Jazz Books in Dutch

[Niko]

I hope that some of the Dutch board members can help me here (others are invited as well !)... I will be moving to the Netherlands (Tilburg) in August and don't know the language yet... I will certainly take classes when the time comes and don't really have to learn it for my job, but ... earlier today I remembered that I basically learned English from reading Jazz books (assisted by more formal classes) and that this method really worked out for me back then... similarly, the only thing I do to keep up my French is the occasional Jazz book which is not available otherwise (San Quentin Jazz Band, or more recently Jean-Pol Schroeder's books on jazz in and around Liège)...

Thus I wondered: Can you recommend any books on Jazz which are only available in Dutch? I am more interested in history or biographies than in "the technical side", preferably with a focus on the period between about 1940 and 1990, either in Europe or in the US... The only Dutch jazz books I know are the Baker and Webster biographies by Jeroen de Valk - I know the English translation, otherwise those would be exactly what I am looking for...

[Cyril]

Niko, there's another book by Jeroen de Valk (only in Dutch).

  

And a good book written by Coen de Jonge, "Belevenissen in bebop: Rein de Graaff".

It's hard to find. I have some more Dutch jazz Books, but these are out of print (OOP).   

[Cyril]

'Jazz' by Jules Deelder. (Only second hand)

[Big Beat Steve]

Niko, no doubt you are familar with (and own) one or the other edition of Joachim Ernst Berendt's "Jazzbuch".
This book did exist in Dutch. I have the Dutch version of the original 1953 edition (bought on a whim at a "vintage fleamarket" im Amsterdam close to 20 years ago).

So if you would also like to go the "comparison" route to learn Dutch after all (sometimes it helps - I know it has helped me in similar setups with other languages), drop me a line and I will be happy to mail it to you. I don't really need it actually and it is just taking up space in my crate of music books and mags for sale.

On a jazz-related aspect, just in case you are interested in Rhythm & Blues to some extent you may remember a reissue series of Mercury masters done by Polygram in the early 90s ("Back Beat - The Rhythm of the Blues").

A Dutch book to accompany this series (and elaborate on the subject) written and compiled by Eddy Determeyer was published at the time by Van Hoeve publishers: "Back Beat - De Gouden Jaren van de Rhyhtm & Blues". To the extent that I can cope with reading Dutch (more or less ... ;-) ) it really is very well done as an introduction to the subject.
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Niko]

@cyril: thanks - this is exactly what I was asking for... it leads me into a related question: Where do I buy used Dutch books (online)?

Edited May 8, 2016 by Niko

[Cyril]

Yes online. You can go to this: https://www.boekwinkeltjes.nl/b/151286965/Belevenissen_in_bebop/

Or: https://www.bol.com/nl/p/belevenissen-in-bebob-jazzpianist-de-gra/666785061/

I have this (also second hand) http://www.indeknipscheer.com/hans-dulfer-jazz-in-china-dulfers-dumdum/

Good luck !

[Niko]

@big beat steve: remembering your knowledge of ancient issues of orkester journalen etc, I thought of you when I wrote "others are invited as well"... will drop you a line (of course, I know the book, grew up with 1989 edition but only have an edition from around 1970 at this point...) - and thanks for "Eddy Determeyer"

[Big Beat Steve]

@Niko:

Orkester Journalen is Swedish ... different call ...

If you can find original copies of DE JAZZ WERELD, consider yourself lucky.

As for Berendt's book (I grew up with the 1974 issue, BTW, which I still have - in addition to the 1953 and 1959 issues), if you only have the 1970 issue at this time then the 1953 issue (which was the 1st edition, actually) should be sufficiently different. But of course reading differnt language versions of identical issues side by side is not the worst way of learning some basics the easy way (or just using the German edition to crosscheck what you think you understood), and even those older editions aren't hard to get secondhand.

 

[Niko]

Thanks! I had reserved Harry Potter for reading something highly familiar in Dutch but Behrendt will do as well (and right now I can easily get all the old editions before 1989 at the library which still holds many treasures from back when we still had "jazz education" around here - luckily, the folks back then were smart enough to keep all the old versions). (And I knew that Orkester Journalen is not Dutch - just wanted to highlight that you seem to read many of the European languages from what you write here)

@Cyril: thanks, order placed!

[Big Beat Steve]

55 minutes ago, Niko said:

And I knew that Orkester Journalen is not Dutch - just wanted to highlight that you seem to read many of the European languages from what you write here

 

Very flattering ... but my reading and writing knowledge of Swedish is FAR superior to that of Dutch. I can cope with reading Dutch as it does have its similarities with German but still it is a struggle ...

