MLB 2008

[Dan Gould]

Hey Zen,

How much longer can they fucking keep Timlin around?

He's a motherfucking disaster who is beyond being "toast". You could put him in a decent Babe Ruth league and he'd get knocked around. He is so far past done its fucking pathetic. Its time for Theo to admit that he went to the well one time too many. Anyone who thinks this asshole can get it back together again is a fucking blind fool.

And now they say that Colon is out with "back stiffness". yeah, that's why he couldn't break a fucking pane of glass with that fucking junk. This is the fat fuck that kept everyone else from even making an offer in the spring. I can only presume that he did indeed make a pact with the Devil, only Lucifer already came calling for his immortal soul and now we're left with his stinking corpse. That could still feed a village in his country.

OK, that image went a little too far.

[papsrus]

Did you hear the comment during the broadcast of that game that Hank Steinbrenner had criticized the NL for not having the DH? ... This guy is a gem.

[Dan Gould]

Did you hear the comment during the broadcast of that game that Hank Steinbrenner had criticized the NL for not having the DH? ... This guy is a gem.

I've seen plenty of people - Yankee fans - complain that these games should feature the DH because AL pitchers are at "risk". But its a total fluke what happened - when was the last time an AL pitcher got a serious injury in interleague games? And what about the World Series? Its silly to have two rules and two different games (and I know Chuck hates the version that we watch and care about) but I think it actually makes sense to have the home team have an advantage - both now and in October.

Meantime, now they're calling Colon's problem "back spasms" which leaves me wondering what happened before that kept his "fastball" under 89? If its a "dead arm" period usually there's actual achiness that has to be worked out. It is really disconcerting that he looked so horrible. I have to hope that they put him on the DL, let Dice take his spot, and keep Masterson in the rotation. Justin has done nothing to make me think he isn't ready to compete against anyone (although if he's had any trouble, its the .500 slugging percentage he's given up to lefties - that could make Wednesday's matinee against the Phils a challenge.

But I still like the next two pitching matchups, Lester vs Moyer and Masterson vs someone named Kyle Kendrick whose ERA is over 4.5. If our starters perform, we can still take the series against the Phils. Heck, if this game was in Boston, we might have knocked Hamels around. Twice he got out of jams by striking out the comically bat-challenged Colon.

[Dan Gould]

I can't believe how the Mets handled the firing of Willie Randolph. Don't fire him in New York, make him get on a plane and fly to Anaheim. Don't fire him before the game, wait til they pull out a win, then fire him at the hotel, just after midnight local time, 3 AM in New York.

Mike Vaccarro really nailed it:

MIDNIGHT MASSACRE AN AMAZIN' ACT OF COWARDICE

By MIKE VACCARO

June 17, 2008 --

ANAHEIM – The e-mail was time-stamped 3:14 a.m., Eastern time. In a simpler time, in a different world, maybe the Mets would have succeeded completely in this cowardly purge of their baseball team. Maybe then they would have been able to hold off on telling everybody what they'd planned to do until long past their vessels in the media were fast asleep.

Ah, but there is this wonderful thing known as the Internet now, and here we are, telling you that while you were sleeping, at 3:14 a.m. New York time, at 12:14 a.m. California time, two hours after the Mets beat the Angels 9-6, the Mets finally got around to firing Willie Randolph.

Maybe that seems a simple proclamation. Maybe you think everyone knows about the Internet. Well, the men who run the Mets are quite obviously simple men, and sinister men, cowards cloaked in "no comments," who have seen the way their baseball team has performed this year obviously decided: People don't just need to be fired.

They need to be humiliated.

What a crowd, these bums are, all of them, from the Wilpons at the top to Omar Minaya down below, all of them who conspired to botch this firing worse than any firing has ever been botched. Ever. You wouldn't trust these guys to run a 7-11, let alone a National League baseball team. What a joke. What a cowardly, dastardly joke.

A midnight massacre.

A 3 a.m. thrashing.

Disgraceful. Utterly, completely, disgraceful.

And here's the ridiculous part: They could have gone through the transaction of what they did – firing Randolph, firing Rick Peterson, firing Tom Nieto, elevating Jerry Manuel and Ken Oberkfell and Luis Aguayo and Dan Warthen, at any time across the past few weeks and they would have been perfectly justified.

