorm - Charlie Palmieri

4 Last Tango In Paris - Willie Rosario

5 Mambo Moderno - Vladamir

6 Vitamina - Kako's New York After Hours Orch

7 El Molestoso - Eddie Palmieri

8 El Rey Del Timbal - Tito Puente And His Concert Orchestra

9 The Oracle - Sabu Martinez

10 Manteca - Alegre Allstars

11 La Odisea De Tito - Tico Alegre Allstars

12 Ricardo Ray In Orbit - Ricardo Ray /Bobby Cruz

loooks goood!

Edited March 1, 2007 by Man with the Golden Arm