 

BTW, do your musical interests also extend beyond jazz (even if only in a casual way)?
Just in case you ever feel like delving into some specifically Dutch part of rock history, you are likely to come across those "Indo" rock bands from the late 50s and early/mid-60s. "Rockin' Ramona" (the title obvously referring to that worldwide MONSTER hit by the Blue Diamonds) by Lutgard Mutsaers (SDU uitgeverij, 's-Gravenhage 1989) is a nice book on this subject.

Edited May 8, 2016 by Big Beat Steve

[Niko]

With Dutch, I have the suspicion that actually speaking it will be the biggest challenge (followed by writing) while reading texts in Dutch without any formal training or much exposure works out surprisingly well... my musical interests are fairly broad  - and I especially like reading stories about bands (even beyond what I actually listen to) so any good music book is welcome advice. (In this case, there's a further appeal since both my parents and grandparents spent several years in Indonesia)... Thanks!

[corto maltese]

In the 1980s there have been several issues of the Jazzjaarboek (Yearbook of Jazz), that would fit the bill very nicely. Although relatively small format books, they covered a broad spectrum (mainstream to free) with essays, reviews, interviews, etc. You can find used copies quite easily and they're not expensive (usually less than 10 euro).

[njtw]

Here are some more Dutch jazz biographies:

Rita Reys - Lady Jazz

https://www.bol.com/nl/p/rita-reys/1001004002097532/

 

Ann Burton - Blue Burton

https://www.bol.com/nl/p/blue-burton/666851877/

 

[Cyril]

And some more:

Niko, you can find good jazz books at flea markets and second hand stores.

[njtw]

Here's another interesting book:

I'm The Beat (of De Korte Beentjes van Art Blakey) by Max Bolleman, Dutch jazz musician, engineer & producer.

See this website: http://www.draaiomjeoren.com/boeken/imthebeat.html

[page]

Hey Niko,
moving to Tilburg? That's nice. I like the area and the people in that part of the country seem to have warm attitude by nature. Lovely cities and countryside. Hope you'll enjoy living there! Do you mean books about Dutch jazz and or musicians or books in Dutch about general jazz subjects? You have had much advice already, so not sure I'll be able to add new material. I'd prefer second hand books myself and you can always become of a member of the public library. You'll be able to lend music as well, from the National selection. I can highly recommend it. Really nice that you want to learn Dutch by reading jazz book. I have one family member who learned most Dutch because of Dutch songs. I think it really helps when you use something that has your interest, it helps to learn quicker. "Toi, toi, toi" for luck (that's a Dutch 'good luck'- wish usually used in the theatre/artist circle) for your efforts!
regards, page

[Big Beat Steve]

3 hours ago, page said:

 I think it really helps when you use something that has your interest, it helps to learn quicker. "Toi, toi, toi" for luck (that's a Dutch 'good luck'- wish usually used in the theatre/artist circle) for your efforts!
 

VERY true! I made huge and fast progress in learning English at school when I was in my "soccer" phase at age 13-14 and literally DEVOURED English soccer mags that I had gotten hold of.

And half of the progress I made in learning to read and write in Swedish came from my Swedish jazz books and mags (the other half came from classic car magazines )

Have been trying for some time to get my son to go the same way in learning French in a more entertaining way (by buying him the occasional Heavy Metal music mag when I am over in France) but this is only now beginning to show some results - he even bought himself a rock guitar tuition manual in French when we were on holiday in France recently.

BTW, "toi toi toi" is in common use in German too - in the same sense.

[Cyril]

15 hours ago, njtw said:

Here's another interesting book:

I'm The Beat (of De Korte Beentjes van Art Blakey) by Max Bolleman, Dutch jazz musician, engineer & producer.

See this website: http://www.draaiomjeoren.com/boeken/imthebeat.html

Good book, njtw !!!

There is a good jazz club in Tilburg called the 'PaRaDox' , see: https://paradoxtilburg.nl/

And not far from Tilburg in Belgium (Rijkevorsel) you have also a very good club, 'The Singer': https://www.desinger.be/

And don't forget jazz Middelheim (Belgium): http://www.jazzmiddelheim.be/line-up

Enjoy!

 

Edited May 28, 2016 by Cyril

[Niko]

"books about Dutch jazz and or musicians or books in Dutch about general jazz subjects" both actually... thank you all for the further ideas - I will definitely try used bookstores once I am there (only three months left), and also the public library! And special thanks to Big Beat Steve for the first edition of the Jazz Book in Dutch! Some things are familiar from later editions but this competition between "blanke" and "zwarte" musicians was not laid out that clearly later on ...