Hell, if they wanted to raze the whole staff last October, after the epic collapse of September, that would have been all right, too. You may not have agreed with it (although a loud segment of Mets fans surely would have). But that would have simply been a baseball decision. And the baseball was enough to warrant it.

This? This is unspeakable. These men couldn't have been fired in New York, before heading on a plane and flying 3,000 miles to their doom? They couldn't have been spared the ignominy of a public perp walk back east, their dignity thrown into their carry-on luggage?

Really?

Is this the best the Mets can do? Is this really what they are about? Can they really consider themselves a professional operation when they do the simplest task in sports, firing the manager, this wretchedly?

It's entirely possible that Randolph fell on his sword over this one, because it was being swirled that he would be spared and his coaches sacrificed, and if that indeed happened, we will laud him and praise him for that later on. Randolph was never going to be confused with John J. McGraw as a manager. But he wasn't J. Edgar Hoover as a person, either. We already knew that.

What we know now is that Randolph was so much better than the men he worked for, it's as if they were playing a different game in a different league. What a fiasco. What a joke. Less than two years after Game 7, less than nine months from opening their signature ballpark, the Mets reveal themselves, again, for what they've been for too long.

A cheap, unfunny joke.

Run by a miserable cast of miscreants. Good for Randolph, Peterson and Nieto. They may not know this, but their lot in life just got a bit brighter, getting away from this batch of bums.

I thought Randolph was a fool to bring up race as a reason why Mets broadcasts show him in his usual stoic, unemotional expression/body language. That's how Willie acts, and he learned it from Torre! Calling it racism was ridiculous. But leaving Willie to twist slowly in the wind, then making him fly to CA before firing him in the middle of the night was just pathetic.

Too bad Minaya is now, appropriately, on the chopping block. He's the one who stocked the roster with so much aged crap like Delgado and Alou. And with Randolph gone there's no one else to take the blame.

And one more thing: Jerry Manuel, the bench coach, takes over? How exactly does anything change then? He's got the same laid-back approach as Willie. If they want to change the season around and shake things up, they clear everyone out of that coaching staff and bring in someone totally new - the old Marlins manager, Gary Carter (who looked like a clown campaigning for the job) even Wally Backman getting a chance. You wanna change the atmosphere, then change the atmosphere!

[Chalupa]

The Mets fire Randolph after winning two games in a row. Nice timing.

[Chalupa]

I thought Randolph was a fool to bring up race as a reason why Mets broadcasts show him in his usual stoic, unemotional expression/body language. That's how Willie acts, and he learned it from Torre! Calling it racism was ridiculous. But leaving Willie to twist slowly in the wind, then making him fly to CA before firing him in the middle of the night was just pathetic.

Too bad Minaya is now, appropriately, on the chopping block. He's the one who stocked the roster with so much aged crap like Delgado and Alou. And with Randolph gone there's no one else to take the blame.

And one more thing: Jerry Manuel, the bench coach, takes over? How exactly does anything change then? He's got the same laid-back approach as Willie. If they want to change the season around and shake things up, they clear everyone out of that coaching staff and bring in someone totally new

Agree with all of this. There is plenty of blame to go around. Minaya and the players are just as blameworthy. Manuel has been the bench coach for the past 2 seasons - doesn't he deserve some of the blame too? Instead they reward him w/ Willie's job.

[Dan Gould]

Colon has been placed on the 15 day DL. But what is weird is that no one has said anything about the drop in velocity that was apparent before he wrenched his back swinging for the fences. On the Globe's Red Sox board, some people have claimed that the speed gun was miscalibrated at the start of the game, that Hamels was supposed to be throwing in the 80s too but I didn't see that. He was clearly throwing slower than before, in fact it looked very much like Schilling did a year ago when his velocity fell off the table, the Braves crushed him, and he went on the DL the next day.

And speaking of Schill, he's reached a "plateau" in his progress and will be examined by the team doctor tomorrow. I'd guess that he has reached a dead arm period and will need a week or two before he can resume throwing in the bullpen.

So Colon is out and Schilling is farther away, not closer to coming back. Good that Masterson will remain in the rotation, and Buchholz is showing improvement at Pawtucket. We've still got pitching depth, but not as much as we did.

[zen archer]

i didn't catch last nights game ,but i did see Colon swinging and Remy kept saying he hurt his back by swinging.

But the disable list ???....something else must be up ?

