Chuck Nessa Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 First thing to know is Wang is of Norwegian descent. The name was pronounced Vong, but the family gave up that fight years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Gotcha. So what's the second? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Gotcha. So what's the second? Some info here. I last saw Dick and his wife at a Roscoe Mitchell large ensemble gig at the Velvet Lounge at the end of June. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhodes Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 I posted a link to this thread on the Saturn listserv and got two interesting responses that I am forwarding below. Robert Campbell is one of the founders of the Red Saunders Research Foundation, one of the authors of From Sonny Blount to Sun Ra: The Chicago Years and the author of "Earthly Recordings", the definitive Sun Ra discography. Ted Panken is a WKCR (Columbia University radio) producer. I'm interseted in this thread but I have not been well enough to participate. To be sure, it is easy to overstate Sun Ra's influence on a lot of things...I've been debating the Coltrane-Ra, Coltrane-Gilmore piece with Prof. Campbell and others on the list for more than 10 years. That said, I think some of the dismissals of such an influence that came up in this thread were too pat. In particular, I'm inclined to side with Campbell regarding Phil Corhan and Alvin Fiedler. For instance, from what I've read Corhan was in no sense peripheral to the AACM and that his presence pointed towards a real Ra influence on the newer collective. The devil would be in the detail of how substantive. There's more...perhaps a lot more...but this is all I can handle now. courtesy ted panken ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Feb 25, 2008 2:02 PM Subject: Re: [wkcrjazz] sun ra & art ensemble of chicago To: lovolution@gmail.com I'm not registered at organissimo, but if you want to forward this to somone who can post it there, feel free. 1. Sun Ra recruited his early rehearsal bands extensively from DuSable (hence Captain Dyett) alumni -- John Gilmore, Pat Patrick, Davis, Robert Barry, etc. It makes sense that he would have -- they were well-trained and used to functioning under discipline. He had connections to Chicago's educational infrastructure, and was well-known amongst Chicago's musicians as an eccentric who could play. Richard Davis told me the same story about playing with Sun Ra in the Calumet City strip clubs. Herbie Hancock talks about him. So does Ahmad Jamal. So did the late Chris Anderson. So does Bill Lee. So did Johnny Griffin, Von and Red Holloway. Leroy Jenkins was aware of him, and Henry Threadgill has mentioned hearing Sun Ra rehearse at some lounge or bar not far from his house when he was a teenager. I'm also under the impression Braxton was aware of him during those years as well. That doesn't make Sun Ra a direct influence on the Art Ensemble or any other AACM formations that were crystallizing in the '60s, but I do get the impression that some essence of Sun Ra's mythopoeic narrative tropes -- please forgive the phrase -- remained in Black Chicago culture. ...and from Robert Campbell... To follow up a little on this topic... My understanding is that Roscoe Mitchell got back to Chicago in 1962. By then, Sun Ra was gone (he'd left at the end of July 1961 to go to Montreal). John Gilmore, Marshall Allen, and Ronnie Boykins had left town with him and ended up staying in New York. Pat Patrick had been in New York City since around New Year's 1960; he rejoined the Arkestra when Sunny arrived there in October 1961. Since the Arkestra wasn't traveling much in the 1961-1965 period, I doubt that Mitchell had a whole lot of opportunities to encounter John or Pat or Marshall or Ronnie in Chicago in those days. Of course, Chicago was still full of Ra alumni. Walter Strickland and Billy Mitchell had gone to Montreal with Sunny but not continued to New York; Ricky Murray had decided not to stay in New York. Art Hoyle was back in town after deciding not to rejoin Sunny in New York. Billy Howell went to New York to play with the Arkestra for a short while and came back. James Spaulding was about to move back to Indianapolis, but may still have been in town when Roscoe Mitchell returned. Lucious Randolph and Nate Pryor were around, though playing only part-time. Robert Barry and Bugs Cochran were active, and so was Jim Herndon. More to the point... One of those Sun Ra alumni was Phil Cohran, who became a founding member of the AACM. Alvin Fielder, who played drums in Roscoe Mitchell's quartet for a while, had played with the Arkestra in 1958 and 1959. Even Malachi Favors had been participated in several rehearsals, and made at least one gig with the Arkestra, back in 1957. Keep traveling the Spaceways, Robert Campbell PS. The Arkestra's appearances at the Wonder Inn (1960-1961) were, according to a number of sources, heavily attended by musicians. Phil Cohran said once that while imitators of John and Marshall and Pat's playing were not heard while Sunny was still in town, they sprung up remarkably quickly as soon as he and the Arkestra had departed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jostber Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 Don't know if this has been posted: http://www.dpo.uab.edu/~moudry/ra&aacm.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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