[Niko]

On 5/10/2016 at 5:10 AM, njtw said:

Here are some more Dutch jazz biographies:

Rita Reys - Lady Jazz

https://www.bol.com/nl/p/rita-reys/1001004002097532/

 

Ann Burton - Blue Burton

http://www.ann-burton.com/images/boekvk003.JPG

https://www.bol.com/nl/p/blue-burton/666851877/

 

it's been a decade but I've read both of these books this year... the second one about Ann Burton is interesting because it's clearly not written by a jazz fan - so, not by someone for whom discography is second nature - just by a normal fan who really liked the records and was interested in the person behind them... it's a fine book. Interestingly, the same author had apparently been planning to write a book about Rita Reys but then learned about the second book in this post being in planning (or some story like this). This week I found the Rita Reys book and read it within a few days, it combines Reys' autobiography with commentary by jazz journalist Bert Vuijsje, so every chapter has Reys talking and then Vuijsjie providing context... which works really well, Vuijsje can provide the stuff for the jazz nerds (like first husband Wessel Ilcken jamming with people like Allen Eager...) while Reys' often opinionated voice comes out clearly in the other parts... [for instance, she recounts the story how her husband/pianist Pim Jacobs was chosen as best pianist of the festival in Antibes 1960 and Martial Solal was really annoyed about it... Yes, of course, Solal may have been the better soloist she says, but that's not all that counts in a piano player...]

Another book I read not long ago was the autobiography of trumpeter Ado Broodboom, also cowritten with Vuisje, but this time in a more integrated approach... That book also comes with a nice cd (and for me it has the added bonus that Broodboom's youth was in the Amsterdam neighborhood where I am living, moved here from Tilburg four years ago); the book's mentioned in Cyril's first post are also nice, the John Engels I read when my knowledge of the language and jazz history were too limited so I should probably re-read... Rein de Graaff's book is priceless just for the memories of his 1967 New York holiday, sitting in with people like Elvin Jones, Lee Morgan and Hank Mobley... but the rest is interesting as well... 

hope to run into the Bolleman and Boy Edgar books next... 

 

Edited July 27 by Niko

[Big Beat Steve]

Now that you bring up this topic again, I realize a lot of water has passed under the bridges of the Rhine, Maas, Schelde (whatever ... ) and I've become aware of a few others (for what they are worth ...). And maybe you already have these but i figured it might be useful to mention them here anyway:

1) Are you familiar with the Chet Baker biography by Jeroen de Valk: "Chet Baker, herinneringen aan een lyrisch trompettist", Uitgeverij Van Gennep, Amsterdam - (which for you others translates as "Chet Baker - Remembering a lyrical trumpeter")?
I don't know how this book compares with other Chet Baker biographies. I got the German translation of this book (published by Oreos) last year from that jazz collection estate that yielded me LOTS of other books (plus many LPs and CDs ) but must admit I have not yet started seriously on it. Browsing through it I have my doubts about the overall quality of the German translation (which often happens, alas). One sore spot that struck me was that at one point the text dwelt on Chet's search for drugs to take care of his addiction, and he ended up being given access to some under the counter by a pharmacist who happened to be a fellow jazz musician (saxophonist Jacques Pelzer, no less!), and this happened in the Belgian town of "LUIK" - as it says in the GERMAN text  ! Which had my hair stand on end because as you know too this is the town of "Lüttich" in German, or "Liège" (in French and internationally). "Luik" is correct in Flemish or Dutch, but in GERMAN?? It's not exactly a small town in Belgium (and not THAT far away from the German border), so how can anyone handling languages professionally be so clueless? Such hiccups are not relevant to the Dutch original, of course, but this does not bode well for other finer points that may need some general background knowledge to be translated correctly ...

 

2) The below pocket book is one I bought for a few euros in a local antiquarian book shop early last year. It was just about the only one of interest in their music book corners. They had gotten in a decent collection of jazz books not long before, but even those that I otherwise might have picked up for "casual reading" were priced too high. It was written by A. Heerkens, has 64 pages and was published by ARTI (Alkmaar) in about 1960 as part of the "Beeldencyclopedie" series. A book for the general public and definitely non-essential, but it has a few photographs that are not all that common (which was the reason I took it home). And if found cheaply at a fleamarket or so it might be fun just to read some more on jazz in general terms in the Dutch language. (Too bad I was not aware of that book in 2016, or else it would have been a nice recommendation as another INTRODUCTORY reading course into the Dutch language via jazz )

 

3) The below one is another one I found a few years ago - a sort of pictorial history book, and reference book on what happened on the concert scene there  (about 100 pages, Dutch text for your reading pleasure , and many brilliant photographs:

It's the kind of illustrated music history books I usually buy sight unseen.