Dan, i agree about Timlin i think he is done !

I am surprised he even came back this year.

[Dan Gould]

i didn't catch last nights game ,but i did see Colon swinging and Remy kept saying he hurt his back by swinging.

But the disable list ???....something else must be up ?

Dan, i agree about Timlin i think he is done !

I am surprised he even came back this year.

They wanted him back! And based on his performance from July on, I understood that, but still knew that there was a significant risk that he'd have nothing left at all.

As for Colon, all they are saying is that the back is forcing him to the DL, but I am virtually certain that he was not right to begin with, before he took the crazy hacks. Who knows, maybe after 15 days and a rehab assignment, he can come back throwing 92 again. He showed that he could win with that stuff, but can he do it again or does he have a more serious elbow or shoulder problem?

[Dan Gould]

Well it looks like the Rays will beat the Cubbies in the first game of their set on the strength of their pitching and some timely hits, so that makes the Sox shut out of the Phils in Philadelphia all the more important, not to mention impressive. I just can't get over Lester's development - even though I've been expecting it. Today's line 7 IP, 6 H, 1 walk and 5 Ks. 40 pitches through the first two innings but got through seven on 59 more. 3.18 ERA on the season, and a .249 BAA.

And the Sox starters are really excelling right now. Lester, Beckett, Masterson and Wake have all pitched superbly for about three weeks, give or take, and Dice-K comes back on Saturday. If he resumes where he left off, look out AL.

[papsrus]

Well it looks like the Rays will beat the Cubbies in the first game of their set on the strength of their pitching and some timely hits, so that makes the Sox shut out of the Phils in Philadelphia all the more important, not to mention impressive. I just can't get over Lester's development - even though I've been expecting it. Today's line 7 IP, 6 H, 1 walk and 5 Ks. 40 pitches through the first two innings but got through seven on 59 more. 3.18 ERA on the season, and a .249 BAA.

And the Sox starters are really excelling right now. Lester, Beckett, Masterson and Wake have all pitched superbly for about three weeks, give or take, and Dice-K comes back on Saturday. If he resumes where he left off, look out AL.

Well, Percival certainly made things interesting. Man, that guy is a bag of nerves. He grooves it over the plate one pitch, over the catcher's head the next.

Longoria saved the day by bare-handing a squeeze attempt to tie the game in the top of the 9th and throwing the batter out at first to end the game.

... Percival though, holy shit ...

[papsrus]

Another exciting Rays win over the Cubs tonight. Man, what a game! Two in a row over the best team in baseball ... Looking for the sweep tomorrow with Shields on the bump (after a nice long rest).

5-4 ... Unreal game.

[Dan Gould]

Another exciting Rays win over the Cubs tonight. Man, what a game! Two in a row over the best team in baseball ... Looking for the sweep tomorrow with Shields on the bump (after a nice long rest).

5-4 ... Unreal game.

Fuckin' ridiculous. I can only hope the luck runs out tomorrow.

[papsrus]

Another exciting Rays win over the Cubs tonight. Man, what a game! Two in a row over the best team in baseball ... Looking for the sweep tomorrow with Shields on the bump (after a nice long rest).

5-4 ... Unreal game.

Fuckin' ridiculous. I can only hope the luck runs out tomorrow.

Percy made it interesting again, but seemed a little less wild than he was last night (thankfully).

[papsrus]

Rays agree to deal with No. 1 overall pick Tim Beckham. Took a little BP before tonight's game.

Woo-hoo!

[Dan Gould]

I'm going to be mother-fucking pissed if the Rays complete a sweep of the Cubs. 1-0 middle of 6.

I'll be M-F pissed both for the Cubs and the Sox.

[jlhoots]

Go Rays - just to be "perverse".

Hidden agenda - I'd like to see the Brewers gain another game on the Cubs.

[Dan Gould]

Un -motherfucking-believable.

The Cubs take a 3-1 lead and their best reliever, Marmol, goes walk, walk, hit batsman, hit batsman, gets yanked and all hell breaks loose.

When the fuck do the Rays leave Tampa? Ah, not til they pound Houston then take a lovely road trip to the Marlins and Pirates. Before they meet up with Boston at the Trop. They could fucking be in first place by the time the Sox move on to New York.

[papsrus]

Un -motherfucking-believable.