 

4)  And since only relatively few photographs in this book are by the legendary Ed van der Elsken, his below book might be worth mentioning too (though you may already have it because it is a "cult" book among this sort of photo books) 
This is not the the "Jazz" photo retrospective of the work of Ed van der Elsken published by Nieswand in Germany in the 90s but the Dutch original of his 1959 book of the same title (with only relatively few overlaps of the contents with the Nieswand book).
I guess originals are rare and expensive (originals of the 1959 German edition of this ( "foto jazz") definitely are costly!). But about 20 years ago a very accurate facsimile reprint of this book appeared on the market by a publisher linked to or sponsored by no less than Karl Lagerfeld! Everything (including the unaltered Dutch text) is as in the original and except for the barcode on the rear cover there is hardly anything to distinguish it from the original edition. Nice ... 

Maybe all this might be useful to you or others . 

 

 

 

Edited July 27 by Big Beat Steve

[Niko]

thanks!  the de Valk book about Baker I've known for many years in the English translation. That translation was done by the authors himself and had, of course, the advantage that English quotes by Baker and others could be given in the original without translation... by now there is also an expanded edition of the English version (but not the others iirc)

It's one of my favorite jazz books, I'm a big fan... that said, the city is also called Luik in the English edition and I agree there is no good reason for this (even though, I guess in English it's slightly more ambiguous than in German which word to use...). As a side note, the fact that already in the mid-50s all those Belgians like Rene Thomas, Bobby Jaspar, Benoit Quersin were on drugs from Pelzer's pharmacy is a recurring topic, it also shows up in the Rita Reys and Ado Broodboom books.... I forgot where I read this but somewhere it said that at some point (in the 80s? 90s?) the pharmacies in Liege got a new inspector, one of Pelzer's adversaries in the profession... and that turned out to be quite a problem. I can imagine, after several decades of supplying friends with hard drugs... That "One Night Stand" book looks nice, will have to watch out for it.... and yes, the van der Elsken is still on the long-term shopping list... 

Edited July 27 by Niko

[Big Beat Steve]

Interesting to read your comments, Niko. 
So the Baker bio apparently is one of some renown even compared to others. But the author fell into the "Luik" trap too? I'll cut him some slack there because as the author he may have taken things for granted that he shouldn't (the name of that town commonly used in the English-speaking world is "Liège" - never mind if some out there pronounce it like "Leech" or in other strange ways ). Let's hope he did better in other respects where cross-cultural/cross-national differences would have to be taken into account for a GOOD and fitting translation.  At any rate, I'll keep your endorsement of that biography in mind when I get around to reading it (hoping the German translator did not make too awkward a job of it).

Jacques Pelzer's pharmacy as a source of supply for Belgian musician addicts is puzzling ... and difficult to understand. Particularly if he carried on for decades, as you indicate. (Is there a written and published biography of Jacques Pelzer out there, BTW?  I wonder how ANY author and editor would manage to deal with clearly not too trivial aspects like this ...)

BTW, the Ed van der Elsken "Jazz" book of 1959 (reprint) can sometimes be found on eBay or Abebooks for less than 20 EUR (the original shop price). Same for the expanded book of his jazz photos published in the 90s (I just saw the edition by Nieswand was preceded by a Dutch edition). So it pays to be on the lookout (avoiding the totally overpriced offers for these "reissues", of course). 

Edited July 27 by Big Beat Steve

[Niko]

regarding Liege/Luik I would give de Valk the benefit that for him the city is certainly called Luik ... and I'd say he did by and large a wonderful job translating his book into English.... and let's not forget that it's the Belgians that made a mess of things by not settling on a single name for the city, de Valk only came later... I've been wondering whether these Pelzer stories are true... I don't even know whether he always had the pharmacy - he sure had it in the 50s but later I don't know for certain... Jean Paul Schroder is the author who knows most about that scene, he's written a biography of Jaspar, a history of Jazz in Liege and also many of the relevant entries in the dictionary of Wallonian jazz are by him (all in French, the latter two books I briefly checked - looked like Schroder was quite discrete...). Belgian addicts is one topic, but there are also all those Americans who decided to settle in the area for a while, Jon Eardley (who recorded an obscure album with Pelzer), J.R. Monterose, Art Taylor and, of course, Baker... not claiming they all had the same reason... at the very least, there is a story to tell

[Big Beat Steve]

Yes, that Flemish/Wallonian language mixup in Belgium can indeed be a can of worms ... 
As for Jacques Pelzer, the French Wikipedia page on him says he had a parallel career as a pharmacist and a jazz musician. But that's all.
I looked up info about that book about jazz in Liège by Jean-Pol Schroder. Maybe our federal state library has a copy or one can be obtained through interlibrary loan. Not so much because of Pelzer, but these regional histories sometimes are surprisingly informative. They add a lot to the broader picture. 
Good luck with finding copies at affordable prices of the other books you are interested in.