The Cubs take a 3-1 lead and their best reliever, Marmol, goes walk, walk, hit batsman, hit batsman, gets yanked and all hell breaks loose.

When the fuck do the Rays leave Tampa? Ah, not til they pound Houston then take a lovely road trip to the Marlins and Pirates. Before they meet up with Boston at the Trop. They could fucking be in first place by the time the Sox move on to New York.

Unreal. Crawford goes first-pitch slam and a 1-0 game at the end of the 6th is 8-3 at the end of the 7th. ... H - o - l - y s - h - i - t.

EDIT: small correction ... it was a 1-0 pitch.

Edited June 20, 2008 by papsrus

[zen archer]

Un -motherfucking-believable.

The Cubs take a 3-1 lead and their best reliever, Marmol, goes walk, walk, hit batsman, hit batsman, gets yanked and all hell breaks loose.

When the fuck do the Rays leave Tampa? Ah, not til they pound Houston then take a lovely road trip to the Marlins and Pirates. Before they meet up with Boston at the Trop. They could fucking be in first place by the time the Sox move on to New York.

Unreal. Crawford goes first-pitch slam and a 1-0 game at the end of the 6th is 8-3 at the end of the 7th. ... H - o - l - y s - h - i - t.

EDIT: small correction ... it was a 1-0 pitch.

The National League stinks , i mean the Sox just beat Philly without Manny and Ortiz and shuting them out in one game.

The fact that the Rays beat the Cubs doesn't surprise me , its just a matter of time before the Cubs implode especially

with Piniella the most overrated manager in the majors.

Though i will admit a Cubs Vs Red Sox world series would be great ...if the Cubbies could even win a game ?

[Dan Gould]

Though i will admit a Cubs Vs Red Sox world series would be great ...if the Cubbies could even win a game ?

News flash: I'd root for the Cubs in that scenario. Or else I would just sit back and enjoy the games, and change who I root for with each match-up. Ellsbury at first? Steal 2nd, kid! Papi, Manny, D-Lee, Fukudome, A-Ram at the plate? Muscle up, batter! Paps or Wood on the mound? Blow it by him!

But in all honesty, should the Cubs make the Series, I'd want them to win, specifically for my now ailing Father. Should the Cubs get there and lose to the Sox, there'd be a very tiny silver lining in a very dark cloud.

[Chalupa]

Bad news for the Sox..... Schilling done for season, possibly career.....

Schilling to undergo season-ending shoulder surgery

Associated Press

Updated: June 20, 2008, 11:51 AM ET

BOSTON -- Curt Schilling said Friday he's out for the season, and his career might be over, too.

The 41-year-old Boston Red Sox right-hander said Friday on radio station WEEI-AM he will have shoulder surgery next week.

Read the rest here.

Edited June 20, 2008 by J.H. Deeley

[zen archer]

Bad News ....BUT his doctor did say he would need surgery and the Sox balked.

You wonder if he had the surgery back in Feb. if he would be ready for the stretch drive ?

[Dan Gould]

They said Schilling reached a "plateau" in his bullpen work and was being evaluated Wednesday afternoon. When there was no information forthcoming, it was pretty obvious that the results weren't going to be encouraging. Turns out it was hardly a "plateau" it was a return of the debilitating pain, whenever he tried to increase the effort.

If Schilling had completed a comeback to the point of being an effective pitcher again, it would have been a big boost down the stretch. But I always viewed that as an extreme long shot - frosting on the cake as it were but not something to be remotely counted on.

So, we go forward with Beckett, Dice, Lester, Masterson, Wakefield and Buchholz + Colon, hopefully, in reserve. That still has to be the deepest group of starters of any contender.

[Dan Gould]

Bad News ....BUT his doctor did say he would need surgery and the Sox balked.

You wonder if he had the surgery back in Feb. if he would be ready for the stretch drive ?

Zen,

In his interview with WEEI, he spoke of the likelihood of two outcomes:

1) They tell him flat out that he'll never pitch again

2) They tell him he can pitch again but in terms of rehab, the work will be five times as hard as ever before

Curt basically expects to be told when he wakes up that they did this, this and this, with two of those things being only partially expected right now. There are really overwhelming odds that his injury would have ended his career anyway. And you can't say that delaying the surgery or throwing with the injury did anything to worsen it - the problems were there, the team just didn't see a chance he'd play this year if he went for surgery, so they pushed the rehab route.